2014 Junior World Championship - June 2 to 20

[TRF_heineken]

South Africa have played well, but New Zealand has been atrocious. Our ball handling has been pathetic - we've had almost 20 handling errors (and we haven't even had that much ball). Our lineout has been a joke. South Africa haven't even had to compete at lineout time and we still can't throw the ball in straight (or anywhere near our jumpers). Don't get me wrong - South Africa has played well. Indeed I think they would have probably have beaten this NZ side even if we had played to our potential, but this has been the worst performance from a NZ side at this level. IMO the score seriously flatters New Zealand.

yeah, and we gave away silly penalties at times.

Glad with the win, now we must just keep on going...

 

[Darwin]

Game over. South Africa too good. New Zealand need to smash Scotland and rely on other matches going their way if they want to make the semis.

To summarize NZ performance:
- Lineouts: disaster
- Maul defense: poor, but improved during the match (once they were told at half-time not to compete... seriously could they have not worked that out themselves)
- Scrums: ok. South Africa had the edge (forcing one TH), but we did better than I expected.
- Ball handling: shocking
- Backline play: Poor. This was to some degree down to South Africa's strong defense, but we did shuffle side to side far to often - we needed someone to straighten the line.

On the players:
- Both hookers were poor, but we don't have any other options....
- Sanders at 6 was the pick of the forwards - handy with ball in hand and great at the breakdown.
- Peni was a waste of space. He's a massive lad but doesn't seem to realize it. He refuses to run with any pace with ball in hand, doesn't hit breakdowns, and gave away a number of penalties. Harris should start at 6 with Sanders at 8 next match
- Drummond was ok considering the poor service he got.
- Hickey was a bit underwhelming. He did get poor ball, but I expected a bit more from a Super Rugby player
- Midfield was anonymous
- Li is a freak
- McKenzie again showed some great touches. He was superb under the high ball, his positioning was superb, and his passing was impressive too. He was a bit lateral at times, and he seriously needs to add some bulk as he was thrown around like a child on a number of occasions...

 

[bobbilycious]

So'otala Fa'aso'o would have added a bit of size and would also add another lineout option (our backrow are currently all quite short). I'm not sure how big Beau Williams is, but given that our locks are all quite light, and he has ITM Cup experience, he probably wouldn't have been a bad option either. It is a shame that big Brian Alainu'uese got injured, he would have been useful in a game like that.

I'd go with:

9.Fukofuka - has a bit more size and might be better able to deal with being behind a poor forward pack
10.McKenzie - has looked good, but runs away from his support when counterattacking. He also doesn't seem aware of the players around him (who are sometimes in good positions)
11.Li
12.Faiane - A great player who is wasted on the wing
13.Lienert-Brown
14.Aso
15.Tuimavave

I'd also make substitutions a bit earlier if the forward pack started getting absolutely dominated.

I haven't seen enough of the forwards to really be able to make judgments, aside from the fact that Tom Sanders should be starting. I would like to see Mitch Jacobson in action (Boshier hasn't really played superbly) and Troy Callander would add a bit of size to the forward pack (Cridge hasn't impressed me and he is pretty light, I'd pull him). I don't know who I'd play at No.8. Can we injure someone and bring in Fa'aso'o? We don't even have to pay to fly him out!

 

[Gena_ZA]

Baby Boks showed their mettle today, very chuffed and the next generation of Springboks is born

 

[SomeOke]

Brutally efficient from the Baby Boks, they identified the problem areas of the NZ side and went for the jugular. NZ just weren't organised enough in key areas.
Will certainly take any win in NZ from any SA side . Pity our senior side can't do the same haha.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Boks bench is the strongest in the tournament.

Very likely winners.

 

[Maverick1987]

If Ireland score 4 tries against Fiji that means NZ will be out yeh ?

 

[goodNumber10]

can you imagine NZ going out in the pool stages of their very own JWC?

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Glad for the win and despite the 4-try bonus (and crucially disallowing NZ a bonus point) one can't say it was a pretty game. Entertaining nonetheless but ugly. A win built on set piece superiority and NZ mistakes. We missed some top players but damn!!, the handling -especially early on was atroscious and certainly not up to the standard I expect at this level. NZ's handling was just as poor so maybe conditions? At some point I was wondering whether it wouldn't be good to move Pollard to 12 and bring in Rob du Preez at 10 just to get some 'game' into the mid-field. But the boys pulled through and credit has to go to them and coach Theron.

That got me thinking, since Theron took over coming in from the Griquas, the Griquas have turned kak(ish) and the Baby Bokke have in 3 years (okay, so this year is in progress), won a ***le at home, beat NZ 3/3 and impressively suffered only 2 defeats. The one that loss to Ireland at home in 2012 that I credit as helping long run as we had to beat England with a bonus point to get through which got the team in gear and the 1 point loss (which could've so easily have gone the other way!!) to eventual champions Wales in 2013.

Anyway happy for the win today and hope we go well (with some key injured guys returning?) and don't suffer further injury blows against Samoa... Us and Samoa, sheesh! Hopefully our games against them at top level in recent years aren't an indication of what can be expected!!

Dawie Theron Bok coach 2016?

