Ireland is the nerdy girl who suddenly became attractive by taking her glasses off and letting her hair down.
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Ireland 2025
- Thread starter Leonormous Boozer
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SéniorHuevo
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Byrne's kicking was ridiculous 8/9 with most coming from the touchlines as Ireland started to score at will in the corners. Spain still managed 4 tries and not lucky bounces but rolling malls from lineouts but the gulf is brutal. Comprehensive is the fairest description but 11,000 plus for Spain as the trial concept of playing in Leganés was reward with a 80% full stadium, so passed with flying colours. The handful of Irish who made it over were made very welcome.
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Hansen and Darragh Murray called into the squad.
Osborne ruled out of the rest of the series and VDF and Ringrose are both doubts this week.
Osborne ruled out of the rest of the series and VDF and Ringrose are both doubts this week.
IRELAND UNDER-20 MEN'S Team & Replacements (v South Africa Under-20s, Challenge Match, Virgin Media Park, Friday, November 14, kick-off 7.30pm):
15. Noah Byrne (Dublin University FC/Leinster)
14. Charlie Molony (UCD RFC/Leinster)
13. Sean Walsh (Galway Corinthians RFC/Connacht)
12. James O'Leary (UCC RFC/Munster)
11. Daniel Ryan (Galway Corinthians RFC/Connacht) - ex St. Michaels
10. Tom Wood (Garryowen FC/Munster)
9. Christopher Barrett (UCC RFC/Munster)
1. Max Doyle (UCD RFC/Leinster)
2. Lee Fitzpatrick (Blackrock College RFC/Leinster) - u19
3. Sami Bishti (UCD RFC/Leinster) (capt)
4. Donnacha McGuire (UCD RFC/Leinster)
5. Dylan McNeice (UCD RFC/Leinster)
6. Joe Finn (Garryowen FC/Munster)
7. Arthur Ashmore (Terenure College RFC/Leinster) - u19
8. Diarmaid O'Connell (Galway Corinthians RFC/Connacht)
Replacements:
16. Rian Handley (Old Wesley RFC/Leinster)
17. Christian Foley (Young Munster RFC/Munster)
18. Blake McClean (Instonians RFC/Ulster)
19. Sean Walsh (MU Barnhall RFC/Leinster)
20. Michael O'Sullivan (UCC RFC/Munster)
21. Fergus Callington (Durham University/IQ Rugby)
22. Conor O'Shaughnessy (Galwegians RFC/Connacht) - ex Blackrock
23. Johnny O'Sullivan (Dublin University FC/Leinster)
15. Noah Byrne (Dublin University FC/Leinster)
14. Charlie Molony (UCD RFC/Leinster)
13. Sean Walsh (Galway Corinthians RFC/Connacht)
12. James O'Leary (UCC RFC/Munster)
11. Daniel Ryan (Galway Corinthians RFC/Connacht) - ex St. Michaels
10. Tom Wood (Garryowen FC/Munster)
9. Christopher Barrett (UCC RFC/Munster)
1. Max Doyle (UCD RFC/Leinster)
2. Lee Fitzpatrick (Blackrock College RFC/Leinster) - u19
3. Sami Bishti (UCD RFC/Leinster) (capt)
4. Donnacha McGuire (UCD RFC/Leinster)
5. Dylan McNeice (UCD RFC/Leinster)
6. Joe Finn (Garryowen FC/Munster)
7. Arthur Ashmore (Terenure College RFC/Leinster) - u19
8. Diarmaid O'Connell (Galway Corinthians RFC/Connacht)
Replacements:
16. Rian Handley (Old Wesley RFC/Leinster)
17. Christian Foley (Young Munster RFC/Munster)
18. Blake McClean (Instonians RFC/Ulster)
19. Sean Walsh (MU Barnhall RFC/Leinster)
20. Michael O'Sullivan (UCC RFC/Munster)
21. Fergus Callington (Durham University/IQ Rugby)
22. Conor O'Shaughnessy (Galwegians RFC/Connacht) - ex Blackrock
23. Johnny O'Sullivan (Dublin University FC/Leinster)
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McCloskey ruled out.
Ringrose, VDF and Clarkson all fit and available.
