Investec Champions Cup 23/24 - Rd 4

[pagliaccio_euforico]

That's a soft penalty

 

[LIONSxv]

As a casual watcher of Ulster, I always wondered why Baloucoune hasn't been capped more by Ire. Electric with ball in hand...however I can see why he isn't trusted defensively. Been real bad today

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

As a casual watcher of Ulster, I always wondered why Baloucoune hasn't been capped more by Ire. Electric with ball in hand...however I can see why he isn't trusted defensively. Been real bad today

It is a shame but he was given every chance you could expect. I don't think the levels of professionalism in Ulster are anywhere near the other three provinces because their players always go to **** after making an Ireland squad bar the rare exception.

Stockdale, Balacoune and Hume are all recent examples. Even Henderson and McCloskey took longer than they should have to reach the required level.

 

[Jimbo]

As a casual watcher of Ulster, I always wondered why Baloucoune hasn't been capped more by Ire. Electric with ball in hand...however I can see why he isn't trusted defensively. Been real bad today

None of Irelands recent winger selections have stand out qualities in terms of raw pace, power or whatever, they just do slightly different jobs extremely well when compared to how you would stereo type wingers, IMO its the ability to see players and use them as cogs within a system and how they can collectively work rather than just based on raw attributes that has given Ireland a fair bit of their recent success (WC aside).

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Jesus Christ was only half watching the first 20mins.

Ulster are a disgrace.

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

It is a shame but he was given every chance you could expect. I don't think the levels of professionalism in Ulster are anywhere near the other three provinces because their players always go to **** after making an Ireland squad bar the rare exception.

Stockdale, Balacoune and Hume are all recent examples. Even Henderson and McCloskey took longer than they should have to reach the required level.

All I hear from that is that the uk has stricter drug testing than the republic

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

All I hear from that is that the uk has stricter drug testing than the republic

Possibly but it's not like they just stall, a lot of them actively get worse and complain that they couldn't cut it psychologically.

Cave, Cooney and Hume have all blamed the camp or coaching standards. They also had to banish two players to England and France on account of off field actions…

I reckon culture is more likely than drugs.

 

[Jimbo]

Possibly but it's not like they just stall, a lot of them actively get worse and complain that they couldn't cut it psychologically.

Cave, Cooney and Hume have all blamed the camp or coaching standards. They also had to banish two players to England and France on account of off field actions…

I reckon culture is more likely than drugs.

I call BS on coaching and culture in general, you don't get to No1 and maintain it without that in spades, however if your not playing for Leinster or Munster maybe you don't get the same feeling of involvement and different treatment rightly or wrongly.

 

[LIONSxv]

None of Irelands recent winger selections have stand out qualities in terms of raw pace, power or whatever, they just do slightly different jobs extremely well when compared to how you would stereo type wingers, IMO its the ability to see players and use them as cogs within a system and how they can collectively work rather than just based on raw attributes that has given Ireland a fair bit of their recent success (WC aside).

Yeah I get all that, all you could say Mack Hansen has pace and footwork. I know the pitch at quin's is a bit tricky. However some the mistakes in defence are real poor.
Out of position a lot too

 

[big ginger 8]

Not watching the Ulster game but a few years ago I would have said Baloucoune was quite strong in defence.

He just hasn't been the same player since the injury he got as he was knocking on the Ireland door imo.

I do think there is a certain fragility to Ulster players though. Not sure if they have anyone for mental skills on staff?

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

I call BS on coaching and culture in general, you don't get to No1 and maintain it without that in spades, however if your not playing for Leinster or Munster maybe you don't get the same feeling of involvement and different treatment rightly or wrongly.

Rory Best was captain for 4 years and it didn't help. Their results and tendency to build themselves up only to fall flat supports this.

Connacht rarely have players knocking on the door given the lack of resources but when they do they tend to take their opportunities.

They have similar resources to Munster and arguably stronger feeder schools and have never really been able to make it click.

They've always reminded me of Scotland on a smaller scale and there's definitely a culture issue there.

 

[Jimbo]

Just goes to show even with a scrummager as good as Kits it's still an 8 man effort.

 

[TopTen2003]

Quins have scrummaged well today haven't they- given Kischoff is in the opposing front row that must be a fairly noteworthy performance?

 

[Jimbo]

Rory Best was captain for 4 years and it didn't help. Their results and tendency to build themselves up only to fall flat supports this.

Connacht rarely have players knocking on the door given the lack of resources but when they do they tend to take their opportunities.

They have similar resources to Munster and arguably stronger feeder schools and have never really been able to make it click.

They've always reminded me of Scotland on a smaller scale and there's definitely a culture issue there.

Sorry maybe I got crossed wires, I was suggesting the culture/coaching of the Ireland setup not being the problem as that's what I thought was being suggested, not Ulster themselves.

 

[TopTen2003]

Dombrandt has had a good game- I just fear he's caught somewhere between being a great club player and not quite having that extra couple of percent to translate into a top test player.

Really hope he proves that wrong and has a belting 6N.

 

[Jimbo]

That's filth from Quins!

 

[BPM]

Dombrandt has had a good game- I just fear he's caught somewhere between being a great club player and not quite having that extra couple of percent to translate into a top test player.

Really hope he proves that wrong and has a belting 6N.

Well this will be his 3rd or 4th standout appearance in a row in the Champions Cup so it's not just domestic form.

If England allow him to play a bit more of his natural game, I think he can do it.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Two dropped balls, switching off for a quick line out and an intercept…

This could be a one score game.

 

[Scotty]

Well this will be his 3rd or 4th standout appearance in a row in the Champions Cup so it's not just domestic form.

If England allow him to play a bit more of his natural game, I think he can do it.

Exactly this if Dombrandt is asked to be Billy, then leave him at home. He runs good lines, passes well and is great at the breakdown. Pair him with a physical flank like CCS(this game) or Underhill allow him to play his game.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Dombrandt has had a good game- I just fear he's caught somewhere between being a great club player and not quite having that extra couple of percent to translate into a top test player.

Really hope he proves that wrong and has a belting 6N.

TBH the big thing stopping him being good internationally was he developed awful butterfingers and was constantly knocking on. If he makes them stick like he does at the club game, he will look much better internationally. That and if England actually look to make line breaks rather than just trying nothing but bulldozing into the nearest defender or kicking.