[2018-19 Guinness Pro 14] Round 5 (28 & 29/09/2018)

[dullonien]

Impressive return from Jon Davies! Almost forget how much he's been missed until he's back putting in an 80min performance like that.

Patchell looked class as well, he really does have every tool in his locker (tackling is a bit weak though for a big man).

Wyn Jones, Elias and Ball good up front. Asquith always surprises me how rounded a player he is behind as well. Hadn't heard of him before arriving in Llanelli, but he looks so comfortable wherever he plays.

 

[Amiga500]

Erm, haven't seen our "match". Not sure at this point I want to.

Just underlines the scale of the problem. We have neither strength or depth. Large fundamental issues remain.

While some plucky performances have got us out of jail in first four games, that was never going to be enough to carry us against a big hitter.

Amid the doom and gloom, I can see some green shoots, but they are pretty thin on the ground.

For next week, regardless of the chopping and changing elsewhere, I'd have Michael Lowry in for Billy Burns, he is our future at outside half - Burns should never have been brought in. (Yet) Another bad move from Bryn.

 

[profitius]

Erm, haven't seen our "match". Not sure at this point I want to.

Just underlines the scale of the problem. We have neither strength or depth. Large fundamental issues remain.

While some plucky performances have got us out of jail in first four games, that was never going to be enough to carry us against a big hitter.

Amid the doom and gloom, I can see some green shoots, but they are pretty thin on the ground.

For next week, regardless of the chopping and changing elsewhere, I'd have Michael Lowry in for Billy Burns, he is our future at outside half - Burns should never have been brought in. (Yet) Another bad move from Bryn.

It was Munsters most ruthless performance for many a year. They were really stung after last week's performance so it was a bad time for Ulster's second stringers to play theM. Munster kept the foot on the accelerator near the end as Ulster's youngsters tired and that's when the scoreboard really began to look bad.


POM and Carbery were the standouts.

 

[Leinster Fan]

Erm, haven't seen our "match". Not sure at this point I want to.

Just underlines the scale of the problem. We have neither strength or depth. Large fundamental issues remain.

While some plucky performances have got us out of jail in first four games, that was never going to be enough to carry us against a big hitter.

Amid the doom and gloom, I can see some green shoots, but they are pretty thin on the ground.

For next week, regardless of the chopping and changing elsewhere, I'd have Michael Lowry in for Billy Burns, he is our future at outside half - Burns should never have been brought in. (Yet) Another bad move from Bryn.

In fairness, I think there's definitely a decent team in there, it just isn't quite clicking at the moment. Absolutely no depth though. If they get a lucky run with injuries they could have a decent season though. Tight five bar Henderson is a big problem. If Moore finally comes good that would go a long way towards fixing that though.

 

[Tooting Carmen]

Erm, haven't seen our "match". Not sure at this point I want to.

Just underlines the scale of the problem. We have neither strength or depth. Large fundamental issues remain.

While some plucky performances have got us out of jail in first four games, that was never going to be enough to carry us against a big hitter.

Amid the doom and gloom, I can see some green shoots, but they are pretty thin on the ground.

For next week, regardless of the chopping and changing elsewhere, I'd have Michael Lowry in for Billy Burns, he is our future at outside half - Burns should never have been brought in. (Yet) Another bad move from Bryn.

You managed to scrape past Scarlets (albeit they already had lots of injuries then). And Edinburgh are not the powder-puff team of old. All the same, it is true that none of Ulster's victories were that convincing, and unfortunately I predicted that they would yet again have an implosion mid-season, which seems to be happening already.

 

[Amiga500]

Tight five bar Henderson is a big problem. If Moore finally comes good that would go a long way towards fixing that though.

The future there is likely to be O'Toole, McBurney and O'Sullivan.

Unfortunately they are going to go through many tough days between being a very young front-row forward and being battle hardened against professional adults.

 

[All Black]

My mate bazwaz says he's been banned for posting the Pro 14 team lists for the forum fantasy comp.
He said he's been posting them for weeks without any complaints but has now had his account suspended suddenly .
Any of the mods like to clarify what went wrong here.

Hahaha so you're a french rugby fan. No wonder you don't see any wrong in Raynal. Love how you changed your name from bazwaz to Carlito, come on now, don't lie.

 

[Carlito]

Hahaha so you're a french rugby fan. No wonder you don't see any wrong in Raynal. Love how you changed your name from bazwaz to Carlito, come on now, don't lie.

Mate if you think that Pro 14 is a French rugby competition then that speaks volumes about you and your knowledge of rugby.

 

[TRF_heineken]

My mate bazwaz says he's been banned for posting the Pro 14 team lists for the forum fantasy comp.
He said he's been posting them for weeks without any complaints but has now had his account suspended suddenly .
Any of the mods like to clarify what went wrong here.

Sure, I'll clarify.

He was warned on several occasions not to double, triple or even quadruple post in the thread, and that he should rather merge his posts together into one post, to prevent the thread being "spammed". This is also a violation of the forum rules.

After his warning, he just kept on spamming the thread, and was warned again. This warning included a one-week ban so that he can go back home and cool down and think of his sins and why he's ignoring the instructions given to him.

