Japan Push Italy to the Brink

[Canadian_Rugger]

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_7100288,00.html

31-24 was the final score in from what I can account from the article was a cracking good game. I believe Japan is going to surprise a few people at this world cup, and I believe Canada is going to have a very difficult time getting a victory over them.

 

[AfakasiAssasin]

It was a good game. Italy started off well and their set piece dominated all night. Their new half back combination of Edoardo Gori and Riccardo Bocchino combined pretty well too. Japan though played exceptional in defeat. While they couldnt match the Italians at the set piece, they showed slick handling and moves through their backline and showed very positive signs leading up to the RWC. Though as I said the Italians dominated the set piece and its something they're going to have to work on if they want to put on a good showing at the RWC. Still a very competitive and entertaining encounter and a very positive showing by the Japanese.

 

[psychic duck]

it's results like this that make me annoyed that Georgia has not even had one match against a team ranked above them

Georgia have clearly been better than the rest of the teams in Europe over the past four years (they have only lost three matches against international teams: Canada, Romania and Namibia once and against Namibia they had a massively weakened team so that doesn't really count, and even in the other two matches they didn't have their Top 14 players playing)

they should have at least have one match a year against a team ahead of them in the rankings, against teams such as Italy, Scotland, Samoa, Fiji, Tonga, Argentina, Japan and Wales

yet in four years they haven't had even one match against any opposition ranked higher than them (not even Japan)

teams like Wales, Scotland and Ireland play New Zealand every year and the same old predictable result happens each time, it didn't surprise me when the Celtic nations had poor crowd turnouts to their matches last Autumn (although overcharging was probably more to blame, especially in Ireland's case)

I believe after this Japan result, Georgia (or the winner of 6 nations B tournament) deserve a chance to play the wooden spoon nation in the 6 nations in a promotion/relegation home/away playoff

 

[Wally]

it's results like this that make me annoyed that Georgia has not even had one match against a team ranked above them

Georgia have clearly been better than the rest of the teams in Europe over the past four years (they have only lost three matches against international teams: Canada, Romania and Namibia once and against Namibia they had a massively weakened team so that doesn't really count, and even in the other two matches they didn't have their Top 14 players playing)

they should have at least have one match a year against a team ahead of them in the rankings, against teams such as Italy, Scotland, Samoa, Fiji, Tonga, Argentina, Japan and Wales

yet in four years they haven't had even one match against any opposition ranked higher than them (not even Japan)

teams like Wales, Scotland and Ireland play New Zealand every year and the same old predictable result happens each time, it didn't surprise me when the Celtic nations had poor crowd turnouts to their matches last Autumn (although overcharging was probably more to blame, especially in Ireland's case)

I believe after this Japan result, Georgia (or the winner of 6 nations B) deserve a chance to play the wooden spoon nation in the 6 nations in a promotion/relegation home/away playoff

That would be sick. Georgia, Romania and Russia are probably some way off from challenging the Six Nation sides, but they deserve some Autumn tour matches to say the least.

 

[psychic duck]

Georgia, Romania and Russia are probably some way off from challenging the Six Nation sides, but they deserve some Autumn tour matches to say the least.

Georgia are well ahead of Romania and Russia currently, I don't think Georgia would necessarily beat Italy in the 6 Nations playoff but until they deserve the chance to play at that level and I believe that with Georgia at full strength it would be a close match and not a waste of time 35+ point thrashing

 

[AfakasiAssasin]

Georgia are well ahead of Romania and Russia currently, I don't think Georgia would necessarily beat Italy in the 6 Nations playoff but until they deserve the chance to play at that level and I believe that with Georgia at full strength it would be a close match and not a waste of time 35+ point thrashing

Send them to play the Islands in the Pacific. I think Georgia and Romania are at a level where I think on their day, can be at least competitive with the Pacific Islands. Im sure they would be welcomed as the Islands hardly get, if any touring Nations so I think it would be beneficial to all parties. If not the Islands, what about Japan, USA, Canada or somewhere in South America?