Ringrose, VDF and Clarkson all fit and available.
ShropshireAllBlack
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I’m over in the UK, but from what I have seen online etc, I am concerned that we’re reading too much into Saturday’s performance, without taking into account how poor Australia were. I fear that next Saturday at the Aviva could be a chastening experience. The42.ie were discussing starting Paddy McCarthy against the Boks!
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We're only 5 point dogs with the bookies. I'd be hitting SA on that handicap all day if I was placing a bet.
I think last Saturday proved we're fine, it still takes a good performance to hockey a team like that, no one questioned France's ability when they gave us a hammering even though there were a lot of systems failures on our part.
This coming Saturday is a different ball game entirely though, we've got comfortably the best team in the world coming to town and they're holding a grudge, it could get ugly.
I went to see (most of) this. Think Ireland were hard done by on the scoreboard. They played a lot of the rugby but South Africans were lethal at seet piece and any time they went to the corner they were able to maul it over. I have no doubt this is a better 20s crop than last year. Sean Walsh came in for James O'Leary pre-kickoff due to injury and the lad is massive. Busted through for a great try. In fact both centres had really nice games. Ashmore also injured really early on, replaced by Michael O'Sullivan who is really physical and smashed a few guys in the tackle.
In really tough conditions I think the starting halfbacks went well, but their replacements struggled a lot and put a good few kicks out on the full, which the Saffas punished.
Charlie Molony was obviously around last year, but he's a very classy player with ball in hand.
The referee was incredibly poor too. Wood was clearly taken out in the air, which was apparent to everyone in the ground and he gave a knock-on against Ireland.
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Yeah believe the 3 main centres are all quite highly rated.
Wonder will Josh Neill come in.
It’s crazy to say this because Ireland are at home and it still takes a very good visiting performance to get a win in Dublin but I can’t see SA losing this. They’re just on a different level to everybody else and they can now play the game both ways - they can still bully teams into submission but they can also now absolutely shred teams to pieces out wide. They are the complete team - Ireland can win this, but they’ll have to be virtually perfect in every area of the game to do it. My gut feeling is Ireland will play well, but not have enough to win. I see a clear SA victory by around 10 points.
I'd be shocked if Neill didnt.
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Baird has fractured his tibia 
and Hamsen has reinjured his foot.
Tough one as Baird was the biggest positive of the series for me.
and Hamsen has reinjured his foot.Tough one as Baird was the biggest positive of the series for me.
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So it's pretty obvious we're in a trough now, possibly and hopefully the depths of one.
There's some things I'm very worried about and others that are less of a concern, will spin through them here:
Front row: surprisingly not too worried here, a back up tighthead would be nice but I don't think the scrum is a huge concern despite Saturday, that was more down to not having an out and out lock on the pitch after Ryan got himself sent off.
Second Row: a bit more concerning, the lineout is terrible, Henderson is dusht at this level and Beirne is unlikely to make it far past the World Cup. Munster have young talent here though, they should see gametime soon.
Backrow: Doris is best itw at what he does imo. Baird is finally showing what he's capable of. VdF and Conan's age profile is a worry but again, Munster have some talent here to replace them eventually.
Scrum half: this could very quickly become a problem. JGP is coming to the end of his career and Casey isn't an adequate replacement. At best you have guys who might make the level coming through.
Out-half: two decent but flawed players here at the moment. I think Harry Byrne might throw a spanner in the works too and Casper Gabriel could be the guy long term post 2027. If Crowley could get more involved and manage phaseplay at this level or Prendergast somehow triple his testosterone levels we'd have a baller.
Midfield: very worried, think it was underrated how dominant SA were here on Saturday with everything else going on and that was with Bundee having one of his better games in awhile. With Hansen emerging as a 15 option I think we need to focus Osborne as a 12, Henshaw and Bundee aren't bad options but they were arguably best itw level when Ireland have been a top contender and those days are past. Little enough coming behind so McCloskey should remain a solid back up option too. But I think being so much better than SA in the midfield is a big reason why we have such a strong record against them, it's gone now.
Back three: I'm actually happy enough here, Tommy O'Brien and Mack 15 have proven to be at the level which gives us options. Probably time to start phasing out Lowe if he doesn't show improvement though.
