England EPS 2017/18 edition.

[TRF_Olyy]

So disappointing that Piers Francis is injured, he showed a lot of promise in Argentina.
Anyone know when he's due back?

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

The problem with JJ is Bath retain the ball the least of any side and have not given him space to work for years now. His decision making hasn't been bad but he rarely gets the ball without 1 or 2 defenders already being right on him, he just doesn't have the room to work any more. England have showed what he can do when he is given that bit of space. TBH I'm not keen on really including T'eo except when necessary, he's done well but is someone nearing the end of his career whilst the other centre options are either at the start or mid way through.

To me 12 is the more pressing concern. Farrell can do a job there but if he is unavailable there then what do we do next?

If Farrell is injured i would look at either T'eo, Loz maybe.


Francis is the biggest solution.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

If Farrell is injured i would look at either T'eo, Loz maybe.


Francis is the biggest solution.

That's the thing, Loz is another 10 convert unless I'm mistaken and T'eo would require playing a very different game.

 

[curtbob7]

That's the thing, Loz is another 10 convert unless I'm mistaken and T'eo would require playing a very different game.

Stick Slade at 12.

Devoto?

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

10) Ford
12) T'eo
13) slade/Daly.

Would be my look.

Devoto would be a good shout.

 

[Which Tyler]

I still think Devoto's going to be great; and that his main contender for IC is Slade. The alternatives are different types of player IMO (converted FHs or Boshers - you could argue that those 2 are also converted FHs; but that would require them to be better at playing FH than they are).
Is he going to be back in time for the AIs though?

 

[curtbob7]

Can safely say that our centres aren't close to NZ level.

 

[Which Tyler]

Agreed - we have a couple of OCs who could get there though... if they're willing/able to put the work into improving their game.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Francis starting for Northampton A team tonight.

 

[BPM]

The problem with JJ is Bath retain the ball the least of any side and have not given him space to work for years now. His decision making hasn't been bad but he rarely gets the ball without 1 or 2 defenders already being right on him, he just doesn't have the room to work any more. England have showed what he can do when he is given that bit of space. TBH I'm not keen on really including T'eo except when necessary, he's done well but is someone nearing the end of his career whilst the other centre options are either at the start or mid way through.

To me 12 is the more pressing concern. Farrell can do a job there but if he is unavailable there then what do we do next?

This was very evident in yesterday's game. Prior to the try, I don't recall seeing Joseph receive the ball in space once. Considering the try was 70+ minutes in to the game, I think it's fair to say he's lacking in opportunities to show what he can do. The first bit of space he got, he created a try. Obviously that's not going to happen every time he gets the ball in space, but Bath's current style of play is doing him no favours.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

This was very evident in yesterday's game. Prior to the try, I don't recall seeing Joseph receive the ball in space once. Considering the try was 70+ minutes in to the game, I think it's fair to say he's lacking in opportunities to show what he can do. The first bit of space he got, he created a try. Obviously that's not going to happen every time he gets the ball in space, but Bath's current style of play is doing him no favours.

I think England vs Scotland showed what he can offer when he actually has some space to run rather than always being closed down. Even the best footwork can't do much when you have no space to operate. Not sure what we are going to use going forward but we really need Farrell presenting a better running threat at 12 to keep the defences tight and possibly a runner off his right shoulder so they can't all just drift across to JJ. Watson is also looking pretty good at FB and having JJ, Watson and May/Daly stacking the left wing with space will scare anyone.

 

[Scotty]

Don't think anyone is denying Nowells class but personally I love the balance of a back 3 with May (pace and finisher), Daly(pace, boot) and Watson (high ball, attacking, pace). Nowell covering because he can play FB and WG.

Watson WG FB
Daly OC WG FB
Nowell WG FB CT(only in emergancies but not terrible there but wouldnt choose it)
May...WG all he has is pace.

I prefer daly watson nowell may on the bench.
Nowell is obv outpaced by may but nowell will save tries with a solid relentless workrate. He breaks the line and gets on the front foot. He makes breaks amd in the 22 is a damn good finisher.

May will out pace the best of them top end and is a lethal finisher when given space (but if thats what you want then take roko) but doesnt have the acceleration of watson daly and isnt much quicker off the line than nowell.