 

[Toko_11]

psychic duck. Great point

Wally. I disagree with you. The gap between Georgia and Italy/Scotland isn't that big(but we have to prove that in september)

AfakasiAssasin. We beat Tonga 10 years ago and I believe that today our national team is ten times stronger than it was back then. The only reason why the Islanders are able to stay stronger than Georgia is because they get to play(at least) each other year after year... you have Pacific nations cup while we have... Pathetic nations cup(no offense intended towards anyone)

but it is pathetic because we are playing countries where rugby is less popular than spitting contest. while in Georgia the sport is almost at its peak. Georgian reserves have been winning the tournament for more than three years now... but unlike other sports in rugby you have to play in your own world for 50 years until you are allowed to play at a higher level. Isn't that how it works ?
I was thinking maybe we should find a new board... name it Geo-aer or something.

 

[Thingimubob]

I'd love to see Georgia given a crack at a 6N relegation/promotion decider, hell I'd even welcome them into an expanded 7 Nations. Problem is, it took ages for Italy to be let in, so could be the same for Georgia. Italy had to prove they could beat the established nations, they beat teams like France and Ireland (even winning a 2 match tour there in the 90's) in the run up to their addmitance into the tournament, so Georgia have to prove they can do the same.
However, since Wales should have an A Team up and running soon, could see a proper A Team 6 Nations be made, would definitely be worth letting Georgia into that. There's going to be plenty of class players in there, and would be worth it for all involved, especially since the Churchill Cup isn't on anymore.

 

[AfakasiAssasin]

psychic duck. Great point

AfakasiAssasin. We beat Tonga 10 years ago and I believe that today our national team is ten times stronger than it was back then. The only reason why the Islanders are able to stay stronger than Georgia is because they get to play(at least) each other year after year... you have Pacific nations cup while we have... Pathetic nations cup(no offense intended towards anyone)

but it is pathetic because we are playing countries where rugby is less popular than spitting contest. while in Georgia the sport is almost at its peak. Georgian reserves have been winning the tournament for more than three years now... but unlike other sports in rugby you have to play in your own world for 50 years until you are allowed to play at a higher level. Isn't that how it works ?
I was thinking maybe we should find a new board... name it Geo-aer or something.

While I disagree that that is the ONLY reason the Pacific Nations are stronger than Georgia, as I said I do agree that Georgia need and deserve to play higher lever teams than what they are now. As I said, why not travel to the Islands? They've been crying out for teams to come and play in the Islands besides the teams that play in the Pac 4 nations so, while they wouldnt be paid much if at all, They would be welcomed to come and play a few tests or even a full tour of the Islands. Georgia is a rugby nation that has continued to rise since qualifying for the 2003 RWC. I also hear they get very healthy crowds (between 10 and up to 30 thousand sometimes) going to see their home games so there is big interest in the sport in Georgia. As I said I agree, they do need and deserve better competition, though I do think the 6 nations is probably too big for them atm.

What I would like to see happen would be an annual tournament held every 4 years (starting two years after a RWC so it would gap in between) that would consist of only the tier 2 nations Samoa, Tonga, Fiji, Japan, USA, Canada, Georgia, Romania. I would like to include the next best African nation (likely Namibia), the second best Asian nation (likely Korea or Hong Kong), the next best European nation (Russia, Portugal or Spain) and the best South American nation outside of Argentina (Likely Uruguay) play the next best Pacific Nation (Cook Islands or PNG) to qualify. Thats 12 teams so I would have the format being two pools of 6 and have the top team in each pool to play each other to see who is the winner of the Tier 2 cup. If not then just have Samoa, Tonga, Fiji, Japan, USA, Canada, Georgia, Romania in a two pool format of 4 teams with each team playing 3 games. Then have the top two teams in each pool play each other in a semi final and final to find out a winner. Keep the teams in their respective competitions (Pacific nations cup, European Nations Cup and whatever replaces the Churchill cup) but have this tournament replace them the year that it is on. I think it would be great as it would make for some enthralling rugby, give the Nations outside the Tier 1 something to aim for other than the RWC and giving each other more regular decent competition.

 

[Me 1]

Wales are touring Japan in 2013, perhaps they could play Georgia on the way?

 

[LittleGuy]

@ Psychic, the Georgians have had a couple of games against Canada, I think at certain times Canada has been rated a fraction higher than them in the IRB rankings, but I agree they should be getting some tier one oppositon, their forward pack is incredible.

