[2023 Six Nations] Italy vs Ireland - 25 February 2023

[TRF_Olyy]

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[Leonormous Boozer]

Was just about to make this with a wildly incorrect date.

 

[big ginger 8]

Carbery, Treadwell and Penny linking up with the squad.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

Italy genuinely look like a top3 attack in the tournament so far. Some lovely extended passages of play resulting in tries. So I think they can get a couple of tries against a top defence and merit the attention of a neutral viewer for about the first time ever under Crowley. But Ireland are an absolute machine at the moment, in full 'peaking too early' mode and able to crush Italy by about 35 points. France would have smoked any other team in those opening 20mins in Dublin, there was so much quality (physical and mental) in that match and Italy are nowhere near that level.

If Morisi is unavailable I take it back about Italy scoring tries. He isn't a superstar (neither is Brex, both can be anonymous) but the drop off at centre, particularly at 12, is absolutely apocalyptic. Probably Italy's biggest single issue of the past 10 years for me. Whether Allan or Garbisi starts is very secondary to Morisi's fitness to me.

A big test for Italy to avoid a repeat of getting mauled by a similarly outstanding Boks back in November. If Italy can show a defensive improvment as big as their offensive improvment I wouldn't even rule them out from eliminating France from the RWC group stage (potentially game of the group stage along with Wales vs Georgia).

 

[Smurfy]

I think it will be very good preparation for Ireland to play against a side who, like Scotland, can hurt you badly if you let play break up and become too loose. I really admire what Crowley has achieved, but I'm not sure Italy can cope with the pace that the Ireland pack plays at so I'm expecting/hoping that Ireland win well, but it's going to be a good test.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Yeah agreed, not convinced it's one to bring in too much rotation despite what's being said.

Aki, Casey/Fetish, Conan and Kelleher would be about the extent of rotation if it was up to me, not ones that weaken the team unless we need to preserve Johnny.

 

[Smurfy]

I reckon that Sexton will be rested andI Byrne will start with Crowley maybe getting 15/20 minutes off the bench if things work out as we hope, in which case I think Murray will start. I agree that Conan needs a runout, but I'd be very slow to move Doris from 8. I think I'd prefer to see Baird at 6 rather than Conan if POM is to be rested, while I expect Kelleher to start with Sheehan benching. It is so good to have such quality options though.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

He does look as Irish as can be to be fair.

Not sure what Sam Warburton is up to.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

James Ryan captain for the weekend. No Johnny to start anyway, probably not at all.

 

[munstermuffin]

Rumours I got from last week.
1. Ross B will start as will Aki.
2. Healy will be back in 23
3. There will be a change in back 3
4. It has been said Conan is a bench player in Farrells eyes so could be Coombes or Baird who starts but POM is set to play for leadership reasons and Doris is seen as an out and out 8 by Faz so Conons lack of versatility may be a hindering.
5. Kelliher to start with Sheehan on bench
6. Coombes is being considered for 19 jersey

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Thornley's team

IRELAND (possible v Italy): Hugo Keenan (Leinster); Mack Hansen (Connacht), Garry Ringrose (Leinster), Bundee Aki (Connacht), James Lowe (Leinster); Ross Byrne (Leinster), Craig Casey (Munster); Andrew Porter (Leinster), Rónan Kelleher (Leinster), Finlay Bealham (Connacht); Iain Henderson (Ulster), James Ryan (Leinster, capt); Caelan Doris (Leinster), Josh van der Flier (Leinster), Jack Conan (Leinster).

Replacements: Dan Sheehan (Leinster), David Kilcoyne (Munster)/Cian Healy (Leinster), Tom O'Toole (Ulster), Ryan Baird (Leinster), Peter O'Mahony (Munster), Conor Murray (Munster), Jack Crowley (Munster), Stuart McCloskey (Ulster).

 

[munstermuffin]

Thornley's team

IRELAND (possible v Italy): Hugo Keenan (Leinster); Mack Hansen (Connacht), Garry Ringrose (Leinster), Bundee Aki (Connacht), James Lowe (Leinster); Ross Byrne (Leinster), Craig Casey (Munster); Andrew Porter (Leinster), Rónan Kelleher (Leinster), Finlay Bealham (Connacht); Iain Henderson (Ulster), James Ryan (Leinster, capt); Caelan Doris (Leinster), Josh van der Flier (Leinster), Jack Conan (Leinster).

Replacements: Dan Sheehan (Leinster), David Kilcoyne (Munster)/Cian Healy (Leinster), Tom O'Toole (Ulster), Ryan Baird (Leinster), Peter O'Mahony (Munster), Conor Murray (Munster), Jack Crowley (Munster), Stuart McCloskey (Ulster).