While being temporarily banned, he went on to create a second profile for himself on the forum, and our security platform caught it. Which means he's now permanently banned from the forum.

 

[All Black]

Mate if you think that Pro 14 is a French rugby competition then that speaks volumes about you and your knowledge of rugby.

Yeah I wont lie, I don't care too much for NH club rugby. I only like the international games. I was trying to find a link as to why you would defend Raynal so much without you actually seeing the game and his performance.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

I repeat, will someone explain Munster's mediocrity? Where the hell did that come from for both sides?

Benetton had 10 mins to get a winning score against 14. They missed three makeable kicks that would have given them more points in the end. Edinburgh's Hickey looks handy at fly-half though and it looked like a belter of a game.

Zebre as good as last year, but almost every other team has improved compared to last year (even the Cheetahs are really finding their feet - I really liked Schoeman at flyhalf with the Bulls and he is showing some of that form for the Cheetahs). I fear Zebre could end up last in points despite their own progress.

 

[profitius]

I repeat, will someone explain Munster's mediocrity? Where the hell did that come from for both sides?
.

Munster are trying to play a more expansive style of rugby. Carbery was outstanding against Ulster as was POM.


It was a bad time for Ulster to play Munster. Munster were angry after their terrible performance against Cardiff. Ulster were hit with about 16 injuries and after coming from their tour of South Africa.


Munsters away record is terrible and it's something they need to address.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Stamp in the Sports ground received a 12 week ban, cut to six for previously clean record.

Consistent but I don't think previous records should matter for incidents with clear and obvious intent with the current nature of the sport allowing players be banned for completely accident infringements.

 

[Leinster Fan]

Stamp in the Sports ground received a 12 week ban, cut to six for previously clean record.

Consistent but I don't think previous records should matter for incidents with clear and obvious intent with the current nature of the sport allowing players be banned for completely accident infringements.

Yeah that's pretty close to what the Edinburgh prop got and there was for less intent. Surely the bans should factor that into account.

 

[dullonien]

Yeah, I think that should have resulted in a far longer punishment. Some people have gone overboard with the seriousness (didn't go in with all his weight), but it was deliberate and still could have caused serious harm. I'd happily see 6 months for deliberate acts like that.

 

[Amiga500]

So what about JVDF holding him into the ruck.

If the referee refuses to deal with it - then you can only expect that players take it into their own hands on the pitch.


edit: I had written I wasn't disagreeing with the ban. But actually, I am disagreeing with the ban. As far as I see it - you hold guys into the ruck - then its open season on the studs. It'll pretty quickly slow down cynical play.

You don't want to get stomped on? Then don't grab the opposition.

 

[jcahill1]

So what about JVDF holding him into the ruck.

If the referee refuses to deal with it - then you can only expect that players take it into their own hands on the pitch.


edit: I had written I wasn't disagreeing with the ban. But actually, I am disagreeing with the ban. As far as I see it - you hold guys into the ruck - then its open season on the studs. It'll pretty quickly slow down cynical play.

You don't want to get stomped on? Then don't grab the opposition.

We've the TMO and touch judges for that stuff now, like what happened in Clermont for leinster two seasons ago. Think we're past the point where players can mete out their own justice with their studs.

 

[Amiga500]

We've the TMO and touch judges for that stuff now, like what happened in Clermont for leinster two seasons ago. Think we're past the point where players can mete out their own justice with their studs.

But they don't do a thing about it.

Holding at and beyond the ruck is happening all the time.


I remember SOB dropping Nyanga for it a few years ago off a scrum. Try was scored because O'Brien wasn't there to cover the gap. Officials didn't see it or did fk all about it. At least the citing commissioner had the gumption to decide "if we don't pick it up, let them sort it out among themselves"

 

[big ginger 8]

So what about JVDF holding him into the ruck.

If the referee refuses to deal with it - then you can only expect that players take it into their own hands on the pitch.


edit: I had written I wasn't disagreeing with the ban. But actually, I am disagreeing with the ban. As far as I see it - you hold guys into the ruck - then its open season on the studs. It'll pretty quickly slow down cynical play.

You don't want to get stomped on? Then don't grab the opposition.

It's funny you're talking about this as I'm studying defences in criminal cases. One defence is provocation. To use it someone has to have done something that causes you lose self control and whether the reasonable person would have lost control at the provocation. Then some consideration may be given to if the reaction was proportionate.

Being held at a ruck should not cause you to lose self control, many rugby players are held at ruck and do not lose self control. Stamping on someone's head is also not at all proportionate. He has no excuse for his actions especially when there's a number of less drastic measures he could have taken.

 

[Amiga500]

He has no excuse for his actions especially when there's a number of less drastic measures he could have taken.

Would all those actions (that would have freed him back into the defensive line in a timely manner*) have involved use of the studs?

*Unless JVDF suddenly decided to let go - which lets face it - by the usual trend in the game as likely as the moon being made of cheese.


My point really is - if the IRB declared that holding players into a ruck meant open season on studs - would JVDF still have held him in?