There's some things I'm very worried about and others that are less of a concern, will spin through them here:
Front row: surprisingly not too worried here, a back up tighthead would be nice but I don't think the scrum is a huge concern despite Saturday, that was more down to not having an out and out lock on the pitch after Ryan got himself sent off.
Second Row: a bit more concerning, the lineout is terrible, Henderson is dusht at this level and Beirne is unlikely to make it far past the World Cup. Munster have young talent here though, they should see gametime soon.
Backrow: Doris is best itw at what he does imo. Baird is finally showing what he's capable of. VdF and Conan's age profile is a worry but again, Munster have some talent here to replace them eventually.
Scrum half: this could very quickly become a problem. JGP is coming to the end of his career and Casey isn't an adequate replacement. At best you have guys who might make the level coming through.
Out-half: two decent but flawed players here at the moment. I think Harry Byrne might throw a spanner in the works too and Casper Gabriel could be the guy long term post 2027. If Crowley could get more involved and manage phaseplay at this level or Prendergast somehow triple his testosterone levels we'd have a baller.
Midfield: very worried, think it was underrated how dominant SA were here on Saturday with everything else going on and that was with Bundee having one of his better games in awhile. With Hansen emerging as a 15 option I think we need to focus Osborne as a 12, Henshaw and Bundee aren't bad options but they were arguably best itw level when Ireland have been a top contender and those days are past. Little enough coming behind so McCloskey should remain a solid back up option too. But I think being so much better than SA in the midfield is a big reason why we have such a strong record against them, it's gone now.
Back three: I'm actually happy enough here, Tommy O'Brien and Mack 15 have proven to be at the level which gives us options. Probably time to start phasing out Lowe if he doesn't show improvement though.
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I think there enough coming through. Casey is still in middle of being above provincial level but below international. Worry is rest to to put pressure on.
For 10. Jack will get there. He showed it but his issue is he needs confidence that he has at Munster. It feels there is a fear playing with green due to knowing Sam is Farrells 1st choice. And this in turn leaks back to Leinster. Will others fulfil to levels of not getting chances in big games.
Centre is huge worry. Dan Kelly for us I think could be 1 and Ulster have few. Osborne too when back. Issue is Faz wants centres like extra flanker and that does not suit alot of lads.
Back 3 I am worried. Unlike you I am still not convinced at Tommy. He didn't look fast at this level and was found out positionally a bit. But hopefully that improves.
Ultimately it feels like Ireland have a descent group of players to come through who need time for the WC, arguably this was the season to do it but it’s still a way off, probably better to dip now and get things in motion than be on par/exceed expectation depending on what they were (I actually have no idea) and paper over the cracks and be nowhere near it for the World Cup, obviously it’s a bit of an odd one as Faz seniors time would have been largely concentrated on the lions so didn’t have the opportunity to experiment as he may have and probably isn’t appropriate for others to do in his absence, the lions tours can obviously create burnout and fatigue with Ireland player contribution this could also explain a fair bit.
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There has been a lot of talk about our age profile recently. Have had similar looks previously but thought, using our Autumn squad (post the Australia game) I’d have a look at where we really are.
Loosehead prop: 23, 22, 29 - pretty good especially for loosehead. Arguably you’d want them a bit older. XV players were 21 and 26.
Hooker: 27, 22, 27 - not a concern.
Tighthead prop: 34, 25, 33 - the emergence of Clarkson has been much needed. Is a concern and there are prospects knocking around but that’s all they are at the moment.
Lock: 25, 33, 33, 29, 24 - main concern is Beirne’s age because of the player that he is but overall I think we should be ok. Not included are McCarthy 24 who’s back this weekend and Edogbo 22 who’s hopefully getting over his own issues.
Backrow: 26, 33, 27, 25, 30, 32 - at a macro level I think we’re ok but could do with a 7 getting to the level we need. There are a few I believe can but wouldn’t be surprised if we enter the WC with Doris starting 7 and Gleeson at 8.
Scrumhalf: 31, 26, 33 - a position that tends to age well but not ideal due to JGPs quality. There are a number of young lads getting regular game time this season so believe they’ll get to international level but whether any will be stars remains to be seen.
