Italy v New Zealand

[danit]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Charles @ Nov 12 2009, 04:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

No Marcato ?[/b]

long term injured, he's not playing since last may, scheduled to be back on the field next december

 

[jawmalawm24]

I reckon the Italian Front row looks pretty good especially with Martin Castrogiovanni he's got to be one of the best props in the world at the moment especially after the performance he put on against the Springboks. Dude was a beast he totally annihilated their scrum.

I'll be watching the Bergamasco's too they're good players and always show some exciting play. I can't wait for this game it's just too bad I'll have to wake up 3:30am to watch it. I know there'll be a replay probably 8 or 9 o'clock later on but there's nothing like watching the games live.

Good luck Italy have a awesome game just not too awesome ok because I've been shattered from the Wellington Lions losing the final in the Anz Cup the weekend just gone and I don't feel like going through it again this weekend

 

[erwanseb]

I believe that by fieleding a B team, NZ underestimates Italy.

Italy will have the advantage in both the front row and the back row and overall greater experience, if the 80,000 crowd can lift the spirit and level of the team above their standard, they may eventually win the battle upfront and deprive the NZ backs of any good balls.

An Italian win is at 1/10, I do not think the odds of an Italian win over NZ has ever ever been that high which reflect the general view that it could be their day, the odd is still quite small but is not nil anymore.

Still believe , as most punters do , that NZ will win but one day, in 10, 15 or 30 years, Italy will win a game agaisnt the ABs.

Since joining the 5N now 6N, the number of players has been multiplied by more than 2 (60,000 registered players). It will take some years before those players deliver on International stage , but ultimately it will come.

 

[Nickdnz]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Codorniou @ Nov 13 2009, 03:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

I believe that by fieleding a B team, NZ underestimates Italy.

Italy will have the advantage in both the front row and the back row and overall greater experience, if the 80,000 crowd can lift the spirit and level of the team above their standard, they may eventually win the battle upfront and deprive the NZ backs of any good balls.

An Italian win is at 1/10, I do not think the odds of an Italian win over NZ has ever ever been that high which reflect the general view that it could be their day, the odd is still quite small but is not nil anymore.
Still believe , as most punters do , that NZ will win but one day, in 10, 15 or 30 years, Italy will win a game agaisnt the ABs.

Since joining the 5N now 6N, the number of players has been multiplied by more than 2 (60,000 registered players). It will take some years before those players deliver on International stage , but ultimately it will come.[/b]

And here NH teams back their chances again. I don't understand how you believe Italy have an advantage at the front row and back row. They have more experience sure, but I'd choose our forwards over theirs any day.


No offence.

 

[erwanseb]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Nov 13 2009, 11:21 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

No offence.[/b]

No offence taken, as I said NZ will win this one, not much doubt that
butl I am not inventing the odds, so 1/10 for an Italian win is obviously small but not completly ridiculous, a few years ago it would have been 1/200 and that is a testimony of Italy improvement.

1 Salvatore PERUGINI (Bayonne, 63 caps) vs W. Crockett : advantage Perugini
16 Fabio ONGARO (Saracens, 61 caps) vs C. Flynn , advantage Ongaro
3. Martin CASTROGIOVANNI (Leicester, 59 caps) vs N. Tialata , Castrogiovanni by a mile, same ability as Haymans
6 Alessandro ZANNI (Treviso, 34 caps) vs L. Messam , advantage Messam
7 Mauro BERGAMASCO (Stade Francais, 76 caps) vs T. Latimer , advantage Bergamasco
8 Sergio PARISSE (Stade Francais, 65 caps) cap. vs . R. So'oialo , a ***anic figth too close to call.

I will give significant adavantage to NZ at the back and second row.

 

[Jer1cho]

lol. Parisse is miles ahead of So'oialo.

 

[Nickdnz]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jer1cho @ Nov 13 2009, 08:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

lol. Parisse is miles ahead of So'oialo.[/b]

Meh, I think So'oialo if he finds form can be one of the greatest work horse the AB's have beside perhaps Thorn.

I think one thing people have to remember about the AB squad is that this may be the last chance that some of these people ever have to impress the AB selectors, and because of that reason I'd think the performance of some of the AB's would be huge. On that note, it could also mean that AB's makemore mistakes from either nerves or trying to do too much themselves.

 

[jawmalawm24]

Rodders will play a good game it's just too bad there's no one else around to back him up at no.8. He's dominated that position for so long he hardly gets a rest. Sergio Parisse is an excellent player but I think earlier this year he disappointed some people because he was sent off the field for eye gouging and was suspended for 8 weeks. Hopefully he won't do anything like that this time around and makes a good go at it.

