We Need to talk about Worcester

[Bada-Bing!]

Does that stop the owners asset stripping?

Yes, for now. Basically an Administrator is appointed comes in to run the club instead of the Directors. Stops all creditors from enforcing their debts, including HMRC for a set "administration" period (know as a Moratorium) agreed to see if they can save it as a going concern and realise cash to pay the debts.

If administrator can't save the company running the club after a set period (can be 12m or longer) then that's when you get to the whole "insolvent winding up" and liquidation; meaning sell off assets to highest bidder to pay debts. Creditors get paid in a set order.

 

[Geordie]

Cheers Badabing.

 

[Which Tyler]

What are the actual legalities of reversing previous, recent asset stripping?

 

[Bada-Bing!]

What are the actual legalities of reversing previous, recent asset stripping?

Yes, I am sure the Administrator will have powers to reverse certain transactions in previous two years such as a director shareholder getting an asset at below market value. @Lé Ddanno is more qualified to post on this as I recall that is what he does for a living.

 

[BPM]

Mark Evans summing it up very well: https://www.rugbypass.com/news/this-is-far-far-worse-and-far-more-serious/

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Rfu are a dinosaur joke and Premiership rugby just don't care (or don't have the competence to check these things).

Such a shame for rugby.

 

[Which Tyler]

Not sure how RFU get any blame here - care to explain?

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

IDK what Mark Evans is expecting.
Everything he is saying is in hindsight.

The Owner got banned in July 2022, does he think the RFU could've done anything really between then and now?
"In the next few years they burnt through the CVC money, torched the taxpayers money from DCMS, created multiple companies to move assets around, paid themselves handsome salaries and to top it all borrowed money from an elderly Cecil Duckworth."

The RFU are not Duckworth's personal lawyers, I see no relevance in the borrowed money being of either the RFU concern.
It's also becomes at what point is the RFU allowed to step in and how much control can they have in it?

Like in reality what is a independent inquiry and releasing it in full going to bring up that isn't already obvious.

If the owners where that shoddy from the start why did Duckworth sell to them?

The Prem clubs owners made a call a long time ago to not have any central oversight in all regards to how to run individual clubs how about blaming them...

 

[RedruthRFC]

IDK what Mark Evans is expecting.
Everything he is saying is in hindsight.

The Owner got banned in July 2022, does he think the RFU or PRL could've done anything really between then and now?
"In the next few years they burnt through the CVC money, torched the taxpayers money from DCMS, created multiple companies to move assets around, paid themselves handsome salaries and to top it all borrowed money from an elderly Cecil Duckworth."

The PRL and RFU are not Duckworth's personal lawyers, I see no relevance in the borrowed money being of either the RFU and PRL concern.
It's also becomes at what point is the PRL or RFU allowed to step in and how much control can they have in it?

Like in reality what is a independent inquiry and releasing it in full going to bring up that isn't already obvious.

If the owners where that shoddy from the start why did Duckworth sell to them?

The Prem clubs owners made a call a long time ago to not have any central oversight in all regards to how to run individual clubs how about blaming them...

Quite agree about Evans. I see him as a bit of a pound shop SCW, throwing out controversial opinions in a desperate attempt to remain relevant.

I know very little about how to perform duedil, but I'd have thought that a company failing to service their debts is a decent indicator of poor governance.

Completely agree re: Duckworth. It doesn't make sense for someone who had done so much for the club and clearly loved it so much to fail to perform his own duedil and in failing to do so, sewing the seeds of the current mess. If you're playing the blame game, I would trace it back to whenever the members of the club chose to give their club away in exchange for a shot at the big time.

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

Worcester’s administrators urged to act fast to rescue Premiership season

Two more weeks without pay means Worcester’s players can serve notice while the potential buyer Jim O’Toole said he is ready with four years’ money

www.theguardian.com

17.5 in funding from group led by o'toole conditioned on asset stripping being reversed. Would like there to be some research on who that group is.

 

[Which Tyler]

Worcester’s administrators urged to act fast to rescue Premiership season

Two more weeks without pay means Worcester’s players can serve notice while the potential buyer Jim O’Toole said he is ready with four years’ money

www.theguardian.com

17.5 in funding from group led by o'toole conditioned on asset stripping being reversed. Would like there to be some research on who that group is.

Best I've seen is "American backers" - which makes me suspicious (unlikely to be rugby people) - but pretty much anything is better than the status quo.
And yes, I know that "pretty much" is doing a lot of heavy lifting there.

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

I'm 50/50 on it. I think at this point VC should be reasonably afraid of the premiership but those people often think they are smarter than the person before them. I hope it's just some rich dudes who played rugby in undergrad and played some club rugby into their 30s.

 

[Lé Ddanno]

Yes, I am sure the Administrator will have powers to reverse certain transactions in previous two years such as a director shareholder getting an asset at below market value. @Lé Ddanno is more qualified to post on this as I recall that is what he does for a living.

This sums it up really. Any transaction has to be for fair value or it can be overturned and the Director(s) held in breach of their fiduciary duties (and liable to pay the difference).

It's a contestable legal process so it's not something that happens overnight unless the directors 'fess up and settle quickly.

 

[The Seeker]

Of course there isn't one - PRL have absolutely no interest in growing the game - they've decided that would be a negative for their bottom line.
They'd rather have the larger slice of the smaller pie, not the smaller slice of a larger pie - because they're short-sighted, selfish idiots.



Yes, which is why it's only been realistically viable as a joined-up-thinking approach alongside the Championship - against whom PRL have been at war for at least 15 years.
IIRC One of my first posts on this board was suggesting exactly this.

Of course, if 3 clubs are looking at going bust, then it becomes a different matter.

You mentioned three clubs (Worcester being one), but what are the other two?

 

[TRF_Olyy]

You mentioned three clubs (Worcester being one), but what are the other two?

Newcastle had some serious struggles last season

 

[The Seeker]

Newcastle had some serious struggles last season

Thank you.

 

[Which Tyler]

Wasps have called the administrators in as well.

Whoever it is, 3 is the number that's been bandied about in the press.

 

[Crash Hamster]

News | Gloucester Rugby

The official website of Gloucester Rugby with the latest news, fixture, ticket and merchandise information.

www.gloucesterrugby.co.uk

Excellent communication from Gloucester.

 

[pagliaccio_euforico]

a way future for rugby?

Revealed: Football League clubs taking cut of gamblers’ losses with SkyBet

EFL clubs have been taking cut of money fans lose with bookmaker, prompting accusations that they are exploiting gambling addicts

www.theguardian.com

 

[The Seeker]

Wasps have called the administrators in as well.

Whoever it is, 3 is the number that's been bandied about in the press.

Thank you.