Berrick Barnes Inquires About Use Of Boxing Headgear

[Gavin]

http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/u...makers-on-boxing-headgear-20110601-1fgop.html

DURBAN: Berrick Barnes will explore the possibility of challenging the IRB's regulations on headgear and designing a more protective piece following his series of head injuries.
The Waratahs and Wallabies playmaker has suffered concussions and footballer's migraine throughout his career despite wearing headgear approved by the game's lawmakers. Barnes had wanted to wear a boxing-style headgear in his return from concussion against Melbourne Rebels in April but was not allowed under the IRB's guidelines on protective items.
''Trying to do a headgear that will put more protection around the back of the head and the temple to hopefully protect that sort of thing, it would be something to look at I reckon,'' Barnes told the Herald. ''I want to play a bit longer and look after my own health too so I'm trying to work out the best way to do it.'' <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>
The IRB guidelines state: ''A player may wear headgear made of soft and thin materials provided that no part of the headgear is thicker than 1cm when uncompressed and no part of the headgear has a density of more than 45 kilograms per cubic metre.''
But through experience, Barnes is aware that one centimetre does not offer much protection, and believes he can create a better model with his sponsor Gilbert - who already produce 10 IRB-approved headgears.
''There's been no stats proven to show that headgear actually prevents concussion. It prevents head cuts and cauliflower ears, but whether from a genuine knock to the head that padding does anything? You look at boxing and the extra thickness in padding, I don't see too many amateur boxers getting knocked out in a fight,'' Barnes said.
''I'm not getting knocked with someone hitting me face to face, I'm getting knocked out by getting hit in the back of the head, and on the temple, and something triggers and it sends me over. Jaw you can't do anything about, but my issue is trying to protect the temple and the back parts of your head. It's something to look at and design, it's probably not going to be the most aesthetically pleasing thing, but it would be something worth looking at.''
The IRB would need to modify its laws before Barnes could start designing a more functional headgear, but given the alarming research results from the United States on the long-term affects of concussion on footballers, it is a timely consideration.
Barnes was ruled out of last week's match against the Sharks after being diagnosed with footballer's migraine by his neurologist, John Watson, who also treated the player after two heavy concussions earlier this season. Footballer's migraine is said to have no long-term effects on the brain. Barnes suffered memory loss after taking a hit to the back of the head against the Lions in Sydney a fortnight ago, but that was attributed to ''transient global amnesia'', which coincided with the migraine. The amnesia also has no long-term effects. Barnes is more susceptible to both when he takes a knock to the head after more than 60 minutes of exercise.
''Whether it's a case of me fatiguing and then a knock on the head seems to trigger that thing … it's not because I get more symptoms at that stage [60 minutes], I don't get any,'' he said. ''I played against the Rebels, Force, and up until I got hit against the Lions I was fine. Hopefully I don't get any more of them, but the track record ain't going too great at the moment. I don't remember getting hit, I don't remember coming off … I seem to lose all form of memory function when it happens. But you come good pretty quickly, I came good a lot quicker than after the Reds and Brumbies [concussions].''
Barnes, who starts at inside-centre against the Bulls at Loftus Versfeld, added: ''I understand that footy is not a forever thing, I don't want to be affecting the forever part in any adverse sense.''​

Makes sense when you consider he wants to look after his health.​

 

[Seaton]

By all means, I don't see what the problem is with allowing thicker headgear, its not like it gives you some sort of playing advantage

 

[Logorrhea]

Where does it stop though?

The more padding you allow the harder people will hit. Pad a guys head up and the chances are they will not worry as much about putting it into places it shouldnt be. Queue increasing number of concussions and a further evolution of the helmut.

Look up CTE with regards to American Football. Its a problem they have been ignoring for years that is only now starting to see some light.

I'm all for Barnes staying safe and the games authorities managing concussions better but I'm wary about changing the headgear. Maybe the best solution is for Barnes to retire.

 

[best_fullback]

Where does it stop though?

The more padding you allow the harder people will hit. Pad a guys head up and the chances are they will not worry as much about putting it into places it shouldnt be. Queue increasing number of concussions and a further evolution of the helmut.

Look up CTE with regards to American Football. Its a problem they have been ignoring for years that is only now starting to see some light.

I'm all for Barnes staying safe and the games authorities managing concussions better but I'm wary about changing the headgear. Maybe the best solution is for Barnes to retire.

Yeah but the difference between Gridiron and Rugby is that they wear heavy plastic or synthetic armour, as opposed to the soft padding seen in Rugby. I don't see any issue with Barnes wanting to stop getting concussed - surely it makes sense? People in Rugby won't hit harder if they have a cm more padding on their head. As opposed to Gridiron, where you can literally use your body as a battering ram due to the amount of armour, I don't think it would aid anyone by diving with their head in Rugby, as it would be stupid and illegal. I wear a headguard after never wearing one for my youth and it doesn't make me go in any harder, I just don't worry about the scars on my head as much. I tackle exactly the same.

 

[Hulk Hogan]

Barnes is being a bit of a girls blouse about it, does he not understand you can't stop concussions? it's from the brain being bounced around, you could wear a motorbike helmet and still get concussions in rugby. No amature boxers don't get knocked out often unless there is a direct hit on their jaw, but they do get concussions a lot, you play a contact sport where head knocks happen, no amount of padding will change that unless we want to run around with our head wrapped in 1meter thick pillows.

 

[lucky number 7]

Lads people say that the Headguards give no protection from a concussion But I believe it to be bull...I suffered a massive concussion over the summer and then over the start of the season I was knocked out a worrying amount of times...since I began to wear a scrumhat however I have not been Knocked out or concussed once...Might be sheer coincedence but considering how easily I was getting put out in september , October and November I think its too much to ignore.

