England Six Nations Squad 2025

[Lé Ddanno]

Have we though?

I get @IT157's point and I mostly agree but right now, Atkinson is the only one I think is weirdly overlooked.

Ojomoh is clearly liked and I expect him to get some game time over the summer.

Hartley is only just getting back into his stride after a long injury lay off. He hasn't really done anything to warrant being selected at the moment but still has plenty of time to come good.

Woodward and Waghorn have made promising starts but are literally a few games into their senior careers.

We might regret losing Kelly but being behind Kata or playing at 13 didn't really help his cause or scream 'pick me'.

I meant EQP 12s in total, not 12s being overlooked. We don't have a huge pool to draw from is all

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Dingwall did what was expected which was be solid, his defence was good and he did his job. England looked better, need to see him against a proper tier 1 team though but hearing that quote must tank your motivation.

 

[Lé Ddanno]

Dingwall did what was expected which was be solid, his defence was good and he did his job. England looked better, need to see him against a proper tier 1 team though but hearing that quote must tank your motivation.

Got no complaints about his playing, but also barely noticed him. He's like a workhorse 6 just getting on with it. Hard to evaluate.

 

[Geordie]

Yes just none of the 12s can match the physical requirements of today's 12s. It's back to the dump truck with hands.

Hartley might be an option but otherwise there's mostly medium weight lads. So I can definitely see the interest in moving Earl. I like the idea but then I'm a huge fan of Earl one of England's best players currently. The move is especially good when England have large number of back rowers.

Question is...would Earl be up for it and would Saracens.

 

[Lé Ddanno]

**** it, if we're putting CCS at lock, Heyes is finishing like a winger, Freeman at 13, Marcus at 15 then why not. Earl is now 12.

 

[Geordie]

Id sooner Ollie Hartley just step up.

How do you balance that back row with 3 class options like the Currys and Earl...and two big uns like CCS and Willis?

And that's without Pollock in contention just yet.

 

[Lé Ddanno]

Id sooner Ollie Hartley just step up.

How do you balance that back row with 3 class options like the Currys and Earl...and two big uns like CCS and Willis?

And that's without Pollock in contention just yet.

I really think Willis should be starting, he's been incredibly destructive in the carry* and the tackle**. Today wasn't his greatest but he wasn't given much of a chance coming on at 65m, packing down at 6 - but still assisted a try

*He almost never goes down without ground or 2-3 defenders

**Absolutely smashes

 

[Geordie]

I really think Willis should be starting, he's been incredibly destructive in the carry* and the tackle**. Today wasn't his greatest but he wasn't given much of a chance coming on at 65m, packing down at 6 - but still assisted a try

*He almost never goes down without ground or 2-3 defenders

**Absolutely smashes

Yeah I really do like the idea of having CCS or Willis on that back row. Both about 19 stone, 6'4/ 6'5 that's a huge unit.

Then the choice between the Curries and Earl. The Curries are probably more refined technically...but Earl is just raw explosive power (not quite Underhill's level) pace and insane fitness/ endurance.

Earl at 12 though...very interesting....

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Must be disheartening if you are an English 12 and you're being overlooked by a back rower.

Yes. But I don't have a great deal of sympathy. IF Earl's the best option then play him, end of. Wouldn't compromise the back row, although remains to be seen whether Earl really does have the all round game and positional awareness.

Any others feeling aggrieved will simply have to take a long hard look in the mirror to ask why he's been picked and what they can do better.

IF he ends up there and consistently makes a couple of metres through fairly direct running to get on the front foot….isn't that exactly how M Smith thrived playing off Esterhuizen for Quins? Just saying.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Be interesting to see if this filters through to what Saracens do with Earl, seeing as he's on a central contract

 

[Lé Ddanno]

Be interesting to see if this filters through to what Saracens do with Earl, seeing as he's on a central contract

He's basically Brad Barritt that can attack and pass, so I don't see them being against the idea

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

He's basically Brad Barritt that can attack and pass, so I don't see them being against the idea

Yep, but I guess it depends what their strength is in both positions, where they've spent their money, how that would fit in with the style they've been trying to develop etc.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

While it's great in theory and yes he made meters, most forwards would but there is much more to a 12 than that. Find it shocking that Earl could ever be better option than any of our other 12s simply because he made yards in contact. So would ccs, so would curry.

 

[BPM]

Got no complaints about his playing, but also barely noticed him. He's like a workhorse 6 just getting on with it. Hard to evaluate.

Unseen work is often some of the most important.

I can't be bothered to try to track down the post, but on a recent discussion re. Seb Atkinson, I mentioned that he has exactly this problem. What he and Dingwall both do is rarely going to make highlight reels and isn't going to make for eye-catching stats.

Both are very good at picking the right option to create space whether that's the timing of a pass, carrying at the right time or running genuinely convincing decoy lines. None of those things look outstanding but are critical to their teams' attack and often key to getting the ball wide.

This is also why I said that Dingwall's performances might help to pave the way for Atkinson.

Having said all that, I wouldn't be against the Earl experiment as long as he's doing it at club level too. I can see definite positives for Saracens. They're fairly well stocked in the back row and don't have outstanding options at 12. It's a shame Christie is injured as he's more than good enough to be their 7 which would have made it an easier decision. The obvious downside/irony is that Olly Hartley would likely be the fall guy, which would be blocking a high potential player who is actually a 12 …

In any case, I think it's very likely Earl is selected for the Lions which would likely mean any plans for this would probably be on ice until next season.

 

[Geordie]

Unseen work is often some of the most important.

I can't be bothered to try to track down the post, but on a recent discussion re. Seb Atkinson, I mentioned that he has exactly this problem. What he and Dingwall both do is rarely going to make highlight reels and isn't going to make for eye-catching stats.

Both are very good at picking the right option to create space whether that's the timing of a pass, carrying at the right time or running genuinely convincing decoy lines. None of those things look outstanding but are critical to their teams' attack and often key to getting the ball wide.

This is also why I said that Dingwall's performances might help to pave the way for Atkinson.

Having said all that, I wouldn't be against the Earl experiment as long as he's doing it at club level too. I can see definite positives for Saracens. They're fairly well stocked in the back row and don't have outstanding options at 12. It's a shame Christie is injured as he's more than good enough to be their 7 which would have made it an easier decision. The obvious downside/irony is that Olly Hartley would likely be the fall guy, which would be blocking a high potential player who is actually a 12 …

In any case, I think it's very likely Earl is selected for the Lions which would likely mean any plans for this would probably be on ice until next season.

Earl could very well go on the lions.

I would prefer an actual 12 to come through. Now if thats Dingwall, Atkinson then fine, but Olly Hartley is the one ive pinned my hopes to. 6'5 big unit, runs great lines, very good hands in contact (offloading etc)...we just need to see that come together at Prem level and then international. Id push for a bigger squad and take a few centres thats for sure.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Hoping Woodward will step up as Kelly's replacement

 

[Geordie]

Hoping Woodward will step up as Kelly's replacement

He looks a good player from the brief times ive seen him.

 

[mikebrownsauce1512]

I always think Earl is really short - probably just from how stocky he is

Same he always looks wider than he is tall.

^Ben Earl^

 

[mikebrownsauce1512]

Got no complaints about his playing, but also barely noticed him. He's like a workhorse 6 just getting on with it. Hard to evaluate.

I agree, all though i do think he was better than Slade.