[2015 Six Nations] England

[Aristodemus]

Barritt isn't good enough, he has proved that many times in an England shirt.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

He did enough in the autumn to overtake 36, in my books.
Wouldn't be my first choice but we could do a lot worse.

 

[McTallshort]

Barritt isn't good enough, he has proved that many times in an England shirt.

I would say the opposite, did you see his performance against Australia?

 

[Tony Manx]

I would say the opposite, did you see his performance against Australia?

I agree! Not only for his courage on that match but when he is not playing the defence is deficient! If he is fit - he plays!!

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

I wouldn't say Barritt is our best but he's definitely one of our most reliable. You know what you get if you stick Barritt on the pitch and tbh his attacking wasn't THAT bad recently. He's a solid guy that you can stick in if it looks like the centres are struggling.

 

[j'nuh]

I would say the opposite, did you see his performance against Australia?

He touched the ball three times in 80 minutes. One pass, two runs. A grand total of 0 meters made. At outside centre. It was a sterling defensive effort, but the Australia game just confirmed what everybody knew: he may be the best defensive centre in the world, but there isn't a single attacking bone in his body. I would have expected him to work on it, but he hasn't really progressed in that side of his game since his arrival on the England scene.

He's not big or physical enough to make clean breaks or even half-breaks, he's not fast enough to go around people, his vision is limited to passing the ball onto the next guy in the line, he isn't particularly an offloader, he doesn't cut good angles or run effective dummy lines, he has no kicking game to speak of. His stats always tell the same story: plenty of tackles made and few missed, but not really anything else positive to say.

 

[McTallshort]

He touched the ball three times in 80 minutes. One pass, two runs. A grand total of 0 meters made. At outside centre. It was a sterling defensive effort, but the Australia game just confirmed what everybody knew: he may be the best defensive centre in the world, but there isn't a single attacking bone in his body. I would have expected him to work on it, but he hasn't really progressed in that side of his game since his arrival on the England scene.

He's not big or physical enough to make clean breaks or even half-breaks, he's not fast enough to go around people, his vision is limited to passing the ball onto the next guy in the line, he isn't particularly an offloader, he doesn't cut good angles or run effective dummy lines, he has no kicking game to speak of. His stats always tell the same story: plenty of tackles made and few missed, but not really anything else positive to say.

You dont win world cups playing fancy rugby. Defense is key.

As for the second paragraph well if all that is true its a miracle he every made it as a professional rugby player, playing for one of the best clubs in England and being capped a great number of times by a number of England coaches but then Scott Johnson managed to fool everyone he was a world class coach so you might be right.

 

[Aristodemus]

It is two different mentalities, you go out and try to win or you go out to try to not lose. Barritt is the latter. Defence is much easier to teach than attack.

I would go Burrell JJ, but my first choice is Eastmond Tuilagi.

 

[j'nuh]

You dont win world cups playing fancy rugby. Defense is key.

It's not an either/or. Teams need to be competent at both to win a world cup.

As for the second paragraph well if all that is true its a miracle he every made it as a professional rugby player, playing for one of the best clubs in England and being capped a great number of times by a number of England coaches but then Scott Johnson managed to fool everyone he was a world class coach so you might be right.

I'm talking relatively i.e. he's not big or powerful enough to punch holes through an international defence, but I'm sure he'd look like a world-beater against an amateur one. That said, I doubt he'd even make it as a Premiership player if he had a poor-to-average defensive game.

 

[McTallshort]

It is two different mentalities, you go out and try to win or you go out to try to not lose. Barritt is the latter. Defence is much easier to teach than attack.

I would go Burrell JJ, but my first choice is Eastmond Tuilagi.

But very hard to get right at the top level and requires a certain mental strength that lots of players sadly lack

- - - Updated - - -

It's not an either/or. Teams need to be competent at both to win a world cup.


I doubt he'd even make it as a Premiership player if he had a poor-to-average defensive game.

and you know centres with a poor to average defensive game in the Premiership?

 

[j'nuh]

and you know centres with a poor to average defensive game in the Premiership?

If Barritt had the defensive game of Trinder, he'd be playing in the Championship.

 

[McTallshort]

Your wrong

 

[j'nuh]

Of course, if Barritt had his defensive game and Trinder's attacking game, we'd have the second-coming of BOD.

 

[McTallshort]

Of course, if Barritt had his defensive game and Trinder's attacking game, we'd have the second-coming of BOD.

Careful! never take BODs name in vain there are Irishmen on this forum whos sole job is to skim through the posts to ensure we dont do that.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

I just got round to watching the Saints-Sale game. If Burrell continues dropping balls when under no pressure then I won't want him in the centres. Defensively he hasn't been brilliant and in that game his attack wasn't too good either. Having said that he was good last 6 nations so...

 

[Peat]

I think I've had the Barritt debate here one or two times, maybe, so I'm just going to say "I totally agree with J'nuh but think he's pussyfooting around it a little".

 

[glawsfan]

I would love to see JJ given a chance. To me he is the best natural 13 we have and has showed enough to get a chance in the six nations.

Inside centre is more tricky at the moment I would go with Burrell but it would be interesting to see how the Eastmond/Joseph combination given a chance for England.

 

[Mumbles119]

Definitely would like to see the Eastmond/JJ combination. What is the status of both their recent injuries and availability?

But the more I think about it (and watching him all this season) I really really really want Slade involved.

But would he fit 12? Could he adapt quickly enough to England's game plan, new team mates, and a positional change again?

 

[goodNumber10]

He touched the ball three times in 80 minutes. One pass, two runs. A grand total of 0 meters made. At outside centre. It was a sterling defensive effort, but the Australia game just confirmed what everybody knew: he may be the best defensive centre in the world, but there isn't a single attacking bone in his body. I would have expected him to work on it, but he hasn't really progressed in that side of his game since his arrival on the England scene.

He's not big or physical enough to make clean breaks or even half-breaks, he's not fast enough to go around people, his vision is limited to passing the ball onto the next guy in the line, he isn't particularly an offloader, he doesn't cut good angles or run effective dummy lines, he has no kicking game to speak of. His stats always tell the same story: plenty of tackles made and few missed, but not really anything else positive to say.

Wait? You mean George Ford didn't ignite the back line by zipping every single ball to the outside backs to rip open the Australians?

i don't believe it...

Surely an outside centers stats of 3 touches of the ball (which i presume 1 for 2 equals) tells you more about the nature of the players inside him than the fact he can't attack.

I just got round to watching the Saints-Sale game. If Burrell continues dropping balls when under no pressure then I won't want him in the centres. Defensively he hasn't been brilliant and in that game his attack wasn't too good either. Having said that he was good last 6 nations so...

one bad game, in a poor Saints performance, otherwise he's been excellent.

 

[Patchey]

GN10 is entering Andy Farrell mode again guys, take cover!!!



I'm resigned to a Barritt-Burrell 12/13 combo for the first game, with it becoming Burrell-Manu when the big lad is fit again.

I was very sceptical about Burrell last year, especially him playing at 13 and his defense there, and he didn't let us down at all. So while I'd rather see Joseph or Eastmond I fairly happy with him playing. I would like to see how he does playing in his more familiar position with Manu outside him as well. Practically the only centre combo we haven't tried over the last few years!