 

[danit]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jawmalawm24 @ Nov 13 2009, 10:39 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Sergio Parisse is an excellent player but I think earlier this year he disappointed some people because he was sent off the field for eye gouging and was suspended for 8 weeks. Hopefully he won't do anything like that this time around and makes a good go at it.[/b]

"The panel found that Parisse had not acted intentionally but deemed his actions were reckless and warranted a penalty, the New Zealand Press Association reported. Parisse was charged with a lower-range offence which carried a recommended sentence of 12 weeks but was reduced to eight weeks because of mitigating circumstances"

in fact, 8 weeks ban for eye gouging really shows how unintentional the act was, nothing to do with the much harder Mauro Bergamasco eye gouging Lee Byrne in 2008 (13 weeks) or Dylan Hartley eye gouging the Wasps duo Johnny O'Connor and James Haskell in 2007 (26 weeks ban)

 

[candybum]

Parisse's eye gouge on Issac Ross earlier this year? My opinion was that it was intentional.
I've watched the game a few times and the incident itself a few times as well. You see that there is a maul formed, you also see Parisse looking at the ref, screaming for a penalty on Ross, and as soon as the ref looks elsewhere (at a minor scuffle approx 20m away from the maul, i think it was) that's when Parisse slips his finger into Ross's eye, while still looking at the ref. To me that's a tad mischievous on his part.

 

[cyRil]

People aren't actually suggesting So'oialo is better than Parisse?

Oh, and sorry, I'm not usually this ignorant and usually pretty up with SH players but could people give me the lo-down on Delaney?

 

[Nickdnz]

Mike Delany has really only come into his game this season. He is now 28 years old. He has a good running game which has shown in the Air New Zealand Cup. He is also a good goal kicker (which wont be shown against Italy as McAlister is taking over Goal Kicking duties), and he is a good tactical kicker. He seems in my opinion to play a conservitive and well organised game, however he can run well when needed, which I believe you will see against Italy. Other then that I don't know what else to say to be honest, as he has only just become as good as he is. It is also note worthy that he was the back up option for Steven Donald in the cheifs and may be again this season.

 

[ChiefsFan]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Nov 14 2009, 11:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Mike Delany has really only come into his game this season. He is now 28 years old. He has a good running game which has shown in the Air New Zealand Cup. He is also a good goal kicker (which wont be shown against Italy as McAlister is taking over Goal Kicking duties), and he is a good tactical kicker. He seems in my opinion to play a conservitive and well organised game, however he can run well when needed, which I believe you will see against Italy. Other then that I don't know what else to say to be honest, as he has only just become as good as he is. It is also note worthy that he was the back up option for Steven Donald in the cheifs and may be again this season.[/b]

You're wrong there, Delaney has been practically where he is now for the last year or two. It's only this year he was picked for the All Blacks though. It's actually very odd (I've been watching BoP and the Chiefs), and whenever anyone says stuff like this it really annoys me (no offence), because it basically means that the only stuff they know about the player is what they've heard from the media.

You could say he's like the M Steyn of NZ rugby, maybe with a slightly weaker boot, but a much better running game.

 

[RC]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cyRil of Ospreylia @ Nov 13 2009, 02:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

People aren't actually suggesting So'oialo is better than Parisse?[/b]

Nobody's that deluded or biased towards their own country to suggest that.
Not even the italians would suggest that their no.8 is better than Parisse.

 

[Nickdnz]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ChiefsFan @ Nov 14 2009, 12:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Nov 14 2009, 11:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Mike Delany has really only come into his game this season. He is now 28 years old. He has a good running game which has shown in the Air New Zealand Cup. He is also a good goal kicker (which wont be shown against Italy as McAlister is taking over Goal Kicking duties), and he is a good tactical kicker. He seems in my opinion to play a conservitive and well organised game, however he can run well when needed, which I believe you will see against Italy. Other then that I don't know what else to say to be honest, as he has only just become as good as he is. It is also note worthy that he was the back up option for Steven Donald in the cheifs and may be again this season.[/b]

You're wrong there, Delaney has been practically where he is now for the last year or two. It's only this year he was picked for the All Blacks though. It's actually very odd (I've been watching BoP and the Chiefs), and whenever anyone says stuff like this it really annoys me (no offence), because it basically means that the only stuff they know about the player is what they've heard from the media.

You could say he's like the M Steyn of NZ rugby, maybe with a slightly weaker boot, but a much better running game.
[/b][/quote]
Well I havn't got my opinion of him from the media, I just nefver rated him very highly in previous tornements. I rated him under Carter, Donald, Gopperth and even Weepu when he played 10. I realise that I underestimated him over his form in the ANZC this season, but I'd disagree that you say he was as good last season as he was this season.

 

[jawmalawm24]

Mike Delany has been pretty good for a few seasons now it's just that Bay Of Plenty had a really good run in the beginning of this season so more of their players were being recognised. It's been hard for him to shine when he plays for the Bay Of Plenty and the Highlanders in the Super14 than the Chiefs and probably even harder to make it into the All Blacks when you've got Carter, Donald, McAlistar and when he was here Nick Evans around.

