"Biggar born in the wrong country." says Johnson

[TRF_Cymro]

Scott Johnson has hit back at Dan Biggar's critics insisting the Ospreys fly-half is not appreciated in Wales and was "born in the wrong country."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/15748274.stm​

 

[TRF_Olyy]

It's not as if he was outstanding in his chances in a Wales shirt

Having said that, with Hook unavailable and Priestland just back from injury there's a better chance he could be involved vs Australia, however i imagine Tovey will be ahead of him, and will probably take Jones spot in the 6N (presuming Hook is available again then)

Sent from my HTC Incredible S using Tapatalk

 

[psychic duck]

I agree and disagree here

I agree that people are always hating on him for no reason, and are far harsher on him than other fly halves, he was great in his first full season in 2010 but when his form was terrible last season people seemed to forget about his 2009/10 season form and portray him as a player who had been there for a while and been rubbish all his career, also people forget he has only just turned 22

but saying that, with the rise of Priestland he shouldn't be first choice 10, maybe not even second I am a fan of Tovey as well but I would have Biggar in the extended squad though as I would play one of the aforementioned fly halves at full back if there is an injury

 

[dullonien]

Johnson not making any sense once again. If Wales completely ignore anyone but flamboyand fly-halves, how has Stephen Jones managed to rack up over 100 caps? The simple fact is that Biggar hasn't cut it at international level. He's a decent player, but ultimately offers little more than a reliable boot.

 

[Cofi]

He's still young; plenty of time for him to develop and improve. Not being 'appreciated' might act as an impetus. Include him in the extended squad but, in my opinion, Priestland and Tovey are ahead of him - for now...

 

[profitius]

Was Priestland with the Ospreys previously?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Don't think so - think he came through the Scarlets academy

 

[dullonien]

He's still young; plenty of time for him to develop and improve. Not being 'appreciated' might act as an impetus. Include him in the extended squad but, in my opinion, Priestland and Tovey are ahead of him - for now...

I wouldn't necessarily say that Tovey is ahead of Biggar. Both players' form have been inconsistent of late. Tovey still has some majour deficiencies, namely his defense and his goal kicking. His inconsistent goal kicking is of big concern imo, because we know first hand from the WC exactly how much poor goal kicking can cost us.

The only player that is clearny ahead of the rest in the fly-half pecking order is Priestland, but even he needs to prove that he can retain the same level for the prolonged period of time.

 

[Draggs]

I wouldn't necessarily say that Tovey is ahead of Biggar. Both players' form have been inconsistent of late. Tovey still has some majour deficiencies, namely his defense and his goal kicking. His inconsistent goal kicking is of big concern imo, because we know first hand from the WC exactly how much poor goal kicking can cost us.

The only player that is clearny ahead of the rest in the fly-half pecking order is Priestland, but even he needs to prove that he can retain the same level for the prolonged period of time.

Lets be honest, when has Biggar performed well at international level?
Canada 2009, and with all respect, it is hardly a game to gauge a player. Every time he has had the chance, he has blown it. Yes, he is developing and does have potential, but it seems every year we put him in a Welsh jersey to see where he is at, and then cast him off. Finally he is able to stay with the Ospreys for an extended period and remain undisturbed.

Tovey's kicking problems last season were due to the fact that he was trying a new kicking style. He has since reverted to his previous method and it has worked well for him (missed one kick out of 7/8 v Ulster this year).

 

[psychic duck]

Lets be honest, when has Biggar performed well at international level?
Canada 2009, and with all respect, it is hardly a game to gauge a player. Every time he has had the chance, he has blown it. Yes, he is developing and does have potential, but it seems every year we put him in a Welsh jersey to see where he is at, and then cast him off. Finally he is able to stay with the Ospreys for an extended period and remain undisturbed.

people keep saying Biggar has blown his chances, but all he did was play poor once against Fiji in a match where numerous players had dreadful games (Bennett, Ryan Jones spring to mind), most of his other "chances" have been off the bench for about five minutes

 

[Draggs]

people keep saying Biggar has blown his chances, but all he did was play poor once against Fiji in a match where numerous players had dreadful games (Bennett, Ryan Jones spring to mind), most of his other "chances" have been off the bench for about five minutes

Yes, and Bennett was dropped and Ryan lost the captaincy.
His performances for the Ospreys are often shocking and is routinely outplayed by Tovey.
I can go trough and drag up poor performances by Biggar but have better things to do than slag off a player all day.

