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[2014 EOYT] Wales vs New Zealand

Slade is a shue in. You heard it hear first.

Barrett is almost pointless to have in the squad as once you get to the semi's/final its a dour affair and usually not an open game that will suit Barrett (eve more so with it being in the UK). They either need to select all four of them or select Cruden, Carter and Slade imo. They can probably get away with taking 4 of them... but there's still guys like Kahui and others to come back so that will change things around a bit in the squad make up.

But anyway. Ill bet a dollar to a donut one of these guys atleast is going to get injured before then and for mine its actually more likely to be Cruden or Carter.

So I suspect like it or not we are going to see more of Slade before the WC.

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This is why im such a supporter of Slades. I watched him since his comeback and there were two or three games for the Highlanders where he actually totally dominated the match (other than Cruden a couple years back nobody in NZ has done that). In the Crusaders enviroment I feel he wasnt allowed to shine as they wrongly played him at fullback initially then the teams confidence was down after losses and then he gets handed it after the total failure of Taylor. Then they get to the final and DC is running the ship again....... Carter has been given far to much of a soft ride back in each time. Hindsight is always a good thing but Blackadder and Hansen and CO have dropped the ball with Carter just walking in and out of both teams constantly. I know it was though Carters injuries but ever since going to france he's never been quite the same.

I didn't think Kahui was coming back ... Who for and when?

Congrats on the game Wales, you had me a bit worried for most of the match ... The pool of death will. Be an interesting and entertaining watch at the RWC
 
Slade is a shue in. You heard it hear first.

But anyway. Ill bet a dollar to a donut one of these guys atleast is going to get injured before then and for mine its actually more likely to be Cruden or Carter.

So I suspect like it or not we are going to see more of Slade before the WC.

-[QUOTE]

is this the same Colin Slade who has had about 4 different season ending injuries..? Granted Carter is injury prone but at least he is old, Slade is equally injury prone and is still young!
 
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No it doesn't and no it isn't.

In the English language "Would have" is what is known as the "conditional perfect". It refers to a missed opportunity in the past.

When using it as a contraction. it contracts to "would’ve", not "would of."

The word "of" is a preposition, it makes no linguistic sense to use it in this fashion. It is never correct to write "would have" as "would of.". The only way "would: can be followed directly by "of"[/i] is when the preposition "of"refers to an expression after itself. So, the present conditional "would" is followed by an expression that begins with "of"., for example

I can ask no more of you than I would of myself (the "of" refers to "myself")

I sorry if this seems pedantic, but I don't like seeing the English language bastardised when it is not hard to get it right!

Its honestly pathetic but iv kinda come to expect this kind of stuff from a few people around here!

Its always pretty telling when people start resorting to calling you out on grammar errors or spelling mistakes. I type fast and I couldnt give a toss about any of this stuff im sure im getting my point across and thats all that matters.

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Slade is a shue in. You heard it hear first.

But anyway. Ill bet a dollar to a donut one of these guys atleast is going to get injured before then and for mine its actually more likely to be Cruden or Carter.

So I suspect like it or not we are going to see more of Slade before the WC.

- - - U/QUOTE]

is this the same Colin Slade who has had about 4 different season ending injuries..? Granted Carter is injury prone but at least he is old, Slade is equally injury prone and is still young!

Slade is holding up just fine. Carter is at the stage where every time you see him make a bad judgement and run at two massive forwards in a gang tackle that ARE going to smash him you know he's gone for the season.
 
hate to be a stickler (and to turn this into another Donald thread) but that wasn't the case. He only came on for an injury. If there wasn't any injuries I doubt he would have even got on the field, it definitely wasn't a tactical sub.

Barrett's kicking from hand and tee was poor. He didn't know how to cope with the rush defence. He was, as he usually is, dangerous from broken play. Maybe he is a 15/10 rather than the other way round?

It could be a straight shoot out between him and Slade for a squad spot.

true, wasn't meaning Donald was a tactical sub but meaning we won the game through a constant effort not through opening up the game with tactical subs, I agree Donald wasn't a tactical sub, he came on, he knew the game plan and delivered. My point is perhaps from a WC perspective we don't need game breaker or players that can open up the game, maybe we need players that can continue the struggle and play within the pattern. I am a fan of Barrett, I was just pointing out it maybe his performance this wkend may have shown Hanson something's. I believe this is why Sonny got so much game time, they want a player who can deliver what Nonu does, they are looking toward Crotty as opposed to Fekatoa because as Hanson says he is another Conrad Smith. In Carter and Cruden and now I believe Slade we have similar player, Barrett as wonderful as he is, may not fill that role.
 