As for Italy, I really like Gori he is a player who's stock is on the rise, perhaps next time Italy will not take Japan so lightly. The States is in real tough in Tokyo next week, Japan at home is pretty good, and the squad has had quite a bit of time to gel.

@Afaski, I love that idea, it would be great to see a well done tier two/three competition, it would also give the fans of each respective country a chance to cheer on our own teams to win a large competition that would still be tough as hell to win.

 

[Toko_11]

AfakasiAssasin we are not even asking for 6 nations playoff all we want is a test match, or a couple of test matches against 6N teams every year... playing pacific islands would be great but i don't know how its possible. top 14 teams are always hesitant when it comes to letting the players go for the tests. our rugby union barely manages to bring the team together once a year for one week or so. that is why we prefer to play two tests against European sides rather than playing whole tournament which can take weeks. traveling is also a big problem. we played on the nations cup and Churchill cup but those tournaments aren't much help because Georgian A side always ends up playing it. our Top14 based players cant play... but the french teams wont be able to hold players when they see that we have a test match against Scotland/Italy/Wales/Ireland because those games would be very important unlike the games against Namibia and Argentina Z(which by the way are no help at all since our reserve team can beat them) I would love to see Georgia play Tonga, Fiji or Samoa but I can't really see us Going all the way down under. although if you guys go on tour in Europe, everyone would love to see you play in Georgia. I'm sure at least 35000 fans will attend the game against any of the pacific nations teams.
PS our biggest Test match in the last four years was a game against Canada back in November

 

[Nielsch]

I really hope Georgia can cause one or two upsets at the World Cup. That might leave those old IRB sods scratching their ugly heads.

 

[Jayatron]

The IRB need to rethink the status of international teams such as Japan, Samoa and Georgia. The only thing I can think of that would hold back Georgia is their lack of a professional domestic league. Unless I am uninformed and Georgia do.

 

[Toko_11]

The only thing I can think of that would hold back Georgia is their lack of a professional domestic league. Unless I am uninformed and Georgia do.

Could you explain the difference between professional vs semi-pro league please. I'm not sure what are the criteria

 

[UilamOsa]

Send them to play the Islands in the Pacific. I think Georgia and Romania are at a level where I think on their day, can be at least competitive with the Pacific Islands. Im sure they would be welcomed as the Islands hardly get, if any touring Nations so I think it would be beneficial to all parties. If not the Islands, what about Japan, USA, Canada or somewhere in South America?

Maybe every four years in between world cups have the Island Teams tour Eastern Europe in their conditions. (frost, snow etc) Then vice versa.

It is wishful thinking but good luck to the lower tier teams - there's a groundswell of support for them in NZ at the moment.

Also - John Kirwan needs to stop pulling in ex-Kiwi's to top up his teams. He did it for Italy and now doing it for Japan. How are they going to be competitive in the next world cup if they're still relying on ex-pats.

 

[psychic duck]

playing pacific islands would be great but i don't know how its possible. top 14 teams are always hesitant when it comes to letting the players go for the tests. our rugby union barely manages to bring the team together once a year for one week or so. that is why we prefer to play two tests against European sides rather than playing whole tournament which can take weeks. traveling is also a big problem. we played on the nations cup and Churchill cup but those tournaments aren't much help because Georgian A side always ends up playing it.

I agree, a full strength Georgia side against a full strength Pacific Island side would be a good match, but realistically the Pacific Island sides are rarely near full strength in between World Cups and this would devalue the match some what

and as Toko11 says, Georgia struggle to get Gorgodze, Zirakashvili, Kubriashvili, Khinchagashvili and Datunashvili all in the same team at once as well

Georgia would be far more likely to benefit financially and on the pitch in a match against Scotland, Italy or Argentina which the Georgian Rugby Authorities could get the star players for much more easily

Toko11 also makes a good point about ChurchillCup/Nations Cup which are against mainly teams such as Italy A/Scotland A/Argentina Jaguars/Namibia

Georgia doesn't get the Top 14 players for those matches, and I doubt they would for a 6 Nations A team tournament too, I can't see the Top 14 clubs being happy at losing their players for five weeks so realistically a couple of matches a year is a better prospect for Georgia