England 6 Nation squad 2024

[higgik]

Jordie had played centre 10 times for his club before he played there for the ABs and 12 was his first choice position at Hurricanes before he settled there for the ABs

I'm all for building units that work but not debuting players in vastly different positions against the best team in the world (suck it RSA)

Steward played there in academy

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

To be fair to SB, professional rugby players should be able to pass and catch without coaching. That isn't something he's coached out of them.

Their club form would contradict that.

 

[higgik]

Yeah but those NZ players have a far better skillset.

True, but why???

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Steward played there in academy

Sinckler played 10 at age grade

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

To be fair to SB, professional rugby players should be able to pass and catch without coaching. That isn't something he's coached out of them.

Evidence suggests otherwise. Something about being with England is causing these players to fail at even the basics.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

25 points worse off vs last year, we are officially getting worse.

Let's board the sack SB train.

 

[Rugbyfan564]

25 points worse off vs last year, we are officially getting worse.

Let's board the sack SB train.

Who is currently unemployed? Because only someone without a job is replacing him for cost reasons.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Give it dimes until the end of the RWC cycle

Realistically there is no one and even if there were would we trust the RFU to select them? They've chosen Skivington as the A team coach ffs

 

[Rugbyfan564]

Give it dimes until the end of the RWC cycle

Realistically there is no one and even if there were would we trust the RFU to select them? They've chosen Skivington as the A team coach ffs

The RFU were reported when Jones went as having specifically having decided an English only policy. I am not sure that has changed.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Who is currently unemployed? Because only someone without a job is replacing him for cost reasons.

I'd have an unemployed mentally retarded person off the street instead of Borthick.

He's arrogant and can only use a spreadsheet and not his eyes.

 

[Rugbyfan564]

I wonder if having appearance fees causes squad tensions when those who do not get selected don't get paid But have still done all the training.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Sinckler played 10 at age grade

I meannnnn

 

[BrokenWing]

Who is currently unemployed? Because only someone without a job is replacing him for cost reasons.

He isn't getting sacked for cost reasons.

 

[TommiG88]

I'm done with England until Borthwick is gone. But Borthwick isn't the problem, the old stains above him.

 

[Saintjay]

True, but why???

Just ask yourself why are Ireland better than us. It's not individual talent.

I remember the All or Nothing with the All Blacks. Hansen is b@llocking a player for not getting his hands above waist height ready to receive a pass. If catching a high ball then elbows in, palms to god. Simple, just simple basics.

At the moment it's tactics and not a settled squad. Saints have a squad built around the players and a game plan that suits. At the moment we are simply a freaky frankenstein's love child of wanting to attack like the All Blacks and play like SA. Ending up jack of all trades and masters of none.

 

[Rugbyfan564]

Just ask yourself why are Ireland better than us. It's not individual talent.

I remember the All or Nothing with the All Blacks. Hansen is b@llocking a player for not getting his hands above waist height ready to receive a pass. If catching a high ball then elbows in, palms to god. Simple, just simple basics.

At the moment it's tactics and not a settled squad. Saints have a squad built around the players and a game plan that suits. At the moment we are simply a freaky frankenstein's love child of wanting to attack like the All Blacks and play like SA. Ending up jack of all trades and masters of none.

I think the limited number of players who have made their place their own is a big issue. Even including those misimg through injury. The best teams in sports are nearly always the most settled.

 

[TommiG88]

Some changes are needed for the next game.

1) Martin in for Chessum. He's been woeful these last 3 games.
2) Drop Roots - Replace with Barbeary or Pearson. If Barbeary comes in, move Underhill to 6, Earl to 7
3) Put Randall on the bench over Spencer. We needed pace, yet got a ponderous display
4) Drop Daly, replace with IFW
5) Bring back Steward if you're not going to change the up and under tactic


I don't know where to start with the centre partnership. Ford, slade and Lawrence looked like they met on the morning of the game. Was Lawrence fully fit?

Is Marcus Smith fit for Ireland?

 

[Duck a l'Orange]

now where to start with the centre partnership. Ford, slade and Lawrence looked like they met on the morning of the game. Was Lawrence fully fit?

Lawrence looked like England's best player coming on at the World Cup. Powerful and energetic, made a few important interventions by trying where others had already abandoned.

He was god awful yesterday, but so was nearly every individual performance. I'm not going to pass judgement on players trying to do well in such a poor side. I really don't think selection is the issue.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

Scotland was always going to be the season defining game and the season is now defined.

I feel sorry for Borthwick in the sense that he's had to deal with a lot of retirements, injuries and departures to France. However I didn't feel he was the right man for the job, still don't and he just seems a bit confused.

Now likely to finish behind Sco, Fra and Ire. How many of our players would those teams want?

In the front row Marler might make the Scottish team but that's about it. George encapsulates some of our problems well - he's a good guy who's enduring a terrible personal period, for which he gets everyone's total sympathy. But away from that - he'd been overtaken by LCD pre injury and while Dan's a little way off, you can see why SB's interested in him. Playing OK, but past his peak. He has no captaincy experience and I'm pretty sure wouldn't make the Irish, French or Scottish teams.