I will only comment on what I have seen, and from what I have seen of Biggar, he is unpredictable and often the weak link with the Ospreys/Wales.
His style of play isn't suited to the way Wales run the backline with Roberts and Davies; whereas Rhys Priestland fits in excellently. I also think Tovey would struggle with the current Welsh backline, as he operated deeper than we want to play our outside half. I hope Shingler is given a shot at 10 for the London Irish, as I think he too could work well in our backline. He is a big player and could probably operate well relatively flat.

 

[dullonien]

Lets be honest, when has Biggar performed well at international level?
Canada 2009, and with all respect, it is hardly a game to gauge a player. Every time he has had the chance, he has blown it. Yes, he is developing and does have potential, but it seems every year we put him in a Welsh jersey to see where he is at, and then cast him off. Finally he is able to stay with the Ospreys for an extended period and remain undisturbed.

Tovey's kicking problems last season were due to the fact that he was trying a new kicking style. He has since reverted to his previous method and it has worked well for him (missed one kick out of 7/8 v Ulster this year).

Yeh, feel the same way really, although Psychic Duck also has a point. I'm not a fan of Biggar either tbh. All I'm really saying is that there's also no reason to place Tovey ahead of him in the pecking order, especially considering he's uncapped at international level (only fair if Biggar is being rightly critisized for his international peormances). I'm not totally sure I accept the excuse surrounding Tovey's kicking. Afterall, why would he have tried a different kicking style if there was no problem to begin with? Someone must have thought that his kicking needed adressing. Hopefully he's got it sorted, but I'm not convinced yet.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of Tovey, and have been calling for his inclusing in the national squad for a while. It's just that his form has been all over the place recently. I'd still have him in the Wales squad ahead of Biggar, was just pointing out that I don't think anyone is particularily ahead of anyone else at this moment in time (other than Priestland based on his WC performances, but then he came from practically nowhere).

I don't think people should be writing Hook off at fly-half just yet. He's had a great start to his spell in France, and regular gametime in the position, instead of being thrown in to the fly-half berth at international level, will do him the world of good.

Yes, and Bennett was dropped and Ryan lost the captaincy.
His performances for the Ospreys are often shocking and is routinely outplayed by Tovey.
I can go trough and drag up poor performances by Biggar but have better things to do than slag off a player all day.

I will only comment on what I have seen, and from what I have seen of Biggar, he is unpredictable and often the weak link with the Ospreys/Wales.
His style of play isn't suited to the way Wales run the backline with Roberts and Davies; whereas Rhys Priestland fits in excellently. I also think Tovey would struggle with the current Welsh backline, as he operated deeper than we want to play our outside half. I hope Shingler is given a shot at 10 for the London Irish, as I think he too could work well in our backline. He is a big player and could probably operate well relatively flat.

Haha, now I'm going to disagree with you again, but in a pro Tovey manner lol. I think Tovey could fit in very well with the current Welsh backline. His passing game is probably his best asset, and is better than any other Welsh fly-half at present. He's very effective at getting the outside backs into the game, and with players such as North and Halfpenny out there, why wouldn't you want them involved more. Not everything needs to go through Roberts, and that's been one of our problems over the past couple of years, because it means that when Roberts isn't playing well, neither do Wales.

 

[Me 1]

I have never been a fan of Biggar. Yes, he has a good boot but he doesn't bring much else. I was always more impressed with Tovey, found it hard to believe he wasn't even given a chance. In my opinion Priestland, Hook, Jones(despite his age) and Tovey are all ahead of him. But he is young, and could become a much better player(not much chance of that at the Ospreys), Priestland used to be appalling yet really improved.

 

[Draggs]

Yeh, feel the same way really, although Psychic Duck also has a point. I'm not a fan of Biggar either tbh. All I'm really saying is that there's also no reason to place Tovey ahead of him in the pecking order, especially considering he's uncapped at international level (only fair if Biggar is being rightly critisized for his international peormances). I'm not totally sure I accept the excuse surrounding Tovey's kicking. Afterall, why would he have tried a different kicking style if there was no problem to begin with? Someone must have thought that his kicking needed adressing. Hopefully he's got it sorted, but I'm not convinced yet.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of Tovey, and have been calling for his inclusing in the national squad for a while. It's just that his form has been all over the place recently. I'd still have him in the Wales squad ahead of Biggar, was just pointing out that I don't think anyone is particularily ahead of anyone else at this moment in time (other than Priestland based on his WC performances, but then he came from practically nowhere).

