Italy v Wales, 23/02/13

[TRF_Cymro]

Hook had 12 or so minuets to show he could be the man in the 10 shirt for Wales. Sadly he threw the opportunity away. He had the perfect chance to get Wales that another try. So disappointing.

On Gethin's injury ... its his calf and not his hamstring and its either a grade 1 or 2 tear.

 

[dullonien]

Hook had 12 or so minuets to show he could be the man in the 10 shirt for Wales. Sadly he threw the opportunity away. He had the perfect chance to get Wales that another try. So disappointing.

On Gethin's injury ... its his calf and not his hamstring and its either a grade 1 or 2 tear.

I agree Cymro. Realistically, that's our chances of retaining the 6 nations gone, unless we can do something great against Scotland, or England only scrape past Italy.

Gethin's always been unlucky with his calves. Just as he was returning to some form as well.

 

[London_Italian]

Not saying that Wales didnt deserve to win, but was there a suggestion of crossing for Cuthberts try? I was at the game at didnt have a chance to see it again after so just wondering

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Not saying that Wales didnt deserve to win, but was there a suggestion of crossing for Cuthberts try? I was at the game at didnt have a chance to see it again after so just wondering

I thought that too, but on the replays it showed the Italian defender (can't remember who it was) could have tackled Cuthbert/wasn't impeded, he just went for the dummy runner instead - in effect tackling to his left (where he thought the ball was going) rather than his right where the ball actually went.

 

[psychic duck]

Why does nobody ever question the place of Jamie Roberts?

Offered nothing at all again even against a poor Italian side that was there for the taking in the second half. Yet I bet nobody will question his place when he is named at 12 to face Scotland and will give him a guaranteed spot on the Lions tour plane.

I know he offers solid defence, but there are other players who do that, somebody with better attack is required. He offers no more than somebody like Brad Barritt, Graeme Morrison or Andrew Bishop on current form. Won't let you down in defence, but made a grand total of 3 metres in attack, less than any other centre (apart from Tommaso Benvenuti) in this weekend's action.

On another note, great to see Gethin Jenkins having a good game. Although I don't buy the "game time" excuse for his poor form. He has been lacking game time because he was playing poorly, not the other way round. Certainly earned his place for Scotland though if fit though, unlucky for Paul James. Hibbard also had a good game, as for much of his 21 caps we have seen more of the porky indisciplined penalty machine than the one that has been on the field for the Ospreys for the past year or so.

For Scotland I would go for the same team, just with Alun-Wyn Jones back in and Beck ahead of Roberts. Coombs may have been decent, but quality wise he is a long way from AWJ who offers all that Coombs just better with added experience and grunt. Fully fit, AWJ and Ian Evans is the best lock pairing.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

How about Wales actually give Roberts ball instead of either miss passing him or giving him passes that are to flat or in an awkward position that means he can't catch them?

 

[dullonien]

How about Wales actually give Roberts ball instead of either miss passing him or giving him passes that are to flat or in an awkward position that means he can't catch them?

I kinda agree with that. He was poor yesterday, there's no denying. He knocked on a couple at the start and Wales seemed to change their tactics and miss him out for the remainder of the game. But I still don't think he's being utilised well. He seems to be a battering ram, full stop. And that was difficult to do in those conditions, with flat balls hard to catch in those conditions. But still, he's doing little to keep his place ahead of someone a little more creative at the moment. Not really anyone challenging him either though, well there wasn't with Beck injured at least. We'll have to see how Beck goes for the O's next weekend, and go from there, but I'd expect Roberts to start again against Scotland tbh.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

I kinda agree with that. He was poor yesterday, there's no denying. He knocked on a couple at the start and Wales seemed to change their tactics and miss him out for the remainder of the game. But I still don't think he's being utilised well. He seems to be a battering ram, full stop. And that was difficult to do in those conditions, with flat balls hard to catch in those conditions. But still, he's doing little to keep his place ahead of someone a little more creative at the moment. Not really anyone challenging him either though, well there wasn't with Beck injured at least. We'll have to see how Beck goes for the O's next weekend, and go from there, but I'd expect Roberts to start again against Scotland tbh.

Roberts has shown he can pass a ball in this very 6 Nations. I just wish as you said Dull that Wales stop using him as a battering ram and actually allow him to pass more.

 

[psychic duck]

I kinda agree with that. He was poor yesterday, there's no denying. He knocked on a couple at the start and Wales seemed to change their tactics and miss him out for the remainder of the game. But I still don't think he's being utilised well. He seems to be a battering ram, full stop. And that was difficult to do in those conditions, with flat balls hard to catch in those conditions. But still, he's doing little to keep his place ahead of someone a little more creative at the moment. Not really anyone challenging him either though, well there wasn't with Beck injured at least. We'll have to see how Beck goes for the O's next weekend, and go from there, but I'd expect Roberts to start again against Scotland tbh.

Beck returned with the Ospreys. Made a nice break but then threw an over-ambitious pass.

I would put Hook forward as well, but he didn't help his cause with a not-so-great cameo vs Italy.

Being used as a battering-ram full stop doesn't seem to stop Tuilagi being effective. Not just this match, outside this match apart from the RWC, Roberts has rarely done much at all in attack. Time the centres were given a bit more creativity imo, still not convinced that Roberts and Davies trouble defences as a combination that much.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

Beck returned with the Ospreys. Made a nice break but then threw an over-ambitious pass.

I would put Hook forward as well, but he didn't help his cause with a not-so-great cameo vs Italy.