I didn't think Kahui was coming back ... Who for and when?

Congrats on the game Wales, you had me a bit worried for most of the match ... The pool of death will. Be an interesting and entertaining watch at the RWC

Yeah looks like your right I thought he was due to media suggesting it earlier in the year but I see now the Chiefs squad appears to be done and dusted so obviously he's not going to be around.
 
No idea who you are or where you're Originally from. I thought Hibbard and Roberts do what they always do, go into contact. They do what their limitations and Wales' game plan allow them to. I like Brian usually, but I have no idea why he chose JR as MOM. Eddie Butler asked him 3 times and he eventually plumped for JR as he could not think of any other. Kieran Rad was a more obvious candidate for me.

He was indeed Rad :) Personally I would have gone for Retallick, but Read too had a good game. I thought the Welsh halfback was pretty sharp too.


Slade is a shue in. You heard it hear first.

Barrett is almost pointless to have in the squad as once you get to the semi's/final its a dour affair and usually not an open game that will suit Barrett (eve more so with it being in the UK). They either need to select all four of them or select Cruden, Carter and Slade imo. They can probably get away with taking 4 of them... but there's still guys like Kahui and others to come back so that will change things around a bit in the squad make up.

But anyway. Ill bet a dollar to a donut one of these guys atleast is going to get injured before then and for mine its actually more likely to be Cruden or Carter.

So I suspect like it or not we are going to see more of Slade before the WC.

He's pretty clearly not. Like it or not he's currently 4th in the AB's pecking order. In case you forgot he wasn't even selected on this tour originally - a couple of solid bench appearances isn't going to change that. I have got some time for Slade. I was suggesting he should have been Carter's back-up 5 years ago, but he missed the best part of 2-3 years of rugby with a succession of freak injuries. He's starting to look back to his best now - and importantly he is kicking his goals - but he is still clearly behind Carter, Cruden, and Barrett. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he was involved in the RWC, as I'm far from convinced that Carter will be fit for the whole tournament.

There is no chance at all the AB's selectors will take four 10's in their initial squad. Three 10's is a luxury - it is one more than they took last time - and the only reason they may be able to take this many is due to the versatility of these players. Kahui isn't coming back, but there will still be a number of player involved in the current squad that won't make the cut - they will not be able to fit Nonu, Bill-Williams, Crotty, Fekitoa, Conrad Smith, Savea, Gear, Piutau, Jane, Ben Smith and Dagg into 8 spots...

Nope, I'm pretty sure Ranger was from the Wellington region, but perhaps NickNZ could confirm that ... I never got the vibe that, he was particularly biased against players from outside of his region, well, no more so than anyone else :)

... I always thought he had a pretty good knowledge of some of the up and coming players to watch for, coming out of the NZ academies etc.

... To be fair on his comments on Slade, he (Slade), did look like a deer trapped in the headlights a bit, a few years ago ... I had doubts, and I'm from the Crusaders region.

Anyway, I've survived the potential heart attacks listening to this match on the radio, I'm very much looking forward to seeing it some time soon.

The goal kicking stuff, well see where we are at in Seven months time ... All of that can be fixed over the super season.
@Darwin ... Yes, we'll identified, outside backs need to be able to field the high ball on attack and defense, and a fullback who can kick/clear the ball a great distance, is definitely an asset ... Ben Smith's ability to do this, puts him in the top two fullbacks playing for the All Blacks, along with Dagg .. Which is great, because we need two :p

There is this other attribute that international fullbacks should have. Rhymes with jackel I think? :p I'm more than happy to see Dagg hanging around the squad - he can carry Ben's bags to the match if he likes (and perhaps play against heavyweights like USA) - I just don't want him starting in the AB's 15 jersey in major matches (unless Ben Smith is injured).
 
^^^ yeah but you reckoned Taylor was a better first five than Slade earlier in the year!

