England Post-WC discussion

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

So according to most of you "experts" on here kvesic is the only 7 in the whole world and no one else could play 7, especially not Clifford who might be better at rucking isn't seen as a genuine 7????

Really

I don't have a particular position on Clifford being a 6 or a 7 but certainly the stats ratsapprentice posted comparing all EPS squad members showed that Clifford, just like Robshaw, has not been at all comparable to the levels of turnover achieved by Kvesic or Fraser. Or Haskell for that matter.

 

[JJFlash]

Cipriani must be extremely ****** off not to be in the squad.
OK, as a poster wrote earlier, he is a bit of a loose cannon, but isn't that what England rugby needs - particularly from the replacements' bench?
I can't help thinking that if he were French, Guy Noves would have him in his squad.
Also, I don't understand what Haskell is going to bring. Is he picked as a 6 or 7? Either way, I wouldn't pick him.
My other wing forward candidates would be Sale's Seymour and Tigers' O'Connor, who may get their chance in the summer.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Cipriani must be extremely ****** off not to be in the squad.
OK, as a poster wrote earlier, he is a bit of a loose cannon, but isn't that what England rugby needs - particularly from the replacements' bench?
I can't help thinking that if he were French, Guy Noves would have him in his squad.
Also, I don't understand what Haskell is going to bring. Is he picked as a 6 or 7? Either way, I wouldn't pick him.
My other wing forward candidates would be Sale's Seymour and Tigers' O'Connor, who may get their chance in the summer.

Cipriani can't be in the team with his kicking percentage though. He should be kicking himself that he hasn't worked on it more (get the pun).

When you have Haskell, wood and robshaw, you don't have enough changes to get rid of them all and you need experience. Wood was the right man to go.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Seymour is so overrated.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Seymour is so overrated.

by....Olyy?
Hard to be overrated when most don't appear to rate you!

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

by....Olyy?
Hard to be overrated when most don't appear to rate you!

It's called baiting.

Anyway, Telegraph saying that Jones has told Youngs to work on his tackling and carrying.

That has to be wrong out of all the things to tell Tom to work on Carrying isn't one and Tackling certainly isn't one.

Surely must be wrong or maybe Eddie got Tom mixed up with Hartley?

 

[Crapspray]

I'm taking everything the press write with a massive pinch of salt. Most of what they're writing at the moment is speculation shoddily built on top of the really obvious decisions. They're clearly clamouring to get inside the coaching team, but have lost their Lancaster-era sources. Most of the pre-selection guff was just scuttlebutt heard around premiership grounds.

I probably prefer a coach who keeps everyone guessing than one whose selection is leaked a week in advance. And I doubt this 33 is anything like Jones' ideal or contains more than 60 - 70% of the players he wants in 2019.

 

[Peat]

^ truth.

I doubt Jones even knows his ideal at the moment. He's picked the team he's inherited with a few stand-out young players as a starting point, that's all.

 

[JJFlash]

EJ has been shackled, I believe, by a daft RFU restriction of changes that he could make to the squad.
Does anyone know when he'll be free to pick and drop players without these restrictions?

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

What does everyone make of the following EJ comments:

"In this squad of 33 there are four or five players who, if they change their attitude, can become world-class players," said the 55-year-old.

is it quite a negative message to give the squad, that only 4 or 5 can make world class players?
or is it rather a bit of an attempt at making people think "I'm going to be that player"

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Did he say Only?

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Did he say Only?

if you say "in this squad of 33 there are 4 or 5 guys ho can be world class players", the implication is very obvious; you don't need to say the word only.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

So it's all down to Manu...at 12.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/six-nation...-englands-version-all-black-legend-ma-1537800

If that's the pattern he wants to play - big bosher with a speed merchant outside, where does that leave Slade when he returns? My guess is having to concentrate on 10, unless he wants to become bench fodder.

 

[Jakedood]

I've been hearing somewhere that Dave ewers, as a registered back up player for the World Cup, actually was considered a registered member of the EPS and therefore he either had to be dropped or have an injury replacement, so maybe we're looking at that Kvesic thing the wrong way? Not 100% sure how accurate that is though!

Also in regards to reports of Haskell at 7... this seems to have been made on the idea that George Smith has been working with him, EJ wants Smith to help in some shape or form with breakdown, and because EJ said he could potentially play 7. The Telegraph seem to have used these as a way of saying he's the nailed on starter however I don't think we'll actually have any clue what the plan is until the team is released, he seems to be doing very well at keeping his cards close to his chest, and not letting the players know about what he's doing or his team plans until just before he tells the press, threfore leaving no time for word of mouth to spread the news prematurely, whereas Lancaster often let his 1st XV be known long before the press announcement!

However EJ's quotes from the press conference were absolutely spot on, regarding the development of players and what England need to do, addressing that what we have done is wrong. If he actually makes players complain because of the hard work, then well done to him, because that'll be a clear sign that he is indeed doing something different!

 

[Peat]

What does everyone make of the following EJ comments:

"In this squad of 33 there are four or five players who, if they change their attitude, can become world-class players," said the 55-year-old.

is it quite a negative message to give the squad, that only 4 or 5 can make world class players?
or is it rather a bit of an attempt at making people think "I'm going to be that player"

I'm reading that a bit different. I'm reading him saying there's four of five who need to pull their fingers out, not that they're the only four or five.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

I'm reading that a bit different. I'm reading him saying there's four of five who need to pull their fingers out, not that they're the only four or five.

That's how I'm reading it.

 

[optimuswolf]

Wonder who those 4 or 5 are?

Manu (obvious)
B Youngs?
Yarde?
Lawes?
Any others who could be said to have much greater potential than they've shown consistently?

 

[ncurd]

Has manu showed a lack of consistency bar being injured?

 

[Peat]

Wonder who those 4 or 5 are?

Manu (obvious)
B Youngs?
Yarde?
Lawes?
Any others who could be said to have much greater potential than they've shown consistently?

Tbh, in our squad, it'd be easier to pick out the 4-5 that *don't* need to pull their fingers out.

 

[Duck a l'Orange]

Has manu showed a lack of consistency bar being injured?

Hard to tell. He's been out for a year and a half.

All 25 minutes he's played since coming back have been good though, so we can only hope.