Being used as a battering-ram full stop doesn't seem to stop Tuilagi being effective. Not just this match, outside this match apart from the RWC, Roberts has rarely done much at all in attack. Time the centres were given a bit more creativity imo, still not convinced that Roberts and Davies trouble defences as a combination that much.

Harsh.

Manu is helped by people aiding him to create the angles to put him through and not ball that is supplied so that he can't catch.

 

[Joseph14]

The more I think about it the more I don't understand why Wales didn't go for another try towards the end. We were safe of our win, and were attacking in their half, so why did Hook just boot the ball out of play? The gap in points difference between us and England is currently 17, and looking forward to next week that should grow if anything with England at home to Italy and us away to Scotland. I know there's no guarantee we'll beat Scotland away, but I'd say we're odds on. Let's say that the gap grows next week by five (that sounds quite conservative), we'd then have to beat England on the final weekend by ~ 12 points (I think), and that's a huge, huge ask.

Once the game was safe today, we should have pushed for an extra try or two. Disappointed with that!

That is very conservative! England could quite easily end up beating Italy by 30+ points.

Could end up with having to beat England on the final day by 20+ points to win the championship. Assuming Wales can win in Scotland, which is far from certain.

 

[TRF_Cymro]

That is very conservative! England could quite easily end up beating Italy by 30+ points.

Could end up with having to beat England on the final day by 20+ points to win the championship. Assuming Wales can win in Scotland, which is far from certain.

Not certain England will beat Italy either

 

[j'nuh]

I think that as a 12, Roberts is too tied to being second receiver in the line and can't vary his attacking game. A ball-crashing 12 only works when you generate quick ball, stand fairly flat and hit the defense before they've re-organised - otherwise you'll struggle to make enough ground to even get over the gain line. Roberts would offer a lot more in attack if he was put at 13 and had Beck/Henson at 12 and varied his style and roamed a little more. Having a distributor at 12 will also give cleaner ball to the back 3.

 

[dullonien]

I'm not happy about the balance of the backline as a whole. With everyone fit, I'd only have four of the current backline starting. Those would be Biggar, one of the centres, on of the wings and Halfpenny at fullback.

At scrum half, I still want to see a more traditional quick 9 that whips the ball out to the backs and snipes the fringes. Phillips is great at what he does, but with he just facilitates a slow, physical approach, and we've got more to offer than that. I think Biggar offers the reliability we need at 10.

Regardless of whether Wales utilize Roberts like they should, he doesn't offer the creative spark that Henson or Beck do, and I want to see someone like that come in at 12. I don't think Hook is the answer in the centre. Leave Roberts and Davies to battle it out for the outside centre berth.

On the wings, both North and Cuthbert are excellent finishers, but either one of them could have scored that try yesterday, and I', not sure you need both in the team at the same time. I feel the balance would be better with someone like Eli Walker on one wing and one of North or Cuthbert on the other.

 

[Draggs]

Roberts stays because of his work in defence. Defence > Attack for our gameplan.

Henson offers the best of both worlds, but this has been done to death.

A player I am quite a fan of is Steven Shingler. I wish he was going to the Ospreys, as he could do with some ball going forward. He has a good pass and boot, and a pretty big as well. I'd like to see him for the Scarlets an inside centre, with Davies outside. He offers a few more skills than like likes of Warren, Maule, and Williams. Apart from ******** out in defence yesterday, young Owen Williams (the Turk stand-off, not Blues centre) is a good prospect. Likewise, Aled Davies is hitting good form, and Jonathan Evans is getting some gametime and steadily improving.

 

[Joseph14]

Not certain England will beat Italy either

You should stick some money on that. If it comes in you will land a small fortune!

 

[dullonien]

A player I am quite a fan of is Steven Shingler. I wish he was going to the Ospreys, as he could do with some ball going forward. He has a good pass and boot, and a pretty big as well. I'd like to see him for the Scarlets an inside centre, with Davies outside. He offers a few more skills than like likes of Warren, Maule, and Williams.

Oi, don't go giving that shirt to Shingler, that's Gareth Owen's shirt, the Scarlets just don't know it yet.

Edit. Actually, if Owen does finally make the break through at regional level, maybe 10 Owen, 12 Shingler, 13 Davies could work? I'm not in agreement with the Scarlets that 15 is Owen's best position.

 

[Draggs]

Oi, don't go giving that shirt to Shingler, that's Gareth Owen's shirt, the Scarlets just don't know it yet.

Edit. Actually, if Owen does finally make the break through at regional level, maybe 10 Owen, 12 Shingler, 13 Davies could work? I'm not in agreement with the Scarlets that 15 is Owen's best position.

If Owen wants gametime, fullback is his best option. He can easily join in as first/second receiver. If Priestland returns to form they will have three players who can cover stand off and fullback.

 

[psychic duck]

If Owen wants gametime, Dragons is his best option.

ftfy

Btw, you can forget about all those possible team lineups. They aren't going to drop Scott Williams or "the next JPR" Liam Williams any time soon. Will need to move regions if they want to become first choice. Owen has never ever got close to living up to his billing anyway.

 

[Draggs]

ftfy

Btw, you can forget about all those possible team lineups. They aren't going to drop Scott Williams or "the next JPR" Liam Williams any time soon. Will need to move regions if they want to become first choice. Owen has never ever got close to living up to his billing anyway.

Injuries and Scott Johnson happened.

If we did sign him, it would be as a centre. We have Steff developing at outside half, and Amos/Prydie/Evans at fullback.

The Turk hubrismobile has Williams and Williams in the front seat.