Not bad if true.
Would have liked a more versatile option at 23 like Jimmy O B or Osbourne,
Baird I hope gets alot of time at lock as he needs time there just to get experience.

I think Kilcoyne has played better than Healy these last few months when both are fully fit and if Healy is omitted here it may be him dropping to a Keith Earls type role.

Should be enough to get past a dogged Italian team.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Thornley's team

IRELAND (possible v Italy): Hugo Keenan (Leinster); Mack Hansen (Connacht), Garry Ringrose (Leinster), Bundee Aki (Connacht), James Lowe (Leinster); Ross Byrne (Leinster), Craig Casey (Munster); Andrew Porter (Leinster), Rónan Kelleher (Leinster), Finlay Bealham (Connacht); Iain Henderson (Ulster), James Ryan (Leinster, capt); Caelan Doris (Leinster), Josh van der Flier (Leinster), Jack Conan (Leinster).

Replacements: Dan Sheehan (Leinster), David Kilcoyne (Munster)/Cian Healy (Leinster), Tom O'Toole (Ulster), Ryan Baird (Leinster), Peter O'Mahony (Munster), Conor Murray (Munster), Jack Crowley (Munster), Stuart McCloskey (Ulster).

This is bang on with Kilcoyne as back up lh.

Agree with Muff, would have liked to see Jimmy bench or start in the Hansen role. Expect to win by three scores with a dominant pack.

 

[Smurfy]

That's the starting side, with a bench of Sheehan, Kilcoyne, O'Toole, Baird, POM, Murray, Crowley and McCloskey.

Surprised but pleased Casey starts, and not sure about McCloskey as a bench option, Would have liked to see Larmour at 23 as Crowley is a centre option. Very decent side though.

edit: forgot about JOB.

 

[Groundhog]

Worthless team without Him. Farrell cannot keep his job while he refuses to play Coombes and make him captain and assistant coach.

I feel like we will win by 20 points and people will generally be underwhelmed by the performance. Casey and Byrne to be hung by fans unless we win by 60 and even then....

 

[munstermuffin]

Not too upset by Coombes. Personally I have him ahead of Conan but feel time is getting narrower for Conan to really nail down the 20 jersey.
Not due to Conan been poor but against top teams we loose alot of Doris when he is at 6 compared to how good he is at 8. Coombes experience as a lock and 6 will help but the likes of Baird will be thinking that spot is live competition too.

All in all I've sat here and criticized Irish coaches before for only having 22/23 players they exposed for RWC.
Faz can't be accused of this and I may not agree with all he has selected but he has been trying at least to build a competitive squad depth.

On Cian Healy. I have a feeling as I said earlier this may be the quiet sail to the backbenches but regardless I think he will still play at RWC barring injury just seems wierd as he was the best prop in world for bits and a real testament of a player.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

 

[big ginger 8]

Not too upset by Coombes. Personally I have him ahead of Conan but feel time is getting narrower for Conan to really nail down the 20 jersey.
Not due to Conan been poor but against top teams we loose alot of Doris when he is at 6 compared to how good he is at 8. Coombes experience as a lock and 6 will help but the likes of Baird will be thinking that spot is live competition too.

All in all I've sat here and criticized Irish coaches before for only having 22/23 players they exposed for RWC.
Faz can't be accused of this and I may not agree with all he has selected but he has been trying at least to build a competitive squad depth.

On Cian Healy. I have a feeling as I said earlier this may be the quiet sail to the backbenches but regardless I think he will still play at RWC barring injury just seems wierd as he was the best prop in world for bits and a real testament of a player.

We beat NZ with Doris at 6 in a game where he won MotM. Wouldn't say that's losing a lot.


Pretty happy with the team. We'll capable of playing at a good pace and exploiting space. Will be a good test of how far RB has come on that regard.

 

[munstermuffin]

We beat NZ with Doris at 6 in a game where he won MotM. Wouldn't say that's losing a lot.


Pretty happy with the team. We'll capable of playing at a good pace and exploiting space. Will be a good test of how far RB has come on that regard.

Maybe and again not a slight on anything but these are facts:
- New Zealand lost also in that period to Argentina. Not belittling our achievement but it was perfect timing.
- Conan is a good 8 and Doris a fine 6 but Doris is a real World Class 8 and that has even upped in the last 4/5 months.
- We will beat most teams on form with Conan at 8 and Doris at 6 but I talking that top top bit and balance of backrow.

On RB it will be a test as playing with Casey is a different ride to playing with Murray. He will probably need to be more authoritative than previous games.