His attacking play is very good he has the ability of ghosting through small gaps and has a bit of pace but his goal kicking is awesome and his tactical kicking is equally as good.

 

[danger]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Nov 14 2009, 11:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

Mike Delany has really only come into his game this season. He is now 28 years old. He has a good running game which has shown in the Air New Zealand Cup. He is also a good goal kicker (which wont be shown against Italy as McAlister is taking over Goal Kicking duties), and he is a good tactical kicker. He seems in my opinion to play a conservitive and well organised game, however he can run well when needed, which I believe you will see against Italy. Other then that I don't know what else to say to be honest, as he has only just become as good as he is. It is also note worthy that he was the back up option for Steven Donald in the cheifs and may be again this season.[/b]

I think you've actually got him all wrong.. His game isnt "conservitive" his running game reminds me very much of a touch player, he reads the defence very well and has a very canny knack for spotting gaps for himself and other players, sometimes in an orthadox fashion and sometimes you see a glimpse of carlos spencer in the guy. you can expect to see some razzle dazzle behind the back passes and the like when hes playing. He hasnt just become as good as he is either, hes been a great player for a very long time, its just only now people are giving him a shot.

Also i think Codorinou is guilty of underestimating the All Blacks... just because you havnt heard of them doesnt mean they arent any good..

 

[Nickdnz]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (danger @ Nov 14 2009, 03:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Nov 14 2009, 11:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Mike Delany has really only come into his game this season. He is now 28 years old. He has a good running game which has shown in the Air New Zealand Cup. He is also a good goal kicker (which wont be shown against Italy as McAlister is taking over Goal Kicking duties), and he is a good tactical kicker. He seems in my opinion to play a conservitive and well organised game, however he can run well when needed, which I believe you will see against Italy. Other then that I don't know what else to say to be honest, as he has only just become as good as he is. It is also note worthy that he was the back up option for Steven Donald in the cheifs and may be again this season.[/b]

I think you've actually got him all wrong.. His game isnt "conservitive" his running game reminds me very much of a touch player, he reads the defence very well and has a very canny knack for spotting gaps for himself and other players, sometimes in an orthadox fashion and sometimes you see a glimpse of carlos spencer in the guy. you can expect to see some razzle dazzle behind the back passes and the like when hes playing. He hasnt just become as good as he is either, hes been a great player for a very long time, its just only now people are giving him a shot.

Also i think Codorinou is guilty of underestimating the All Blacks... just because you havnt heard of them doesnt mean they arent any good..
[/b][/quote]
You could well be right. I'd hardly say he seems "carlos spencer" like from what I've seen, but I did mention his counter attacking abuility. My assessment of him may be wrong, it was just an opinion I have gathered from him over the last few seasons.

 

[danger]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Nov 14 2009, 05:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (danger @ Nov 14 2009, 03:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nickdnz @ Nov 14 2009, 11:49 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Mike Delany has really only come into his game this season. He is now 28 years old. He has a good running game which has shown in the Air New Zealand Cup. He is also a good goal kicker (which wont be shown against Italy as McAlister is taking over Goal Kicking duties), and he is a good tactical kicker. He seems in my opinion to play a conservitive and well organised game, however he can run well when needed, which I believe you will see against Italy. Other then that I don't know what else to say to be honest, as he has only just become as good as he is. It is also note worthy that he was the back up option for Steven Donald in the cheifs and may be again this season.[/b]

I think you've actually got him all wrong.. His game isnt "conservitive" his running game reminds me very much of a touch player, he reads the defence very well and has a very canny knack for spotting gaps for himself and other players, sometimes in an orthadox fashion and sometimes you see a glimpse of carlos spencer in the guy. you can expect to see some razzle dazzle behind the back passes and the like when hes playing. He hasnt just become as good as he is either, hes been a great player for a very long time, its just only now people are giving him a shot.

Also i think Codorinou is guilty of underestimating the All Blacks... just because you havnt heard of them doesnt mean they arent any good..
[/b][/quote]
You could well be right. I'd hardly say he seems "carlos spencer" like from what I've seen, but I did mention his counter attacking abuility. My assessment of him may be wrong, it was just an opinion I have gathered from him over the last few seasons.
[/b][/quote]


Hes obviously not up to Carlos Spencer standard, but hes always been willing to try the unorthodox to break the line, so i liken him to Spencer in that respect, it comes off more often then not also. He really does have a sizeable bag of tricks, not just on the counter attack but in breaking the line in general play, tricky dicky kicks and passes are his thing.

 

[jawmalawm24]

He does some crazy things that people don't usually try to do like 1 game he got the ball to clear it out from his ingoal but runs it out to the 22m instead. He has some very good sniping runs and I can't wait to see him play to be honest I just hope he doesn't get too nervous or tries to overplay.