His pace against tired legs in the last 20 can make the difference but to get a win id go with nowell for his work rate in attack and defence

But thats just my opinion. Browns hard to drop because he is solid and with watson on the wing last season there wasnt a solid FB with experience and game time week by week. Brown is good in defence and great under a high ball and not to bad in attack but abit lacking. This needs to be watsons year with brown as cover at first on the bench or watson at 23 to come on for brown to start with although be a shame to not start watson.

 

[Scotty]

The bigger issue for england is if we play the ford-faz combo and slade comes good at 13 as EJ wants

Firstly ford faz, it works but only if the fwds are making metres and presenting quick ball. Thats only way we get ball to the danger men out wide which we have a few

Secondly is slade. He has the potential to be a great 13 for england. Maybe needs another season but definatly has the talant and EJ sees him as only 13 so thats that. But cant have Ford Faz slade, not enough running threat to interest a world class defence meaning the defence would close down the wingers space.

So if slade plays 13 then who plays 10/12? Any thoughts? Teo? Does francais have a running threat? Or who else is there?.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

May has great acceleration.

In other news Protheroe made a cracking assist in the Bristol game.

 

[Scotty]

May has great acceleration.

In other news Protheroe made a cracking assist in the Bristol game.

Does he? I know hes quick but put him watson nowell and daly on the try line and check whos ahead at the 22 and half way. Watson and daly handsdown have the 22. Not saying may is slow but still

 

[curtbob7]

Watson WG FB
Daly OC WG FB
Nowell WG FB CT(only in emergancies but not terrible there but wouldnt choose it)
May...WG all he has is pace.

I prefer daly watson nowell may on the bench.
Nowell is obv outpaced by may but nowell will save tries with a solid relentless workrate. He breaks the line and gets on the front foot. He makes breaks amd in the 22 is a damn good finisher.

May will out pace the best of them top end and is a lethal finisher when given space (but if thats what you want then take roko) but doesnt have the acceleration of watson daly and isnt much quicker off the line than nowell.

His pace against tired legs in the last 20 can make the difference but to get a win id go with nowell for his work rate in attack and defence

But thats just my opinion. Browns hard to drop because he is solid and with watson on the wing last season there wasnt a solid FB with experience and game time week by week. Brown is good in defence and great under a high ball and not to bad in attack but abit lacking. This needs to be watsons year with brown as cover at first on the bench or watson at 23 to come on for brown to start with although be a shame to not start watson.

There's absolutely no doubt that May is in better form than Nowell right now. Have you watched May this season? He's finishing his chances, working tirelessly on and off the ball. Breaking the line. Offloading and saving tries.

 

[Which Tyler]

There's absolutely no doubt that May is in better form than Nowell right now. Have you watched May this season? He's finishing his chances, working tirelessly on and off the ball. Breaking the line. Offloading and saving tries.

Change an opinion on a player based on recent evidence rather than their breakthrough season?
Over my dead body will I do such a thing!

 

[curtbob7]

Change an opinion on a player based on recent evidence rather than their breakthrough season?
Over my dead body will I do such a thing!

To be fair I love Nowell's flexibility and willingness to compete at the breakdown so when play is more broken ill chuck him on off the bench.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

For our current style of play we need to keep a second FH at 12 (or a distributor if you want to call it that).

That means are options are Francais, Slade, Loz or Dovoto. If Slade is just seen as a 13 then it shortens the list some more.

We do need some size in the backline but it can be off the wing rather than the centres.

 

[FLOBALOB]

There's absolutely no doubt that May is in better form than Nowell right now. Have you watched May this season? He's finishing his chances, working tirelessly on and off the ball. Breaking the line. Offloading and saving tries.

Ive watched May this season and i'm not sure he's quite as hot as what you think .Fair enough hes finished off a few tries, but so have a lot of wingers .Taking last weeks game I thought he was virtually invisible when compared to Woodburn, who ,for me, was the best winger on the park. The stats prove this;
P R M CB DB
J May 5 7 46 2 4
Woodburn 5 17 87 1 6

To me , he always looks like a fish out of water when he tries to get involved in the game away from his wing especially when you compare him to Nowell , who ,being an all round rugby player finds it come naturally.