Hansen's going to have a few tough decisions to make next year but honestly I reckon one thing you are right on is one of them is probably going to be out of his hands an he probably wont get to select Carter anyway.
 
^^^ yeah but you reckoned Taylor was a better first five than Slade earlier in the year!

Hansen's going to have a few tough decisions to make next year but honestly I reckon one thing you are right on is one of them is probably going to be out of his hands an he probably wont get to select Carter anyway.

No I didn't. I said that Taylor was probably slightly ahead of Slade in the AB's pecking order at the time (near the start of the Super Rugby season), which I have no doubt is correct. Slade then had a good Super Rugby season, while Taylor had a relatively poor season, so of course those positions were reversed. My personal preference (as I stated numerous times throughout the season) was to have Slade at 10 and Taylor at 12 (as I think Taylor's best position is 12).
 
A positive for Barrett, I think would rather have him at fullback than dagg at the moment which work with him coming off the bench

I'd agree with this at the moment, Barrett looks better on attack than Dagg and show some class on the wing which Dagg didn't when he played there, gives a 2nd kicking option and solid D

I didn't think Kahui was coming back ... Who for and when?

Congrats on the game Wales, you had me a bit worried for most of the match ... The pool of death will. Be an interesting and entertaining watch at the RWC

Kahui signed to stay in Japan for another year, can hardly blame him, from what I hear he has had less injuries and making twice the money.

The AB's are in a nice position at the moment with so much talent and not enough spots

Backs I see based on this year

A Smith
TJP

Cruden

C Smith

Piutau
Savea
B Smith

Guys below are utilities that can cover a few spots so would be the next cabs of the rank in their positions.

Barrett
Slade
Fekitoa
SBW

3 spots left if they take 14 backs, need another halfback so 2 spots left and a few names to fill it

Carter, Nonu, Crotty, Dagg, Gear
 
Its amazing how mentally fragile this welsh team is... They are turgid. Never looked like winning..

Always next year... and the year after that.. and after that. Lol
 
So apparently the All Blacks looked rattled in the last 15 minutes:

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/...sen-rejects-Gatlands-claim-All-Blacks-rattled

I wouldn't say we were rattled. And I wouldn't describe the 15 minutes that way. It was a close, physical contest for most of the match. If Gatland thinks thats new for us then he must be having a slow day. But I suspect he's just stirring. Kind of an odd way to do it, haha. Good luck making the Quarters, Gats. Whether you can or not in your pool, I have my reservations.
 
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Yea.. the welsh had them really rattled.. thats why they let in 5 tries.
 
I'd agree with this at the moment, Barrett looks better on attack than Dagg and show some class on the wing which Dagg didn't when he played there, gives a 2nd kicking option and solid D



Kahui signed to stay in Japan for another year, can hardly blame him, from what I hear he has had less injuries and making twice the money.

The AB's are in a nice position at the moment with so much talent and not enough spots

Backs I see based on this year

A Smith
TJP

Cruden

C Smith

Piutau
Savea
B Smith

Guys below are utilities that can cover a few spots so would be the next cabs of the rank in their positions.

Barrett
Slade
Fekitoa
SBW

3 spots left if they take 14 backs, need another halfback so 2 spots left and a few names to fill it

Carter, Nonu, Crotty, Dagg, Gear

true, if Barrett can get some time at FB could be this for WC
Smith, Andy Ellis, TJP
Carter, Cruden
Nonu, SBW
Conrad, Crotty
Savea, Piatua, Jane
Ben Smith, (Slade, Barrett, Dagg)
wow its not until you write it down that you realise the talent that will miss out.
cheers
 
Which forum have you been laughed out of this week?


And what exactly has that got to do with the welsh losing once again to the ABs?

No need to try and go personal. Wales rugby team stinks. No need for you to try and attack me.
 
I watched Coles' debut match for the Canes at the cake tin some years back. I happened to be sitting in front of his grandparents. They were the nicest people, and so proud of their grandson. He played very well that day, scored a try right in front of us and I thought, this kid is special. Went to the pub that night with a mate who was in the Canes squad that year, the same pub than many of the Canes were at. I was introduced to Coles and found him to be an arrogant prat. A few months later I was not surprised at all when he got in trouble in Porirua for being drunk and disorderly.

