Chariot repair shop - What to fix and change

[j'nuh]

Luckily there are two fullbacks in the EPS for Goode and two more wingers for Ashton, but yes it's a stupid system. Let's hope Lancaster takes a big touring party and finds a fudge to shuffle between the Saxons and the EPS. Ashton mysteriously disappears in downtown Buenos Aires for three weeks? After watching the Sarries game he looks like he could do with the rest, he was all over the place (mentally, sadly not literally).

I laughed, but I also feel a little scared. :huh:

 

[ratsapprentice]

"Chris had a really top game and got himself involved, for a guy who has taken his criticism over the last few weeks,"

- McCall

The guy is a lunatic. He had a really "top" game in which he was sent off for a tackle in which he displayed the same technique that he is being criticised for.
He has seeming taken the criticism and completely ignored it then?

 

[Crapspray]

I really don't understand how he got so far with such poor defence. Perhaps it wasn't that important for him when he played league, and he made up for it in attack, but for an international player (of either code) to have such poor technique is beyond belief. Furthermore, how coaches have left such a glaring flaw uncorrected is just as bad. Has no one taken him to one side and told him to go lower? Andy Farrell was supposed to be giving him one-on-one tackling lessons during the Six Nations camp; apparently he learnt bugger all from the experience. I think the only time I've ever seen such consistently poor tackling was when a wet mummy's boy turned up to under-9s and got smashed to bits. Even he managed to learn, albeit the hard way (ironically he ended up on the wing).

It's a shame really. If he learnt to tackle, and England started making consistent line-breaks, he'd be a decent club to have in the bag. As neither of those seem likely in the near-future, it seems he'll be spending a long time away from the national side.

 

[ratsapprentice]

He was actually sent off for one on one tutoring by England to fix his tackling after he picked up a load of yellows last year.
Which is one of the primary reasons the faith Lancaster showed in him was bewildering, as he should have known that it wasn't going to sort itself out in one match.

 

[psychic duck]

I really don't understand how he got so far with such poor defence. Perhaps it wasn't that important for him when he played league, and he made up for it in attack, but for an international player (of either code) to have such poor technique is beyond belief. Furthermore, how coaches have left such a glaring flaw uncorrected is just as bad. Has no one taken him to one side and told him to go lower? Andy Farrell was supposed to be giving him one-on-one tackling lessons during the Six Nations camp; apparently he learnt bugger all from the experience. I think the only time I've ever seen such consistently poor tackling was when a wet mummy's boy turned up to under-9s and got smashed to bits. Even he managed to learn, albeit the hard way (ironically he ended up on the wing).

Ronan O'Gara.
128 caps (2nd most capped international of all time)
3 times Lions tourist

 

[j'nuh]

He was kept in because 2 years ago he was good in attack.

tbf, I don't think he'll be sticking around for much longer. He was questioned by Lancaster during the 6N, and I'd guess was only kept because they wanted to stick with a winning team. After a 30-3 loss, they'll now be looking to make a small number of changes, and Ashton is the easiest target. And now Farrell is out with the Lions, he's not going to have that Sarries connection to fall back on.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Agreed, I think he'll lose his place this summer and will struggle to get it back.

 

[Ospreylian]

He was kept in because 2 years ago he was good in attack.

tbf, I don't think he'll be sticking around for much longer. He was questioned by Lancaster during the 6N, and I'd guess was only kept because they wanted to stick with a winning team. After a 30-3 loss, they'll now be looking to make a small number of changes, and Ashton is the easiest target. And now Farrell is out with the Lions, he's not going to have that Sarries connection to fall back on.

He was kept in because he does this amazing swallow dive that everyone loves to see! That dive is just pure class, no, WORLD class.

 

[Crapspray]

Ronan O'Gara.
128 caps (2nd most capped international of all time)
3 times Lions tourist

Touché.

 

[j'nuh]

Does anyone else feel that Tuilagi hasn't seemed to have developed all that much since the world cup? And that for such a big guy, he misses a hell of a lot of tackles? And that his position in the team may be a little taken for granted? And that putting him on the wing is a really, really silly idea until he's played there a little for club first?

Also, Dan Cole. This tournament is just about the worst I've seen him. Still decent at the breakdown, but where has his strength in the scrum gone? (Perhaps the blame could be more directed to Youngs? Mears used to be criticised as a scrummaging hooker because of his size. Maybe the same applies to Youngs?)

