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Heineken Cup Quarter Final: Saracens v Clermont - 08/04/2012
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Mr.cyclopede
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Looks like Lyon (the city or the foot club) refused the rugby date
Edit: It's the football club who refused, the same usual pretext of the field conditions after a rugby match...
Edit: It's the football club who refused, the same usual pretext of the field conditions after a rugby match...
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gingergenius
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I didn't get to see the game but it's clear Saracens have some head-scratching to do and Clermont don't... I thought even before the match that Leinster looked about a mile better than any other team in Europe, so I doubt we could have turned them over at Twickenham anyway.
It's clear that the salary cap has a detrimental effect on the depth and quality of English squads. It's also clear that this did not have anything to do with the Clermont match.
Saracens are still a good team, they're still English champions, they've done very well in 5 out of 7 Heineken games this season and they're still well-placed to defend their trophy. Panic stations it is not.
But this defeat (and the one to Quins & Saints earlier in the season) shows us several things., mainlly that we don't seem to have a plan B.
Saracens win big games with dominant forward displays, dogged defence and efficient kicking.
I've no complaints about kicking, but there's several times this season our defence has been stretched. We can cope with missing Kelly Brown, and we can cope with missing Jacques Burger, but we can't cope with missing both of them. Missing Saull isn't too helpful either, and considering Joubert's been off colour this season, it leaves our back row looking like a major weak point.
A dominant scrum is also essential, and Saracens have lost this. Gill has come on leaps and bounds, and with an in-form Nieto, that's a good prop pairing. But Nieto's off form and I personally don't want to see Stevens near our starting lineup for the rest of the season, because he leaks penalties and is as consistent at scrum time as Cian Healy. Saracens really need to get rid of Nieto/ Stevens over the summer and sign a quality tighthead.
The backline is not so much of a problem. Yes our attack is blunt, but it's better on paper than we had last season... any half-decent backline looks good behind a dominant forward pack, and I feel its the lack of the latter that has exposed our poor cutting edge. It would help, of course, if Strettle was in form, but he's been shite for the last couple months. Maybe signing someone like Matt Tait or a younger Ratuvou might give us other options at 13.
It's clear that the salary cap has a detrimental effect on the depth and quality of English squads. It's also clear that this did not have anything to do with the Clermont match.
Saracens are still a good team, they're still English champions, they've done very well in 5 out of 7 Heineken games this season and they're still well-placed to defend their trophy. Panic stations it is not.
But this defeat (and the one to Quins & Saints earlier in the season) shows us several things., mainlly that we don't seem to have a plan B.
Saracens win big games with dominant forward displays, dogged defence and efficient kicking.
I've no complaints about kicking, but there's several times this season our defence has been stretched. We can cope with missing Kelly Brown, and we can cope with missing Jacques Burger, but we can't cope with missing both of them. Missing Saull isn't too helpful either, and considering Joubert's been off colour this season, it leaves our back row looking like a major weak point.
A dominant scrum is also essential, and Saracens have lost this. Gill has come on leaps and bounds, and with an in-form Nieto, that's a good prop pairing. But Nieto's off form and I personally don't want to see Stevens near our starting lineup for the rest of the season, because he leaks penalties and is as consistent at scrum time as Cian Healy. Saracens really need to get rid of Nieto/ Stevens over the summer and sign a quality tighthead.
The backline is not so much of a problem. Yes our attack is blunt, but it's better on paper than we had last season... any half-decent backline looks good behind a dominant forward pack, and I feel its the lack of the latter that has exposed our poor cutting edge. It would help, of course, if Strettle was in form, but he's been shite for the last couple months. Maybe signing someone like Matt Tait or a younger Ratuvou might give us other options at 13.
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Steven's looks like he's packed on a load of weight since the RWC as well.
It's as if he was working incredibly hard to get back in to the England squad/to the WC, now he is/has he's let it go and he's got a bigger belly than Caucau...
It's as if he was working incredibly hard to get back in to the England squad/to the WC, now he is/has he's let it go and he's got a bigger belly than Caucau...
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I was there and took a very nervous young nephew who was immediately freaked out by all the noise before getting into it with gusto, maybe something for child psychologists to research: do Rugby crowds help shy kids? 
Anyway he may have enjoyed his day out but I certainly didn't. Possibly the poorest performance by Sarries I've seen for a while now and I'm worried it goes beyond missing guys like Brown, Burger, Saul, etc.
For about 60 minutes or so until Nieto, Wray, etc came on there honestly did not seem to be any major urgency that you see with the Leinsters or Ulsters or...well...Clermonts of this world! The way passes were bouncing out of hands or the lazy passing at times from both De Kock and Wiggy was worthy of multiple facepalms and no matter how hard Hodgson tried (and to his credit he bloody tried his hardest) out of that back line only Strettle (worth every penny btw) really looked interested in making any headway.
We may have complaints about the salary cap but I honestly don't think it is valid when you have teams like Leicester and Saints who with clever purchases and stringent regimes have either made it to finals or won the damn thing. On a budget. Against teams with spending power far outstripping their own.
I think if we had a full strength team on Sunday with a plan B or even a plan C that would have been irrelevant because the overall attitude would have cost us the game anyway and that is immensely disappointing. Its something I sincerely hope Farrell, McCall and Venter have stern words for these guys today because if they keep playing like that whoever we get in the Premiership semis will be seriously entertaining thoughts of an easy route A to Twickenham...
EDIT: Also if the match is in France with a massive Clermont crowd then well...heh Leinster better get ready for some noise...haven't seen a foreign contingent raid an English ground so successfully since Munster sacked the Shed at Kingsholm....
Anyway he may have enjoyed his day out but I certainly didn't. Possibly the poorest performance by Sarries I've seen for a while now and I'm worried it goes beyond missing guys like Brown, Burger, Saul, etc.
For about 60 minutes or so until Nieto, Wray, etc came on there honestly did not seem to be any major urgency that you see with the Leinsters or Ulsters or...well...Clermonts of this world! The way passes were bouncing out of hands or the lazy passing at times from both De Kock and Wiggy was worthy of multiple facepalms and no matter how hard Hodgson tried (and to his credit he bloody tried his hardest) out of that back line only Strettle (worth every penny btw) really looked interested in making any headway.
We may have complaints about the salary cap but I honestly don't think it is valid when you have teams like Leicester and Saints who with clever purchases and stringent regimes have either made it to finals or won the damn thing. On a budget. Against teams with spending power far outstripping their own.
I think if we had a full strength team on Sunday with a plan B or even a plan C that would have been irrelevant because the overall attitude would have cost us the game anyway and that is immensely disappointing. Its something I sincerely hope Farrell, McCall and Venter have stern words for these guys today because if they keep playing like that whoever we get in the Premiership semis will be seriously entertaining thoughts of an easy route A to Twickenham...
EDIT: Also if the match is in France with a massive Clermont crowd then well...heh Leinster better get ready for some noise...haven't seen a foreign contingent raid an English ground so successfully since Munster sacked the Shed at Kingsholm....
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