2014 QBE Internationals [EOYT] England

[TRF_Olyy]

Lancaster despises Sale players.

It's because he gets spat on whenever he comes to our games for defecting to the other side of the Pennines.

It's even in his name, but he still goes off to Y*rkshire.

 

[Patchey]

I only just realised just how blasphemous a Cumbrian called 'Lancaster' playing and managing Leeds is...

Blimey.

 

[Jbobo]

Nothing to do with this Autumn, but reading and seeing a clip of Sam Burgess breaking his cheek bone and eye socket after 6 seconds and then playing on to win man of the match is a little freightening from a Welsh point of view...


Had to get it off my chest. :crazy::crazy::crazy:

 

[j'nuh]

Ben Morgan has put in some fantastic performances for Gloucester. On balance, I'd say him and Laidlaw have been Gloucester's best players at the beginning of this season. Great news for England (and Scotland!).

 

[ratsapprentice]

http://www.therugbypaper.co.uk/feat...t-kyle-eastmond-is-central-to-baths-new-look/
http://www.therugbypaper.co.uk/feat...-lees-backs-strongman-dave-ewers-for-england/

 

[Peat]

My gods, Guscott is making sense...

 

[goodNumber10]

My gods, Guscott is making sense...

Does he? i struggled to read his GCSE English so closed the window... terrible writer, terrible pundit.

 

[TheSaffycen]

Right so after 5 rounds of the prem who has been the top performers for England in each position ? So top 2 in each position to see who is battling out for the England shirt purely on form. I will try to base this on the rugby I have watched this season..
1.Barrington/Mullen
2.Webber/Hartley
3.Wilson/Brookes
4.Attwood/Launchbury
5.Lawes/Day
6.Ewers/Woods
7.Robshaw/Haskell
8.Vunipola/Morgan
9.Care/Cook
10.Ford/Myler
11.Arscott/May
12.Eastmond/Hill
13.Joseph/Slade
14.Rokodunguni/Yarde
15.Foden/Brown

 

[Wendigo7]

Right so after 5 rounds of the prem who has been the top performers for England in each position ? So top 2 in each position to see who is battling out for the England shirt purely on form. I will try to base this on the rugby I have watched this season..
1.Barrington/Mullen
2.Webber/Hartley
3.Wilson/Brookes
4.Attwood/Launchbury
5.Lawes/Day
6.Ewers/Woods
7.Robshaw/Haskell
8.Vunipola/Morgan
9.Care/Cook
10.Ford/Myler
11.Arscott/May
12.Eastmond/Hill
13.Joseph/Slade
14.Rokodunguni/Yarde
15.Foden/Brown

Cleary said as much in the Telegraph. For what it's worth Cleary usually spouts ********, but in this case he made a good point about a lot of things to do with England which needed to be resolved in the AIs. Trust in the new players, Ford and Eastmond particular were a part of the subject. We fear their defence and we are uncomfortable with a non goal kicking 10 so our first idea is to get rid of them. Wasn't a bad read.

That said please see below:


Starting XV:
1. Alex Corbisiero
2. Rob Webber
3. Dan Cole
4. Joe Launchbury
5. Courtney Lawes
6. Tom Wood
7. Chris Robshaw (Capt)
8. Billy Vunipola
9. Danny Care
10. George Ford (Kick)
11. Marland Yarde
12. Billy Twelvetrees
13. Manu Tuilagi
14. Semesa Rokodoguni
15. Mike Brown

Substitutes:
16. Joe Marler
17. Dylan Hartley
18. David Wilson
19. Dave Attwood
20. Ben Morgan/James Haskell
21. Ben Youngs
22. Owen Farrell
23. Jonathan Joseph

That's the team I'd pick as England's strongest team currently if everyone was fit. It's very harsh on Eastmond I know, but until I know whether 2 small un's could play in an international team in it's spine I didn't want to pick it out of centiment. I tried to pick the best all round side. If it's proved wrong in the AIs however, then Eastmond should be the 12 by default.

The only reason as I've said elsewhere I'd change the team would be if we played Wales or SA. At that point I'd prefer bulk to compensate and hence Farrell and Billy would be a far more prominent pairing but other than that, I would give Ford and Eastmond license to run riot if possible.

 

[Peat]

Link to Cleary?

I'd be worried about an injury to Brown in that team.

 

[goodNumber10]

Cleary said as much in the Telegraph. For what it's worth Cleary usually spouts ********, but in this case he made a good point about a lot of things to do with England which needed to be resolved in the AIs. Trust in the new players, Ford and Eastmond particular were a part of the subject. We fear their defence and we are uncomfortable with a non goal kicking 10 so our first idea is to get rid of them. Wasn't a bad read.