In the row Martin might be of the most interest. Itoje and Chessum might occasionally appeal but neither make a compelling case. I like a lot about Chessum, but would be locking him in the weights room over the summer.

Back row isn't balanced. Roots isn't of the required standard. Underhill is but he's not quite at full throttle. Earl's going well but wouldn't make the Irish or French teams at 8 - where he eventually fits in will be interesting. We have players to return / develop who will make this unit stronger.

9's been an Achilles heel for years. Look at the influence Dupont, JGP and even White have on their teams. JVP and Mitchell have shown glimpses but nothing sustained. Maybe only Ita might consider one of our 9s.

At 10, Ford's right out of form. I don't think Ita would consider him, maybe only Wal might, but he'd be of no interest to Ire, Fra or Sco.

In the centres Aki, Tuipolotu and Danty are all powerhouses. North for Wal too. Lawrence isn't quite that type, but he's better than he looked yesterday. Manu was a game changing powerhouse but isn't now, although could see him lining up alongside Lawrence next time out. Midfield still a mess though.

On the wings, the top 3 have Penaud, McVdM and Lowe all of whom can be match winners in their own ways - we just haven't had that since peak May and Watson. IFW looks like he's got something about him but he's still in short pants at club level, let alone internationally. Freeman also has potential.

Furbank's selection yesterday was odd. Steward's fine and has a point of difference. Doesn't have Keenan's all round skill set, but put a semi coherent back line around him and we'll see more of the attacking game of which he's quite capable. If 15 is a problem that needs fixing it's the least of them.

There's plenty of talent coming through - in some positions - but it'll be a while before we see the real benefits of those. Also the issue of continuity - Ire / Sco and Ita have major concentrations of their squad in one or two clubs while peak Fra usually have a large Toulouse representation. Our 23 yesterday had to meld 5 Sarries, 4 from Bath, 3 from each of Saints, Quins, Chiefs and Tigers plus a Shark and a Bear.

Not hopeful of seeing major improvement any time soon.

 

[Rugbyfan564]

Scotland was always going to be the season defining game and the season is now defined.

I feel sorry for Borthwick in the sense that he's had to deal with a lot of retirements, injuries and departures to France. However I didn't feel he was the right man for the job, still don't and he just seems a bit confused.

Now likely to finish behind Sco, Fra and Ire. How many of our players would those teams want?

In the front row Marler might make the Scottish team but that's about it. George encapsulates some of our problems well - he's a good guy who's enduring a terrible personal period, for which he gets everyone's total sympathy. But away from that - he'd been overtaken by LCD pre injury and while Dan's a little way off, you can see why SB's interested in him. Playing OK, but past his peak. He has no captaincy experience and I'm pretty sure wouldn't make the Irish, French or Scottish teams.

In the row Martin might be of the most interest. Itoje and Chessum might occasionally appeal but neither make a compelling case. I like a lot about Chessum, but would be locking him in the weights room over the summer.

Back row isn't balanced. Roots isn't of the required standard. Underhill is but he's not quite at full throttle. Earl's going well but wouldn't make the Irish or French teams at 8 - where he eventually fits in will be interesting. We have players to return / develop who will make this unit stronger.

9's been an Achilles heel for years. Look at the influence Dupont, JGP and even White have on their teams. JVP and Mitchell have shown glimpses but nothing sustained. Maybe only Ita might consider one of our 9s.

At 10, Ford's right out of form. I don't think Ita would consider him, maybe only Wal might, but he'd be of no interest to Ire, Fra or Sco.

In the centres Aki, Tuipolotu and Danty are all powerhouses. North for Wal too. Lawrence isn't quite that type, but he's better than he looked yesterday. Manu was a game changing powerhouse but isn't now, although could see him lining up alongside Lawrence next time out. Midfield still a mess though.

On the wings, the top 3 have Penaud, McVdM and Lowe all of whom can be match winners in their own ways - we just haven't had that since peak May and Watson. IFW looks like he's got something about him but he's still in short pants at club level, let alone internationally. Freeman also has potential.

Furbank's selection yesterday was odd. Steward's fine and has a point of difference. Doesn't have Keenan's all round skill set, but put a semi coherent back line around him and we'll see more of the attacking game of which he's quite capable. If 15 is a problem that needs fixing it's the least of them.

There's plenty of talent coming through - in some positions - but it'll be a while before we see the real benefits of those. Also the issue of continuity - Ire / Sco and Ita have major concentrations of their squad in one or two clubs while peak Fra usually have a large Toulouse representation. Our 23 yesterday had to meld 5 Sarries, 4 from Bath, 3 from each of Saints, Quins, Chiefs and Tigers plus a Shark and a Bear.

Not hopeful of seeing major improvement any time soon.

While Ford is out form I'm not sure Fra, Wal and Sco would be delighted with having statting Fin Smith either becuase of the lack of experience he has of international rugby.