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

If Ireland score 4 tries against Fiji that means NZ will be out yeh ?

Assuming France also beats Wales, yes.


Which is one of the two likeliest scenarios as I see them meaning the semi's will be;

(seed 1) England vs (seed 4) Ireland
(seed 2) SA vs (seed 3) France

I can't see Ireland not beating Fiji with 4 tries now that they know what they need to do but if Wales beat France:

(seed 1) England vs (seed 4) NZ
(seed 2) SA vs (seed 3) Ireland

 

[Darwin]

So'otala Fa'aso'o would have added a bit of size and would also add another lineout option (our backrow are currently all quite short). I'm not sure how big Beau Williams is, but given that our locks are all quite light, and he has ITM Cup experience, he probably wouldn't have been a bad option either. It is a shame that big Brian Alainu'uese got injured, he would have been useful in a game like that.

I'd go with:

9.Fukofuka - has a bit more size and might be better able to deal with being behind a poor forward pack
10.McKenzie - has looked good, but runs away from his support when counterattacking. He also doesn't seem aware of the players around him (who are sometimes in good positions)
11.Li
12.Faiane - A great player who is wasted on the wing
13.Lienert-Brown
14.Aso
15.Tuimavave

I'd also make substitutions a bit earlier if the forward pack started getting absolutely dominated.

I haven't seen enough of the forwards to really be able to make judgments, aside from the fact that Tom Sanders should be starting. I would like to see Mitch Jacobson in action (Boshier hasn't really played superbly) and Troy Callander would add a bit of size to the forward pack (Cridge hasn't impressed me and he is pretty light, I'd pull him). I don't know who I'd play at No.8. Can we injure someone and bring in Fa'aso'o? We don't even have to pay to fly him out!

I agree with most of that. I was very surprised Fa'aso'o was not included initially, and we are really missing what he could bring. He's a big lad like Peni, but looks far more mobile. Personally my loose trio (from the available players) would be: 6. Harris, 7. Jacobsen, 8. Sanders (I understand Sanders is primarily an 8 in any case). Harris was the pick of the forwards in the first match for me, while Sanders was the pick in 2nd. Boshier has made his tackles but has been largely ineffective at the breakdown so I would be tempted to give Jacobson a start as you suggest.

As you mention we are really missing a big lock too (Alainu'uese would been ideal if fit!) - Cridge really needs to start hitting the gym! Dickson is a similar build - if Callander is a bit more solid as you suggest he may be worth a start. I think our front row has actually been ok (Faiva's lineout throwing aside).

I like the backline you have proposed, though know nothing at all about Fukofuka. I'm not sure what I would do with McKenzie - he's done some fantastic work under the high ball and covering at fullback, but he does run away from his support a bit on the counter-attack (as you suggest). I would probably give Hickey another shot at 10 (and I'm sure they will stick with him as he is the captain), and Faiane should start at 12.

No matter what we do it may be too little too late, as if France beats Wales it will probably be game over for us (in terms of winning the tournament). If only we had done the sensible thing and taken the 3 when down by 10 with 15 mins to go (rather than kicking to the corner and then not throwing the ball straight into the lineout) - a losing bonus point would have left us far more in control of our own destiny.....

 

[Jaguares]

Bad tournament for Pumitas, we won Junior Wallabies in the last 2 years. So is very strange a defeat against Italy this year

:injured:

 

[profitius]

Better performance from the Paddies. A bonus point against Fiji will see us in the last 4 which is a big turnaround.

 

[nickdnz]

Well, as disgusted I am with the Jr All Blacks, I admit I was wrong about Li. He is as Darwin says, a freak.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

Ireland having a shot at a semi final spot is a surprise. It's possibly the weakest team to come from here in a few years and the star players (Leavy, O'Brien, Byrne) are absent.

There really is a flaw in the way the tournament is structured. Would four pools of three teams playing cross-pool games (ie the 3 teams in Pool A play the 3 teams in Pool B) and the top four records regardless of group go through be a better option?

 

[munstermuffin]

Ireland having a shot at a semi final spot is a surprise. It's possibly the weakest team to come from here in a few years and the star players (Leavy, O'Brien, Byrne) are absent.

There really is a flaw in the way the tournament is structured. Would four pools of three teams playing cross-pool games (ie the 3 teams in Pool A play the 3 teams in Pool B) and the top four records regardless of group go through be a better option?

That'd get confusing too snoop as people would argue on getting weaker teams etc. While your right it's the weakest bunch in a while it must be said Ruddock has them set up well and to be fair I think there's a few their with serious potential. Obviously with my Munster eyes I'm watching Jack O'Donoghue and well he's really getting better week on week

 

[Feicarsinn]

Garry Ringrose is the new anoited one. All hail.

 

[Groundhog]

^ Yeah I can get behind that. Fellow has mad skills.
It's nice to see a centre from Munster playing well in Goggin too.

 

[Feicarsinn]

Statistical anomaly.

 

[munstermuffin]

^ Yeah I can get behind that. Fellow has mad skills.
It's nice to see a centre from Munster playing well in Goggin too.

Goggin is great bit of stuff but can be frustrating or brilliant so jury still out