 

[Peat]

Does anyone else feel that Tuilagi hasn't seemed to have developed all that much since the world cup? And that for such a big guy, he misses a hell of a lot of tackles? And that his position in the team may be a little taken for granted? And that putting him on the wing is a really, really silly idea until he's played there a little for club first?

Also, Dan Cole. This tournament is just about the worst I've seen him. Still decent at the breakdown, but where has his strength in the scrum gone? (Perhaps the blame could be more directed to Youngs? Mears used to be criticised as a scrummaging hooker because of his size. Maybe the same applies to Youngs?)

Not much, his missed tackle count is exaggerated*, his position in the team is taken for granted as no one looks like taking it off him warts and all, and he has played wing for Leicester before, just not recently.

Cole hasn't had a great scrummaging tournament its true but scrums go wrong as units; maybe Youngs doesn't help at scrum-time, green looseheads certainly don't help, and neither does a relatively lightweight second row. Will be interesting to see how he goes on the Lions

*Tuilagi made 16, missed 2. BOD 33, 4; D'Arcy 10, 1; Marshall 10, 0; Fritz, 12, 1; Canale 30, 4; Garcia 13, 4; Benvenuti 10, 3; Scott 42, 9; Lamont 40, 7; Davies 19, 2; Roberts 24, 5; Twelvetrees 12, 2; Barritt, 32, 4

That's every centre who played a major part in the tournament (bar the French ones who the DT stuffed up on) - Tuilagi's miss rate is roughly equivalent with O'Driscoll and Barritt and a great deal better than most people there. Missed tackles and Tuilagi is becoming something of an accepted myth quite quickly for no good reason.

One might also say the same about Roberts and defensive excellent the next time it comes up too now it's there...

 

[TommyV]

Does anyone else feel that Tuilagi hasn't seemed to have developed all that much since the world cup? And that for such a big guy, he misses a hell of a lot of tackles? And that his position in the team may be a little taken for granted? And that putting him on the wing is a really, really silly idea until he's played there a little for club first?

Also, Dan Cole. This tournament is just about the worst I've seen him. Still decent at the breakdown, but where has his strength in the scrum gone? (Perhaps the blame could be more directed to Youngs? Mears used to be criticised as a scrummaging hooker because of his size. Maybe the same applies to Youngs?)

Tuilagi has had his moments, I don't feel he's gone backwards much, I just feel he's being utilized poorly. I think some of that is partially his own fought as he's looking for contact too much, but he's not being given great service and given flat ball to run on to as a crash-ball option most of the time. Needs to be given proper ball from deep to attack at pace still but with room to attack space and he can still be destructive.

Cole yeah, I'm not sure what's happened. At the breakdown he's still extremely good for a tight-head, but in the scrum he just seems to have not kicked on and doesn't look particularly strong. I'd expect him to get better in that area all the time but he's getting overpowered at times now looks a bit average from a scrumming sense. Hopefully he can regain his form there. We've heard all this stuff about Youngs apparently being a really good scrummer from the Leicester camp but who knows, maybe they were just talking rubbish?

Parling doesn't offer much behind him, though. I love the guy and what he brings to the line-out but it's seriously time to look at a tighthead lock who's going to reinforce the scrum and give Cole some support because it's becoming an issue.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Scrum issues are mainly down to picking non-scrummaging locks IMO.
Also people hyping Cole and assuming his scrummaging is as strong as his work in the loose.

 

[Peat]

Scrum issues are mainly down to picking non-scrummaging locks IMO.
Also people hyping Cole and assuming his scrummaging is as strong as his work in the loose.

Still don't get why you say that when our scrummaging performance levels instantly rocket every time Corbs is available. Which, together with the strong performances of Cole for Leicester, would suggest his scrummaging abilities are pretty bloody strong too.

 

[Aedaphon]

When is Corbs coming back? Before June I imagine, but early enough to get a look in for the Lions (probably not given his lack of test-level game time recently, but you never know). I'd still love to see Sheridan back in white at least once and it'd be nice to see him eviscerate an Argentine scrum without its first choice props...

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

I think a lot of the problems come down from players at club level not being all round players. So put them into an international shirt and tuiagi still can't pass (shock) neither can barritt make a break! Nor can Farrell play a great running game, nor can ashton tackle!

We need players playing well in a back line that really challenges on all fronts and after Lancaster saying he wanted a ball playing 12 in all the interviews didn't actally pick one. I genuinelly think we would have been better off with an entire club backline.