That said please see below:


Starting XV:
1. Alex Corbisiero
2. Rob Webber
3. Dan Cole
4. Joe Launchbury
5. Courtney Lawes
6. Tom Wood
7. Chris Robshaw (Capt)
8. Billy Vunipola
9. Danny Care
10. George Ford (Kick)
11. Marland Yarde
12. Billy Twelvetrees
13. Manu Tuilagi
14. Semesa Rokodoguni
15. Mike Brown

Substitutes:
16. Joe Marler
17. Dylan Hartley
18. David Wilson
19. Dave Attwood
20. Ben Morgan/James Haskell
21. Ben Youngs
22. Owen Farrell
23. Jonathan Joseph

That's the team I'd pick as England's strongest team currently if everyone was fit. It's very harsh on Eastmond I know, but until I know whether 2 small un's could play in an international team in it's spine I didn't want to pick it out of centiment. I tried to pick the best all round side. If it's proved wrong in the AIs however, then Eastmond should be the 12 by default.

The only reason as I've said elsewhere I'd change the team would be if we played Wales or SA. At that point I'd prefer bulk to compensate and hence Farrell and Billy would be a far more prominent pairing but other than that, I would give Ford and Eastmond license to run riot if possible.

no arguments with that team, i think that's pretty close to what we'll get with maybe Farrell and Burrell at 10/12.

 

[TheSaffycen]

Cleary said as much in the Telegraph. For what it's worth Cleary usually spouts ********, but in this case he made a good point about a lot of things to do with England which needed to be resolved in the AIs. Trust in the new players, Ford and Eastmond particular were a part of the subject. We fear their defence and we are uncomfortable with a non goal kicking 10 so our first idea is to get rid of them. Wasn't a bad read.

That said please see below:


Starting XV:
1. Alex Corbisiero
2. Rob Webber
3. Dan Cole
4. Joe Launchbury
5. Courtney Lawes
6. Tom Wood
7. Chris Robshaw (Capt)
8. Billy Vunipola
9. Danny Care
10. George Ford (Kick)
11. Marland Yarde
12. Billy Twelvetrees
13. Manu Tuilagi
14. Semesa Rokodoguni
15. Mike Brown

Substitutes:
16. Joe Marler
17. Dylan Hartley
18. David Wilson
19. Dave Attwood
20. Ben Morgan/James Haskell
21. Ben Youngs
22. Owen Farrell
23. Jonathan Joseph

That's the team I'd pick as England's strongest team currently if everyone was fit. It's very harsh on Eastmond I know, but until I know whether 2 small un's could play in an international team in it's spine I didn't want to pick it out of centiment. I tried to pick the best all round side. If it's proved wrong in the AIs however, then Eastmond should be the 12 by default.

The only reason as I've said elsewhere I'd change the team would be if we played Wales or SA. At that point I'd prefer bulk to compensate and hence Farrell and Billy would be a far more prominent pairing but other than that, I would give Ford and Eastmond license to run riot if possible.

If everyone was fit and firing that is a very dangerous team. The only changes I would make are Haskell for Wood, Cipriani for Ford. The reason for the Haskell pick is his ability to slow down the ball and he is much more physical in defence and doesn't lose much in terms of missed tackles compared to Wood. Also if we go for Ford I feel you have to pick Eastmond, but if Kyle doesn't play then i want Cipriani just as on talent he is the best fly half we have IMO. Maybe look at Ewers in the 20 shirt but apart from that I think we have a pretty similar team.

no arguments with that team, i think that's pretty close to what we'll get with maybe Farrell and Burrell at 10/12.

That would be a strange move away from what Lancaster has been looking to achieve. By having Farrell, Burrell, Tuilagi you have pretty much no creativity in the team, and no ball for the wingers. We would have an abundance of power and pace but would it really work against the likes of the Boks and All Blacks ? O'Driscoll said that he always feared playing England when they had to playmakers over the big guys.

 

[Wendigo7]

If everyone was fit and firing that is a very dangerous team. The only changes I would make are Haskell for Wood, Cipriani for Ford. The reason for the Haskell pick is his ability to slow down the ball and he is much more physical in defence and doesn't lose much in terms of missed tackles compared to Wood. Also if we go for Ford I feel you have to pick Eastmond, but if Kyle doesn't play then i want Cipriani just as on talent he is the best fly half we have IMO. Maybe look at Ewers in the 20 shirt but apart from that I think we have a pretty similar team.


That would be a strange move away from what Lancaster has been looking to achieve. By having Farrell, Burrell, Tuilagi you have pretty much no creativity in the team, and no ball for the wingers. We would have an abundance of power and pace but would it really work against the likes of the Boks and All Blacks ? O'Driscoll said that he always feared playing England when they had to playmakers over the big guys.

I've said my piece on here I think Ford has the ability and may go on to be the best player in the world. The only thing that will hold him back is doubts on his goalkicking and will he get picked in this setup. To each their own opinion.

Ewers is playing very well and could get a call up. I'd also argue, Cipriani is playing as well as he can and it still might not be as handy as Ford.