Point of this story? I agree with you to an extent. I've been a harsh critic of Coles ever since I met him, but his on field play has impressed me to no end over time. He is integral to this AB team now, he is by far the best hooker in NZ if you take all things into account. Kevy is fantastic, but his minutes have to be limited, and that relegates him to time of the bench and the odd start - not enough to replace Coles. The rest of the Hookers in NZ are not even close. So, Coles must learn to chill the f u ck out - that's where I agree with you. I think he has a tendency to be a bit of a di ck. I;m surprised that hasn't been drilled out of him yet by the senior ABs. He has been around a while now, the AB culture should have sunk in, he needs to figure that s h it out quick smart so he doesn't bugger up our WC chances.


Now, I used to work with Mike Turner who was the Ponsonby hooker in the 80's. Reckoned Sean Fitzpatrick was an absolute pr*ck. Seemed to be a widely held view at that time. However, he came good, and didn't do too bad. Let's hope Coles sees his arse soon enough, and can carry on to be a decent hooker for the AB's. Certainly seems to have the skills required.
 
Its honestly pathetic but iv kinda come to expect this kind of stuff from a few people around here!

Its always pretty telling when people start resorting to calling you out on grammar errors or spelling mistakes. I type fast and I couldnt give a toss about any of this stuff im sure im getting my point across and thats all that matters.

It may not matter to you but it does matter to others. Why not at least have the RESPECT to make just the tiniest bit of effort to get it right for those it does matter to. If someone made the effort to point out an error in my grammar, I'd just be thankful for the opportunity to learn; I would not get all defensive like you're doing!

Bad grammar and bad spelling can cause a complete change of meaning, and can result in an insult or rudeness being delivered where none was intended..... go help your uncle jack off his horse!

Its bad enough that the written form on a forum like this doesn't convey "tone" without potentially adding to it.
 
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It may not matter to you but it does matter to others. Why not at least have the RESPECT to make just the tiniest bit of effort to get it right for those it does matter to. If someone made the effort to point out an error in my grammar, I'd just be thankful for the opportunity to learn; I would not get all defensive like you're doing!

Bad grammar and bad spelling can cause a complete change of meaning, and can result in an insult or rudeness being delivered where none was intended..... go help your uncle jack off his horse!

Its bad enough that the written form on a forum like this doesn't convey "tone" without potentially adding to it.

Was going to say "well said" but it is written but you know what I mean!!
 
Right, well after pulling an all nighter to watch this game, and then enjoying the rest of my Sunday I've had plenty of time to reflect.

For me the big difference between the teams were the substitutions. I think this was epitomized by both teams halfbacks. When TJ Peranara came on he had a very strong game (considering his recent form), slotted in very well and kept the tempo high. When Mike Phillips came on to replace Rhys Webb (for what reason I have no clue as he was probably Wales best player on the night IMHO), then Wales tempo slowed right down, delivery and decision making became very labored and of course lead to Kieran Read's charge down which probably sealed the game.

Similarly one of the things Wales did best in that first half was their line speed on defense, really putting a lot of pressure on Barrett. One of the players who was behind this IMO was firstly Warburton, but secondly Lydiate and Hibbard. Both of those two players were replaced in the 60th minute after strong games in defense, to be replaced by Baldwin and Tipuric. Now between in the twenty minutes they were on they are credited with only two tackles between them (all to Baldwin..). Considering the amount of pressure they were causing on defense, and Wales not really looking like they were getting too much going in attack - I don't understand why Gatland made any of those changes.

The entire All Blacks bench had a solid game - barring perhaps the props which didn't make a whole lot of impact. Mealamu came on looking like he was 10 years younger, made a brilliaint first up hit on a retreating player and was constantly involved. Patrick Tuipolutu again made thunderous hits when he came on, particularly a great one on Faletau. I'm not a Liam Messam fan really, but I couldn't fault him at all during his time in the game, he did some nice hit ups from the kick off (it seems the ABs are using the blindsides a lot this way). Like I mention Peranara looked very composed. Slade offered solid kicking and the combination of Barrett at fullback and Slade at 10 was largely what I credit to such a blow out at the end. Barrett slotted brilliantly into first receiver and he is so elusive with a bit of time on his hands. I'd go as far to say that the option of using Barrett as a regular fullback is actually pretty damn appealing to me. Crotty came on with little time and didn't get much of a chance to do much, but he didn't make any errors.