I don't think people should be writing Hook off at fly-half just yet. He's had a great start to his spell in France, and regular gametime in the position, instead of being thrown in to the fly-half berth at international level, will do him the world of good.



Haha, now I'm going to disagree with you again, but in a pro Tovey manner lol. I think Tovey could fit in very well with the current Welsh backline. His passing game is probably his best asset, and is better than any other Welsh fly-half at present. He's very effective at getting the outside backs into the game, and with players such as North and Halfpenny out there, why wouldn't you want them involved more. Not everything needs to go through Roberts, and that's been one of our problems over the past couple of years, because it means that when Roberts isn't playing well, neither do Wales.

Well, I think he could play in the backline, but right now Priestland is going a good job at 10. We will never know with Tovey until he is tried there. His kicking was changed so he could try and get more range. His best style, which he has now reverted to, gets about 40-50m. This is from an interview with Darren Edwards.

Last season Jason Tovey was an excellent kicker – an unbroken run of twenty odd successful shots at goal. How do you explain his current poor form? Do we have a kicking coach for him, and is it Neil Jenkins? What are we doing to help him recover his magic?
Jason had a success rate of 92% last season, the best in the northern hemisphere, but he tends to be a chip kicker, with no great distance. He's been trying to change his style to develop that distance and it's like golf or tennis, when you make a fundamental change, you have to break things all the way down. He's still striking the ball well, but he's lacking accuracy. It's not ideal that he's doing this during the season, as there is so much pressure on during games, but he had a limited pre season due to injury. So making changes in the season is tough on him as he has to do this under the pressure of competitive rugby, but it is something that will certainly come back. We still have to remember he has only just turned 21. It's just the place kicking, though; the rest of his game is still very good.
The union have offered us help, and we can use Neil Jenkins if we want, but Jason is happy working with Shaun Connor, who is a very good kicking coach. These things take time, and during preseason Shaun will be aiming to get things sorted out.
Link

I don't think anybody has fully written off James Hook yet, but I would say he needs more time at 10 for USAP before coming back into the squad. (Which would be the Six Nations, due to the international window)

 

[dullonien]

I have never been a fan of Biggar. Yes, he has a good boot but he doesn't bring much else. I was always more impressed with Tovey, found it hard to believe he wasn't even given a chance. In my opinion Priestland, Hook, Jones(despite his age) and Tovey are all ahead of him. But he is young, and could become a much better player(not much chance of that at the Ospreys), Priestland used to be appalling yet really improved.

Gotta be honest, I was a big fan of Biggar when he first burst onto the scene for the U20's. He was a very different player back then though, where he played a much more instinctive game, and where his long flat passing skills really unlocked defenses. The Ospreys have turned him into something very different. His passing game has all but vanished (although at seniour level his long passes were easily picked off), and his running game isn't what it was. His kicking has come a long way, but that's not enough.

I personally want to see Mattew Morgan getting more gametime at the O's, although I concede that his defense is simply shocking on occasion. I almost feel that a move to wing for Mattew Morgan may be a sensible thing (it worked for Shane), but I feel bad for thinking it because he has so much to offer at 10.

 

[psychic duck]

Yes, and Bennett was dropped and Ryan lost the captaincy.
His performances for the Ospreys are often shocking and is routinely outplayed by Tovey.
I can go trough and drag up poor performances by Biggar but have better things to do than slag off a player all day.