 

[iWin]

Fair enough, but I'm pretty sure what Barnes was talking about is that there's no definitive evidence on the subject, so you can only go by anecdotal evidence which is flimsy to say the least.
I'm all for more protection from serious injury (who wouldn't be) and providing we avoid the sort of armour they have in american football, it should all be fine.
I honestly think the line comes at making a hard helmet, rather than a soft one.

 

[lucky number 7]

Fair enough, but I'm pretty sure what Barnes was talking about is that there's no definitive evidence on the subject, so you can only go by anecdotal evidence which is flimsy to say the least.
I'm all for more protection from serious injury (who wouldn't be) and providing we avoid the sort of armour they have in american football, it should all be fine.
I honestly think the line comes at making a hard helmet, rather than a soft one.

Yeah should a hard helmet ever be allowed there would be immediately be people demanding hard padding to protect from the huge amount of ensuing breaks...

 

[racingmetrofan]

I think he should be able to wear something a bit different. After all, 3cms of padding in vunerable areas will give him no competitive edge and will do no harm.

 

[racingmetrofan]

Barnes is being a bit of a girls blouse about it, does he not understand you can't stop concussions? it's from the brain being bounced around, you could wear a motorbike helmet and still get concussions in rugby. No amature boxers don't get knocked out often unless there is a direct hit on their jaw, but they do get concussions a lot, you play a contact sport where head knocks happen, no amount of padding will change that unless we want to run around with our head wrapped in 1meter thick pillows.

That's bullshit. Helmets reduce the risk of concussion both on moterbikes and mountain bikes, as they absorb the impact to a large extent. A knock that will concuss someone without a helmet, will not concuss those wearing a helmet.

 

[lucky number 7]

I think he should be able to wear something a bit different. After all, 3cms of padding in vunerable areas will give him no competitive edge and will do no harm.

Actually 3cm would probably give huge competitive edge...

 

[Logorrhea]

Yeah but the difference between Gridiron and Rugby is that they wear heavy plastic or synthetic armour, as opposed to the soft padding seen in Rugby.

Yeah but my point is that Gridiron used to wear soft padding but it increaed in density and solidity as the years went by (primarily with the aim of reducing injury). Whats to stop rugby going the same way. 10-15 years ago no one had headgear, and no one had body padding.

Lads people say that the Headguards give no protection from a concussion

There was a study performed by someone somewhere (couldnt be arsed looking for it) that showed no noticable decrease in concussions among players wearing rugby headgear.

You put your head in the wrong place and you get put out, regardless of what you are wearing. The brain isnt meant to bounce around inside your head.

I honestly think the line comes at making a hard helmet, rather than a soft one.

Grand so. 10 inches of padding? 15? 150? Once its all soft it should be allowed?

That cant happen. It has to be regulated by the IRB, hence their hesitancy in changing the rules.

 

[Hulk Hogan]

That's bullshit. Helmets reduce the risk of concussion both on moterbikes and mountain bikes, as they absorb the impact to a large extent. A knock that will concuss someone without a helmet, will not concuss those wearing a helmet.

Yes they're also rocksolid, so Unless Barnes is going to play in a motorbike helmet it's not really going to matter is it.

 

[best_fullback]

If we're talking about how much extra padding to have then why not look at Petr Cech:

Infamously fractured his skull and now has to wear it; I can't see why the IRB would not reform the law, if challenged, to allow further protection at vulnerable sections on the head. It totally makes sense and doesn't evolve the game into something it wasn't before.

 

[Hulk Hogan]

Old mate above me looks like Micky Mouse haha, anyway, There is no problem having a little bit more padding, the biggest problem is when that doesn't work they'll want more and more and then where does it stop? Just put one of those Zorbing balls on Barnes's head and he can run around like a bobblehead.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

As best_fullback said they should just increase thickness on certain areas, so 2cm thickness on temple and back of head - if he's still worried for his health after that then he should think about retiring, because going further than that pushes you towards American Football

 

[lucky number 7]

Scrum hats do work..I don't understand why there are so many septics.

 

[Logorrhea]

going further than that pushes you towards American Football

I'm pretty sure people said that when the original shoulder padding and headgear was approved.

Yet here we are.

Scrum hats do work..I don't understand why there are so many septics.

I've already explained why people are sceptical

 

[lucky number 7]

I said septics ...not skeptics apologies.
Well I have honestly never seen a guy on my team get concussed while wearing a a scrumhat .. as opposed to 5 or six others this season who did so without one. Coincedence possibly but I really feel its too much to ignore.

 

[best_fullback]

I said septics ...not skeptics apologies.
Well I have honestly never seen a guy on my team get concussed while wearing a a scrumhat .. as opposed to 5 or six others this season who did so without one. Coincedence possibly but I really feel its too much to ignore.

Yeah personally I feel it helps, but I have only ever been concussed once when I was younger and never since I have worn it. How often do you really see people getting concussed in Rugby though? It happens maybe once a game but not even that most of the time, and rarely to the same player often. Maybe Barnes is just susceptible to being concussed than the other people. But I honestly don't have the issue with the game slowly evolving into American Football because not everyone wears headgear or armour (I only wear headgear), a fair amount of people have a complex to wearing protection, seeing it as 'sissy', and as long as protection is soft foam it will never cause damage to someone else to an extent that they will need further protection to counteract it.

Its a simple scenario: IRB look at the law, and if they change it Barnes needs to look at it with Gilbert (or whoever) and research how the sensitive area of the head can be meaningfully be protected with the soft materials. If it turns out they can't then maybe he has to look at retirement, but I'm sure the IRB wouldn't want that, and would love the idea of a company researching a type of headgear that will effectively restrict/stop concussions.


On the subject of concussions I found this interesting video: