[2017 RBS Six Nations] Round 4: England vs Scotland (12/03/2017)

[Goodey]

Guardian might have spotted the first team on some whiteboards at training.

https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/e605...7.jpg?w=1920&q=55&auto=format&usm=12&fit=max&

It does say 'beat scotland' which as a strategy is refreshingly holistic

 

[Lé Ddanno]

[video]https://youtu.be/fHkTTtECNFo[/video]

 

[McTallshort]

I disagreed and pointed out how very little in recent history of both fixtures suggests this at all, I even ignored your, and another, weak attempt at trolling that followed. After that I only mentioned Ireland when pressed by another poster.

I laughed at this line "Even if we just manage to beat the scots that will be a fantastic aheivment - Grand Slam followed by a world record wining streak....Happy Days!"

If I or someone else posted "Even if we just manage to beat the Welsh that will be a fantastic achievement - tournament win and a return to recent European domination....Happy Days!" in the Ireland thread it'd be torn to shreds!

Its a strange complex you have that this "triggered" you!

So agreeing someone who doesn't think Ireland are not the most fantastic team in the universe is now trolling? OK.

You beating Wales would be fantastic achievement but no one posting on this tread give a toss about Ireland or Wales at least not yet because this is tread about England v Scotland. I know you struggle being left out but please see a therapist or something

 

[The Jones Boy]

RIP Scotland

 

[Maverick1987]

what about the wales game last year? you had a massive lead in that one, and let in 2 or 3 trys in the last few minutes, in fact but for the touch judge ruling north out of touch when he clearly wasn't you would have lost that game , I have a feeling that jones will put care on at 60, and he will kick loose

That was only Eddie Jones 4th game though . Fitness levels are through the ceiling now . We are clearly the fittest team in the NH where as back when you were talking about Wales were fitter than us . I think we have improved our ability to play 80 minutes sometime between the end of the 6N and the start of the summer tour to AUS last year

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

what about the wales game last year? you had a massive lead in that one, and let in 2 or 3 trys in the last few minutes, in fact but for the touch judge ruling north out of touch when he clearly wasn't you would have lost that game , I have a feeling that jones will put care on at 60, and he will kick loose

True, some time ago but no, Wales wouldn't have won if North hadn't been called in touch as Webb was about to run into 2 locks 1m from the touch line. I really don't understand where the big myth that the touch judge prevented a certain try comes from, there were 4 or 5 English defenders in the 5m channel all between Webb and the try line, he wasn't getting through.

 

[welshoptimist]

True, some time ago but no, Wales wouldn't have won if North hadn't been called in touch as Webb was about to run into 2 locks 1m from the touch line. I really don't understand where the big myth that the touch judge prevented a certain try comes from, there were 4 or 5 English defenders in the 5m channel all between Webb and the try line, he wasn't getting through.

no but England were on he ropes that game, even taking a tackle and recycling would have made it dicey ,
I'm not saying here that Scotland are going to stomp England, I just think swapping to care will lose them the game, I'm not exactly sure why he swaps the 9 anyway? surely the 9 has the fitness to finish the game?
I wanted to ask as well, and this isn't meant as a slight on the player just but my lack of knowledge of English rugby, how do you feel about ford? he plays every game so he must bring something to the party but ive never really seen him do anything outstanding

 

[Zed]

Scotland have improved over the last year or so, but they only just beat Japan last June/July and only narrowly beat Argentina at home in November. So whilst they are playing better, I don't think they have the capability to beat England especially at home, they've got a pretty poor record at Twickenham. The one thing they have going for them is renewed self-belief and the fact England aren't playing well. If they can get some points on early in the game, it might be close. But I think it will a 20 point win for England.

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no but England were on he ropes that game, even taking a tackle and recycling would have made it dicey ,
how do you feel about ford? he plays every game so he must bring something to the party but ive never really seen him do anything outstanding

I don't think he's the answer for England at 10. I'm undecided about Farrell, he's not a 12, but is playing well so should be in the England setup. England would do so much better with a 10 in the mould of Danny Cipriani. And if someone like that (Alex Lozowski?) does come along I don't think you'll see either Ford or Farrell playing anything more than bit parts for England

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

no but England were on he ropes that game, even taking a tackle and recycling would have made it dicey ,
I'm not saying here that Scotland are going to stomp England, I just think swapping to care will lose them the game, I'm not exactly sure why he swaps the 9 anyway? surely the 9 has the fitness to finish the game?
I wanted to ask as well, and this isn't meant as a slight on the player just but my lack of knowledge of English rugby, how do you feel about ford? he plays every game so he must bring something to the party but ive never really seen him do anything outstanding

I won't deny we were on the ropes but there is a world of difference to being under pressure and saying the touch judge denied you a guaranteed win, there was nothing certain about it at all. As I just said, Webb was about to run into 2 forwards with no space and they could very easily have bundled him into touch. As for Ford, I think he is a force multiplier. In a team that's playing badly I think other flyhalves are better but in a team that is playing well with multiple options running at pace I think he is the best FH in the NH and possibly the world. He has the ability to massively amplify the performance of a team playing well but is definitely a team player 10, he is unlikely to create something from nothing himself.

 

[TommiG88]

what about the wales game last year? you had a massive lead in that one, and let in 2 or 3 trys in the last few minutes, in fact but for the touch judge ruling north out of touch when he clearly wasn't you would have lost that game , I have a feeling that jones will put care on at 60, and he will kick loose

and we still won...

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I won't deny we were on the ropes but there is a world of difference to being under pressure and saying the touch judge denied you a guaranteed win, there was nothing certain about it at all. As I just said, Webb was about to run into 2 forwards with no space and they could very easily have bundled him into touch. As for Ford, I think he is a force multiplier. In a team that's playing badly I think other flyhalves are better but in a team that is playing well with multiple options running at pace I think he is the best FH in the NH and possibly the world. He has the ability to massively amplify the performance of a team playing well but is definitely a team player 10, he is unlikely to create something from nothing himself.

It's like the, if JD had made touch, Wales would have won.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

This is why I hate this board and all non English people these days.

These threads just turn into personal debates from people have their own agendas or are trying to wind people up.

I wonder how pathetic some of you are in real life that you have to come and try and wind people up on here.

Can't we all just get along.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Aye, can we get back on topic please?
We don't want to have to start locking threads and banning people because we can't all just get along

Why can't weeeeee be friends

 

[welshoptimist]

This is why I hate this board and all non English people these days.

These threads just turn into personal debates from people have their own agendas or are trying to wind people up.

I wonder how pathetic some of you are in real life that you have to come and try and wind people up on here.

Can't we all just get along.

I didn't realise I was winding anybody up , I apologise if it seemed that way, the wales game from last year was directly relating to a comment about England not throwing away games in the last few minutes of the game, and I genuinely wanted an English opinion on ford, because I don't see him play as often,
its very unfair to say all non English people should not be part of the thread though, Scotland are a part of this thread too, and surely people from other nations offer interesting opinions on the game because they are neither English or Scottish?

 

[McTallshort]

Yes they can but its a tread about an up coming game between England and Scotland not a welsh/Irish wingeathon

 

[Scotty]

Any thoughts on potential teams?
How nuch will injuries effect scotland? Losing hardie is a big loss he has been good.

Could billy and mako both start against scotland? Personally id like to see it and have hughes like a coiled spring on the bench waiting for the last 20/30

 

[welshoptimist]

Yes they can but its a tread about an up coming game between England and Scotland not a welsh/Irish wingeathon

I think chinese whispers has started to happen here XD I agree, I said I think Scotland will take it by 2 because England will be complacent, will bring on care at 60 and he will kick loose

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Any thoughts on potential teams?
How nuch will injuries effect scotland? Losing hardie is a big loss he has been good.

Could billy and mako both start against scotland? Personally id like to see it and have hughes like a coiled spring on the bench waiting for the last 20/30

yeah hardie is so physical in the tackle Scotland don't have anyone to replace him like for like, will England play itoje on the flank again this match do you think? or back in the 2nd row?

 

[Scotty]

I think chinese whispers has started to happen here XD I agree, I said I think Scotland will take it by 2 because England will be complacent, will bring on care at 60 and he will kick loose

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yeah hardie is so physical in the tackle Scotland don't have anyone to replace him like for like, will England play itoje on the flank again this match do you think? or back in the 2nd row?

They will start itoje on the flank as they have been ehich i still dont like id prefer
Mako
George
Cole
Launch
Itoje
Cliff (give him a shot i rate him but he hasnt been at his best)
Hask
Billy

Marler
Hartley
Sink
Lawes
Hughes

Thats my personal thoughts on the pack

 

[Scotty]

England and ireland win. It comes down to the final game
Scotland and ireland win then all 3 can win but scotland has italy last so is that advantage them
Wales england win england have won it right.?
Am i about right for this?

 

[nh206]

So the 24 retained for the match are:

Forwards (13)
Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers
Jamie George (Saracens)J
Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints)
James Haskell (Wasps)
Nathan Hughes (Wasps)
Maro Itoje (Saracens)
Joe Launchbury (Wasps)
Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints)
Joe Marler (Harlequins)
Kyle Sinckler (Harlequins)
Billy Vunipola (Saracens)
Mako Vunipola (Saracens)
Tom Wood (Northampton Saints)

Backs (11)
Mike Brown (Harlequins)
Danny Care (Harlequins)
Elliot Daly (Wasps)
Owen Farrell (Saracens)
George Ford (Bath Rugby)
Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby)
Jonny May (Gloucester Rugby)
Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs)
Ben Te'o (Worcester Warriors)
Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby)
Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers)

So that means Clifford drops out to accommodate Billy and Slade for Watson. Who dropped out for Mako?

With Watson back, I wonder what that will mean for the back 3. If we assume Eddie still wants to play Daly and Watson at wing (although I'm very wary about making any assumptions when it comes to Eddie) then there are 4 wings in the 24. Maybe 1 drops out tomorrow or we might finally see someone else tested at 15. As a Quins fan I have long been a fan of Brown but he is clearly on the decline and is unlikely to make the next WC. Personally I'd like to see Watson on the wing and Nowell at 15.

 

[Scotty]

So the 24 retained for the match are:

Forwards (13)
Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers
Jamie George (Saracens)J
Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints)
James Haskell (Wasps)
Nathan Hughes (Wasps)
Maro Itoje (Saracens)
Joe Launchbury (Wasps)
Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints)
Joe Marler (Harlequins)
Kyle Sinckler (Harlequins)
Billy Vunipola (Saracens)
Mako Vunipola (Saracens)
Tom Wood (Northampton Saints)

Backs (11)
Mike Brown (Harlequins)
Danny Care (Harlequins)
Elliot Daly (Wasps)
Owen Farrell (Saracens)
George Ford (Bath Rugby)
Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby)
Jonny May (Gloucester Rugby)
Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs)
Ben Te'o (Worcester Warriors)
Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby)
Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers)

So that means Clifford drops out to accommodate Billy and Slade for Watson. Who dropped out for Mako?

With Watson back, I wonder what that will mean for the back 3. If we assume Eddie still wants to play Daly and Watson at wing (although I'm very wary about making any assumptions when it comes to Eddie) then there are 4 wings in the 24. Maybe 1 drops out tomorrow or we might finally see someone else tested at 15. As a Quins fan I have long been a fan of Brown but he is clearly on the decline and is unlikely to make the next WC. Personally I'd like to see Watson on the wing and Nowell at 15.

Surprised cliff was dropped for billy instead of wood. No point in him he'll never be a real part of the team when all fit, where as cliff has so much potencial for a young player.
Jj back in so slade out
Nowell brown daly starting. Watson in on bench for may

For me back 3 ending nowell daly(fb) watson