I will only comment on what I have seen, and from what I have seen of Biggar, he is unpredictable and often the weak link with the Ospreys/Wales.
His style of play isn't suited to the way Wales run the backline with Roberts and Davies; whereas Rhys Priestland fits in excellently. I also think Tovey would struggle with the current Welsh backline, as he operated deeper than we want to play our outside half. I hope Shingler is given a shot at 10 for the London Irish, as I think he too could work well in our backline. He is a big player and could probably operate well relatively flat.

yes he had a dreadful season last season, but you're forgetting the 2009/10 season where when Hook moved to 12 and Biggar came into the side at 10 it turned the season around into probably the Ospreys best ever

you may be right about his style of play for Wales but in my opinion Davies and Roberts don't work as a combination and I would have Hook start there

from what I have seen of Biggar, he is unpredictable and often the weak link with the Ospreys/Wales

that can be said about James Hook yet nobody slaughters him like they do Biggar

and he is not "often" the weak link for Wales as he hasn't really played much, and is not really for the Ospreys either the 10 position is not my biggest concern, I would rather have a new centre/full back or number 8 than fly half

 

[Me 1]

I personally want to see Mattew Morgan getting more gametime at the O's, although I concede that his defense is simply shocking on occasion. I almost feel that a move to wing for Mattew Morgan may be a sensible thing (it worked for Shane), but I feel bad for thinking it because he has so much to offer at 10.

He looks good yes, his defence can be a joke but his attack is great and has one of the best boots I've seen in this country in a long time. Also, if your a fan of his try to check out Jordan Williams at the Scarlets. I haven't seen a huge amount of him but from what I've heard he could be great. From what I have seen (which isn't much) he scored a fantastic try (albeit in the LV= cup) and converted it from out wide. Can't comment on his defence but he is the same height as Morgan so maybe not so good

 

[Draggs]

yes he had a dreadful season last season, but you're forgetting the 2009/10 season where when Hook moved to 12 and Biggar came into the side at 10 it turned the season around into probably the Ospreys best ever

you may be right about his style of play for Wales but in my opinion Davies and Roberts don't work as a combination and I would have Hook start there



that can be said about James Hook yet nobody slaughters him like they do Biggar

and he is not "often" the weak link for Wales as he hasn't really played much, and is not really for the Ospreys either the 10 position is not my biggest concern, I would rather have a new centre/full back or number 8 than fly half

I disagree, Hook gets slated by plenty, perhaps not the press but certainly elsewhere online.

I also agree that Roberts/Davies isn't really working, and Hook would probably be a better option. I still haven't given up hope that Gavin returns...

 

[Cofi]

I wouldn't necessarily say that Tovey is ahead of Biggar. Both players' form have been inconsistent of late. Tovey still has some majour deficiencies, namely his defense and his goal kicking. His inconsistent goal kicking is of big concern imo, because we know first hand from the WC exactly how much poor goal kicking can cost us.

The only player that is clearny ahead of the rest in the fly-half pecking order is Priestland, but even he needs to prove that he can retain the same level for the prolonged period of time.

Perhaps I'm being a bit harsh on Biggar and thinking back, unfairly maybe, at what has been described as his missed opportunity but I like the way Tovey plays. I'm watching him play now against Perpignan and I like his passing and running and his kicking thus far has been intelligent and accurate. I put him ahead of Biggar on personal preference alone but I take your point: the only one clearly ahead of anyone is Priestland. Biggar, I'm sure, will get his chance again in the near future. It's interesting tonight to see Tovey play against Hook. I know who I'd pick based on tonight's performance, well, thus far anyway!

 

[TPenn]

Gotta be honest, I was a big fan of Biggar when he first burst onto the scene for the U20's. He was a very different player back then though, where he played a much more instinctive game, and where his long flat passing skills really unlocked defenses. The Ospreys have turned him into something very different. His passing game has all but vanished (although at seniour level his long passes were easily picked off), and his running game isn't what it was. His kicking has come a long way, but that's not enough.

I think that part of the reason for Biggar's change in style is the fact that on so many occasions he has had Hook outside him. It must be very easy to shift responsibility on to the guy outside you when you know you have someone of Hook's quality there. I'm hoping this season playing without Hook will enable to kick on as a playmaker. It wouldn't take too much of an improvement in his running/passing game to make him a very good fly half IMO. It's not like Priestland is tearing through defences all the time, the key with him is that he offers variety and keeps defences guessing. With Biggar at the moment it's all too easy to predict what he'll do.

It could even be a question of a lack of confidence in his other skills. As you say, his long passes were easily picked off when he made the step up, so he has stopped them. He needs to be encouraged to try things, instead of falling back on his kicking game. All about balance innit.