Outhalf: 25, 27, 22 - age isn’t an issue
Centres: 35, 33, 32, 30, 32 - not pretty reading. However, it doesn’t include Osborne (24) who’s already established. Guys like Postlethwaite and Gavin look like they have the quality and have been around squads but could do with being further implemented.
Backthree: 33, 27, 29, 29, 27 - not ideal but not horrible by any stretch. Haven’t included Keenan who’s 29. Is a position where players can emerge quickly. While people decry Farrell’s conservatism I think he has shown before if you have the traits he wants he will back you quickly.
I think overall it’s far from as bad as popular opinion suggests, we’re definitely an older squad but in comparison but there’s only 2 positions I have genuine concerns for. While lasts year’s 20s was a shambles it’s incredibly disingenuous to say there’s little talent coming through (as I saw Jim Hamilton stupidly conclude) over the last 5 years are 20s have been a top performer.
Loosehead prop: 23, 22, 29 - pretty good especially for loosehead. Arguably you’d want them a bit older. XV players were 21 and 26.
Hooker: 27, 22, 27 - not a concern.
Tighthead prop: 34, 25, 33 - the emergence of Clarkson has been much needed. Is a concern and there are prospects knocking around but that’s all they are at the moment.
Lock: 25, 33, 33, 29, 24 - main concern is Beirne’s age because of the player that he is but overall I think we should be ok. Not included are McCarthy 24 who’s back this weekend and Edogbo 22 who’s hopefully getting over his own issues.
Backrow: 26, 33, 27, 25, 30, 32 - at a macro level I think we’re ok but could do with a 7 getting to the level we need. There are a few I believe can but wouldn’t be surprised if we enter the WC with Doris starting 7 and Gleeson at 8.
Scrumhalf: 31, 26, 33 - a position that tends to age well but not ideal due to JGPs quality. There are a number of young lads getting regular game time this season so believe they’ll get to international level but whether any will be stars remains to be seen.
Outhalf: 25, 27, 22 - age isn’t an issue
Centres: 35, 33, 32, 30, 32 - not pretty reading. However, it doesn’t include Osborne (24) who’s already established. Guys like Postlethwaite and Gavin look like they have the quality and have been around squads but could do with being further implemented.
Backthree: 33, 27, 29, 29, 27 - not ideal but not horrible by any stretch. Haven’t included Keenan who’s 29. Is a position where players can emerge quickly. While people decry Farrell’s conservatism I think he has shown before if you have the traits he wants he will back you quickly.
I think overall it’s far from as bad as popular opinion suggests, we’re definitely an older squad but in comparison but there’s only 2 positions I have genuine concerns for. While lasts year’s 20s was a shambles it’s incredibly disingenuous to say there’s little talent coming through (as I saw Jim Hamilton stupidly conclude) over the last 5 years are 20s have been a top performer.
I’ve always found his view bizarre at best hard to know how much of it is entertainment but he makes out Scotland are world beaters and Ireland are average at times, when the reality is Scotland have had Englands number that’s about all they manage whilst Ireland over time have taken all comers and make the Scottish look distinctively average time and again, it’s like he watches a different sport.
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If you listen to most Scottish and Welsh pundits closely when speaking about us it's the same, Jim is just a bit less choice with his words!
Players who should be in their prime / entering it next world cup:
Porter, Sheehan, Kelleher, Ryan, McCarthy, Baird, Doris, Crowley, Hansen, TO'B, decent spine there that a few old timers and kids should compliment.
Ringrose should still be grand, I'd back Beirne and JGP (he has essentially made himself an Aaron Smith dupe) too. Furlong and VdF are the worries but I don't hate Doris at 7 either.
Could really really do with a speedy wing emerging though, I think our three games against the top three sides in the world this year showed that our restricted gameplan is a bigger issue than personnel. We still have a pack that can bully most sides but once they're stood up to we are pretty blunt and once they're beaten we're no threats to the scoreboard at all.
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Hansen out until at least the 6N with surgery on his foot.
Hopefully Keenan comes back flying. Said the hip had been bothering him for a long time before the surgery.
Hopefully Keenan comes back flying. Said the hip had been bothering him for a long time before the surgery.
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