Defence won't win matches against top teams!!!!!

 

[Crapspray]

Scrum issues are mainly down to picking non-scrummaging locks IMO.

England's locks against South Africa and New Zealand were Launchbury and Parling. In both games I'd say England won the scrummaging battle. The changes in the pack from Australia to South Africa was Launchbury in for Palmer, Wood in for Johnson, and Corbisiero in for the injured Marler. Not exactly bulking the scrum out in the first two cases.

Personally, I think it's just the inability to deal with the darker arts. When England lost in the scrum against Australia (oh, the shame) Marler couldn't deal with Alexander binding on his arm and collapsing the scrum (and the aforementioned injury). The same happened against Wales and, while it's the crap refereeing allowing it to happen, England really need to wise-up and learn to play the officials. Corbisiero does that very well, consistently boreing in and binding short- blatantly so against the Springboks in the autumn. Marler and Vunipola would do well to learn the same tricks. Perhaps one of the reasons Rowntree wanted clarification was to work out a few less-than-legal ways of countering collapsing.

Defence won't win matches against top teams!!!!!

England's defensive intensity dropped off throughout the Six Nations anyway. The line speed against Wales was much slower than it was against Scotland and the ferocity of counter-rucking was no where near what they managed against the All Blacks. Against France, Italy, and Wales England's defence was very porous.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Rob Baxter and Paul Gustard to join England coaching staff for the summer tour:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/21943321

Got to say, not bad replacements! Little disappointed to still see the Sarries connection, but Baxter is a top coach.
How is Gustard as a defence coach vs Farrell?

 

[j'nuh]

Not much, his missed tackle count is exaggerated*, his position in the team is taken for granted as no one looks like taking it off him warts and all, and he has played wing for Leicester before, just not recently.

Cole hasn't had a great scrummaging tournament its true but scrums go wrong as units; maybe Youngs doesn't help at scrum-time, green looseheads certainly don't help, and neither does a relatively lightweight second row. Will be interesting to see how he goes on the Lions

*Tuilagi made 16, missed 2. BOD 33, 4; D'Arcy 10, 1; Marshall 10, 0; Fritz, 12, 1; Canale 30, 4; Garcia 13, 4; Benvenuti 10, 3; Scott 42, 9; Lamont 40, 7; Davies 19, 2; Roberts 24, 5; Twelvetrees 12, 2; Barritt, 32, 4

That's every centre who played a major part in the tournament (bar the French ones who the DT stuffed up on) - Tuilagi's miss rate is roughly equivalent with O'Driscoll and Barritt and a great deal better than most people there. Missed tackles and Tuilagi is becoming something of an accepted myth quite quickly for no good reason.

One might also say the same about Roberts and defensive excellent the next time it comes up too now it's there...

Fair point! I'm not sure where I picked up that impression, but this has convinced me otherwise that it isn't such a big problem.

There may be a few names to challenge Tuilagi soon. Daly, Trinder, Lowe. Joseph's done a lot of good for himself by moving away from Irish imo, hope that it translates into good form.

 

[Peat]

Fair point! I'm not sure where I picked up that impression, but this has convinced me otherwise that it isn't such a big problem.

There may be a few names to challenge Tuilagi soon. Daly, Trinder, Lowe. Joseph's done a lot of good for himself by moving away from Irish imo, hope that it translates into good form.

Jonathan Joseph laid down a challenge imo, but that faded this year. Hopefully it will return. You see more of Trinder than me, so maybe I'm wrong, but ultimately I don't see him having the full package. I feel he's lacking in international level physicality and playing against guys mostly as quick as him won't really have too much left to offer. Might be wrong I accept. Lowe seems to have gone backwards. And I'm more than half convinced Elliot Daly will make his way internationally as a back three player.

Hopefully next season something will happen, but I'm not optimistic. Olyy, what chance of Mark Jennings getting lots of gametime at Sale?

edit:

Rob Baxter and Paul Gustard to join England coaching staff for the summer tour:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/21943321

Got to say, not bad replacements! Little disappointed to still see the Sarries connection, but Baxter is a top coach.
How is Gustard as a defence coach vs Farrell?

I've seen some some Sarries fans say we got the wrong one when we got Farrell instead of Gustard, but, y'know, Sarries fans. No doubt he's competent at least though, and Baxter is fantastic news.