The starting players for the All Blacks were generally good. Our starting front row pretty clearly had the better of the scrums (although I'm still not at all convinced with Faumuina's scrummaging). Owen Franks was a bit of a monster in the scrums, while I thought Wyatt Crockett was very handy for us in defense. Dane Coles needs to calm the ***** down a bit, but otherwise wasn't bad. Our lineout finally started to look much better (I think Kaino is a bit underrated as a lineout jumper). Our loose forwards were busy and made plenty of tackles, however I thought were still occasionally a bit passive at contesting (and some of the times McCaw did contests were pretty obviously never going to be anything other than a penalty).

For our backs, there is no doubt Barrett was put under a lot of pressure in the first half, largely due to the great Welsh line speed, while it looked like the Blacks were playing a bit flat to the line and pushing far too many passes in that first half. Sonny Bill Williams I thought was particularly guilty of losing the ball in contact by trying to push opportunities. In the first half the outside backs didn't get too much to work with and I felt ended up resorting to running into traffic a bit too much. Conrad Smith I thought had a very good game, doing a lot of subtle things really well. His defense was pretty heroic at times, containing a very big Welsh midfield. I'm not sure if his pass to Savea was intentional or a happy product of getting hit very hard, but not a bad effort at all.

For Wales - they had some real trouble in the set pieces, but there were some outstanding performances I thought. Hibbard in particular I felt had a very strong game. Rhys Webb was another who just brought a lot of speed and accuracy to the Welsh backline, there was quite a bit of anxiety about him prior to this test, but I think he totally vindicated his selection (even though I have a sneaky suspicion Toby Faletau's offlaod was forward :p). Other than getting run over by Savea, Dan Biggar had a very good game I thought, and seemed detirmined to not miss a tackle on Savea again after that. His kicking was accurate and ambitious while I thought he run the back line quite nicely and put the ABs back three under a lot of pressure with his bombs. Some how Roberts got the man of the match, which was a bit surprising to me. He did what he does pretty well, he ran very hard at the midfield and took quite a bit of stopping (I think he got the better of SBW a few times), but I also think he stifled Wales attack somewhat. There was one opportunity where Wales had space to counter, he was near the right wing, men outside him, and he looks to diagonally run infield to hit the defenders..). I think Wales could have freed up a lot more space for their wingers if they were a little less determined to go through the middle.
 
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He was indeed Rad :) Personally I would have gone for Retallick, but Read too had a good game. I thought the Welsh halfback was pretty sharp too.




He's pretty clearly not. Like it or not he's currently 4th in the AB's pecking order. In case you forgot he wasn't even selected on this tour originally - a couple of solid bench appearances isn't going to change that. I have got some time for Slade. I was suggesting he should have been Carter's back-up 5 years ago, but he missed the best part of 2-3 years of rugby with a succession of freak injuries. He's starting to look back to his best now - and importantly he is kicking his goals - but he is still clearly behind Carter, Cruden, and Barrett. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he was involved in the RWC, as I'm far from convinced that Carter will be fit for the whole tournament.

There is no chance at all the AB's selectors will take four 10's in their initial squad. Three 10's is a luxury - it is one more than they took last time - and the only reason they may be able to take this many is due to the versatility of these players. Kahui isn't coming back, but there will still be a number of player involved in the current squad that won't make the cut - they will not be able to fit Nonu, Bill-Williams, Crotty, Fekitoa, Conrad Smith, Savea, Gear, Piutau, Jane, Ben Smith and Dagg into 8 spots...



There is this other attribute that international fullbacks should have. Rhymes with jackel I think? :p I'm more than happy to see Dagg hanging around the squad - he can carry Ben's bags to the match if he likes (and perhaps play against heavyweights like USA) - I just don't want him starting in the AB's 15 jersey in major matches (unless Ben Smith is injured).

Yeah, we'll Darwin, it's not like it's the 1980's or something the Dagg V Smith thing is not like the Deans V Hewson thing, where the work load of the All Blacks didn't require more than one fullback for test matches. One fresh Dagg is better than One fatigued Smith, and vice versa. I know that you and others here have a serious man crush on Smith, but please remember, form is a fickle thing.

There is room for both of them ... In fact, both will be needed in major matches IMO
 

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