Bayonne sign Lauaki, Chisholm, Heymans, Tialata and Rokocoko

[TRF_Olyy]

I thought the general consensus was that Tialata was cr*p anyway?
I don't think i've heard a good word said about him on here, before this thread - just people being gutted when he's included in All Blacks squads and getting done in a Hurricanes shirt

 

[Amobokoboko]

In the 08-09, 09-10 he was decent. But he has become a softy.
If the Canes can clean theri team a bit they can start building as from next season.

 

[Darwin]

I thought the general consensus was that Tialata was cr*p anyway?
I don't think i've heard a good word said about him on here, before this thread - just people being gutted when he's included in All Blacks squads and getting done in a Hurricanes shirt

That's the general consensus from those that want their props to run the 100m in 11 seconds flat, sidestep like backs, and drop kick goals from 50m....
I'm not suggesting that he is a great prop, just that he is strong in what I would consider core propping duties: scrummaging, lineout work, hitting breakdowns. It is his lack of mobility and general laziness around the park that are his major weaknesses. He is probably the second best scrummaging tight-head prop in the country (behind Owen Franks), so I would be surprised if he gets 'murdered' every week in French domestic rugby (though to be honest I don't watch any Top 14 rugby, so have no idea what the style/level of scrummaging is). Tialata won't make the AB's this year if everyone is fit, but if there is an injury to either of the Franks brothers or John Afoa I wouldn't be surprised to see him called up to the AB's.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Ah right, I don't know why but I thought he was considered a poor scrummager

You learn something every day

 

[Sam Owen]

When I watch the 'Canes and Tialata is playing, I dont even notice him. Hes not a standout player IMO. I do understand prop forwards arent usually the glamour boys but some do get your attention.

He was an All Black though and to me that commands some respect, its not a jersey you just get being mediocre.

 

[Logorrhea]

Considering that Carl Hayman (supposedly the best in the world) is getting done every week, it is indeed probable that Tialata will receive the same treatment. SH props usually find it very difficult to adapt to T14 scrummaging...

Shame on you, youknow how upset they get when you dont mention how awesome everything in the lower half of the planet is.

 

[Darwin]

Ah right, I don't know why but I thought he was considered a poor scrummager

You learn something every day

I think the idea that Tialata is a poor scrummager is a common misconception, largely brought about by the fact he was yellow carded against Italy in 2009 after the AB's scrum collapsed 4-5 times in a row on their own line. However the yellow card was later annulled by the IRB, and the ref (Dickinson) was stood down from the IRB referees panel and sent for remedial scrum training. All this suggested that Tialata wasn't really at fault! Interestingly, a week later the AB's scrum (featuring Tialata) dominated the French scrum in Marseille, at one stage driving the French off their own ball 5m out from their line, leading to a try by Jerome Kaino....

 

[TRF_Cymro]

People above have summed him up, he's not a flashy prop, similar to the old school props of just doing tight work and not being spectacular in the loose.

 

[Charles]

Whatever

What a clever, well argumented retort. I am well and truly beaten.

 

[Amobokoboko]

Well, just watch some Bayonne games next season and make up your mind yourselves.
This is not a 'let's diss Neemia topic'

Off topic. he has some good graphic design skills

 

[ranger]

What a clever, well argumented retort. I am well and truly beaten.

Well mate, i didn't want this non issue to turn into some sort of childish NH/SH shitfight so i decided to leave it and not argue back at all. Even still, this happened:

Shame on you, youknow how upset they get when you dont mention how awesome everything in the lower half of the planet is.

I mean come on, i suggest that a 40 cap veteran may be able to hold their own in a domestic competition and leave it there. Cue hemisphere spite anyway. Well done TRF.

 

[nickdnz]

Neemia Tialata isn't a great prop, as ranger and I have said consistantly, but it's no because of his scrummaging. The big problem with him has always been that he is 135kgs and hits the line like a kitten with hemophilia. His scrummaging will be fine. The remarks about Hayman just stinks of pure arrogance. Other than Toulouse (who's best two scrummagers in the last decade have to be Omar Hasan and Census Johnson) there are few teams that have a noticeably great scrum. Hayman had 49 test caps in which he was generally rated as the best scrummager in the world and dominated most international scrums. He was also brilliant for Newcastle. What are you suggesting, France has got such good second rows that international standard props aren't good enough? Why does this not seem to translate in international level? (2009 France got dicked in the scrum) and why if the local talent is so great, do clubs pay such big money for overseas talent?

 

[Hulk Hogan]

If Tialata played like he did for the Barbarians consistently then he would be world class, he was on fire that game but I agree he does hit the line with all the force of a three year old swinging a whifflebat.

 

[Logorrhea]

whatever

 

[Charles]

Well mate, i didn't want this non issue to turn into some sort of childish NH/SH shitfight so i decided to leave it and not argue back at all. Even still, this happened:

Ok, my bad I thought you were being not very nice...

 

[Ma'a Nonu Junior the 2nd]

Its because this half of the planet sneezes all over the other mate

 

[ZeFrenchy]

Neemia Tialata isn't a great prop, as ranger and I have said consistantly, but it's no because of his scrummaging. The big problem with him has always been that he is 135kgs and hits the line like a kitten with hemophilia. His scrummaging will be fine. The remarks about Hayman just stinks of pure arrogance. Other than Toulouse (who's best two scrummagers in the last decade have to be Omar Hasan and Census Johnson) there are few teams that have a noticeably great scrum. Hayman had 49 test caps in which he was generally rated as the best scrummager in the world and dominated most international scrums. He was also brilliant for Newcastle. What are you suggesting, France has got such good second rows that international standard props aren't good enough? Why does this not seem to translate in international level? (2009 France got dicked in the scrum) and why if the local talent is so great, do clubs pay such big money for overseas talent?

I'm not a scrum specialist, but having seen Hayman play a few times, I think I can make things a bit clearer.
He is not being destroyed. He has said himself that scrummaging techniques in NZ and France are the exact opposites, so he has had trouble adapting (more than one full season apparently...). I think that the main problem is that he hasn't dominated as he was expected to, so the Toulon president has publicly criticized him in the press, which hasn't made things better.
So, that the scrummaging style in France is different makes that he is less effective (due to his partners' technique, mostly), bu I guess he could still dominate a french scrummaging unit if he had kiwis around him.
Again, no scrum expert, so I may be wrong.

 

[Aout]

Why does this not seem to translate in international level? (2009 France got dicked in the scrum) and why if the local talent is so great, do clubs pay such big money for overseas talent?

I'm not sure, are you talking about the scrum which schooled the South African one in 2009 (which was considered as the most powerful/best scrum in the world) ? Are you talking about the scrum which dominates the NH (except when the ref is deciding otherwhise, i.e. against England) ? If there's only one thing France is doing well at the moment, it is scrummaging.

 

[ZeFrenchy]

Midi Olympique, the same rugby newspaper that has published all three moves before they were official, mentions Rokocoko moving to Bayonne as well.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Any chance then that Joe Pietersen might return to SA? The Stormers want him back. Or at least 1 Stormers fan wants him back.