Regardless of my ranting on though. Your argument with NZ and SA is an interesting one and I might be in a slight minority, but I think we will win 2 from 2. My difference in opinion from most is, I think if we play brawns, we beat SA and if we play intelligent we beat NZ. Slightly bizzarre but we are setup very well to beat NZ and I don't oddly fear them half as much as SA. With SA I worry, moreso because if we play expansive, SA are a bit tougher in defence out wide and are often cynical. We will lose if we try to play that game. However, in stark reverse to the norm, if we play dumber on dumber, brawn against brawn I actually think we're bigger and more explosive on impact and we should win. Would be a lovely irony if that did happen.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

I've said my piece on here I think Ford has the ability and may go on to be the best player in the world. The only thing that will hold him back is doubts on his goalkicking and will he get picked in this setup. To each their own opinion.

Ewers is playing very well and could get a call up. I'd also argue, Cipriani is playing as well as he can and it still might not be as handy as Ford.

Regardless of my ranting on though. Your argument with NZ and SA is an interesting one and I might be in a slight minority, but I think we will win 2 from 2. My difference in opinion from most is, I think if we play brawns, we beat SA and if we play intelligent we beat NZ. Slightly bizzarre but we are setup very well to beat NZ and I don't oddly fear them half as much as SA. With SA I worry, moreso because if we play expansive, SA are a bit tougher in defence out wide and are often cynical. We will lose if we try to play that game. However, in stark reverse to the norm, if we play dumber on dumber, brawn against brawn I actually think we're bigger and more explosive on impact and we should win. Would be a lovely irony if that did happen.

The golden rule of rugby is you don't try to outmuscle SA. NZ beat them by playing intelligently and quickly, as they do with most teams. The only part where you need to outmuscle them is the breakdown to ensure you can get fast ball.

I think the Ford-Eastmond partnership would work better than any other 10-12 combination we can put out. Individually I think they are the best in their positions for England but I think taking them together is better than the sum of their parts. When we had the chance to try Ford he ended up injured and so missed out. Eastmond has been thrown in against a very weak team (Argentina) and then the best in the world, both times with the rest of the team also being changed around. Neither of them have had a fair go to show what they can really do for England and I think Lancaster would really be shooting himself in the foot if he overlooked them now. At the very least they need to play 1 game together in the AI.

 

[Peat]

Ford's got a better support network around him at the moment though. He probably won't enjoy the level of help that the Bath pack and Eastmond could give him at international level. I'm not going to call Cipriani a one man band, but no one's calling for the rest of the Sale backline to be considered for England, no one's talking about the Sale pack as England contenders. I think you'd see Cipriani play better simply if you put him in a better team - and I think the conerse is true of Ford.

I'd be happy with either but I think I'm tending towards Cipriani.

I think you're definitely in a slight minority on us winning 2 from 2 - please be right! :lol:

 

[Jaguares]

England is the favorite against the Aussies?

 

[Wendigo7]

England is the favorite against the Aussies?

I'd bloody hope so.

They are a rabble and if half the rumours going round about Link are remotely true. He won't make past the next 2 weeks, let alone the AIs.

Let me amend what I just stated. If true, he could be sacked tomorrow.

 

[Josht36]

I really hope Lancaster doesn't rule out Eastmond. When you consider how many chances Twelvetrees has had without ever really cementing his place I think Eastmond should get a few more matches to prove his worth. I also think he would help negate the more one dimensional nature of Farrell more than Twelvetrees because he is a better distributor. That way you could have that defensive solidity and slightly more consistent goal kicking of Farrell along with some better distribution to Tuilagi and the wingers from Eastmond. If it was up to me I would probably have Ford/Cipriani as well but I don't think Farrell Snr/Lancaster will go for that.

I don't actually think Fords and Farrells kicking percentages are very different. I can't remember the exact numbers but I think Ford might have even been ahead the last couple of seasons. However the difference is when Ford is on an off day he seems to find it much tougher to correct himself. I don't think the top teams will forgive you matches like Ford had against Saracens last Friday.

So in short if it was up to me I would go:

9. Care
10. Farrell
11. Yarde
12. Eastmond
13. Manu
14. Rokodoguni
15. Brown

21. Ben Youngs
22. Ford/Cips
23. Joseph

 

[Patchey]

A lot of very sensible chat about how well Joseph is playing. He way almost this good at the start of last season but got injured so we ended up with Tompkins instead... I think the difference this season is he is playing a bit better but his partnership with Eastmond, and their role within the Bath attack, has been honed to a fine point. I think if we do see Joseph this autumn it will only be with Eastmond inside him. Not saying thats a bad thing, but I guess it limits the chances of Joseph getting a crack. Some people have suggested he be in the squad at 23, which works but only if one of the starting wingers is a dcenet fullback cover (Nowell or Watson then). He'll be in the EPS though I should think.



As an aside, the idea of Farrel and Burrell at 10/12 fills me with dread.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Yeah - JJ being omitted from the EPS would be very unfair.