Not really sure how you can think this response is actually good tbh.
Number 1 even if everyone knows that playerpool is **** surely the coach who is meant to be instilling confidence shouldnt be saying it, he is part of that lack of a winning enviroment, he is coaching it. You can think something, and not openly degrade those you are trying to inspire.
Number 2, somewhat linked to number 1, there is acomplete void in self awareness, he bombed out of the chiefs, has been ******** the bed and hasnt coached sustainable winning rugby for going on 6 years at this point, when you are consisstently not good at your job, or are atleast not getting results it is maybe at that point you need feedback into what you are doing wrong, you refer to townsend and coaches as an appeal to authority as if they are infalable, just not true, one of townsends biggest strengths has actually been in resolving issues he has had with players not dictating to them that they are god awful and are a bunch of losers who can offer him nothing.
In gatlands case if anything he is a man in desperate need of a self review as his methods no longer work, not with the lions, not with the chiefs who drastically improved with the same player pool after he left, and sure as hell not with wales now. We can refer to townsend here again, since november what have both coaches been doing, what has their output been? Townsend has been coaching scotlands development system and the emerging scotland team to improve the player pool, talking about how exciting these players are for the future.... Gatland has complained about his player pool said they dont know how to win and that they shouldnt be reviewing him a man who has done a whole lot of losing for half a decade, maybe he could take on board and try and improve? Maybe he could improve his coaching team? Hell maybe he could actually get of his arse and go and do some clinics or coaching age grade players like townsend has been to try and help solve the problem long term
Currently Gatland is a old man, who cant communicate with young players, who doesnt get results, and does nothign for the nations rugby between windows despite taking a huge pay packet to improve rugby in the country. It could literally not get worse. If it was gatland of a decade ago saying it? I would get it, but now? He is just as big a loser, wins that long ago mean nothing after sustained losing.
I always find it interesting how people judge Gatlands time at the cheifs, without considering anything that happened at his time at the chiefs, what players, back room staff, and head honchos at the chiefs say, or the conditions of his tenure, and the preceding time after he left for the lions...
1. He won 4 from 5 games i think his record was before Covid shut the game down. After covid he went on that 8 game losing, against 100% kiwi sides and losing narrowly 5/6 times. It was widely acknowledged at the time the chiefs had a weak squad, specifically the tight 5.
Gatland Debut'd a lot of players, I think maybe 8 or 9 that season, all butn1 have returned and got better the next season.
Ironically 2021 Gatland jr joind Chiefs and did well at 10, helping theb10 issues Trask and Cruden non Cruden had caused.
2. Gatland presided over a virtually all derby season, Mcmillon won 4 of his games against really poor Aus sides.
In fact Mcmillons record v Kiwi teams was 5 and 5.
3. Players, coaching staff, board and fans all praised Gatlands work and credited him for laying foundations behind the scene. Gatland had 3 international players in that Chiefs squad, that double to 6 by 2021, and Gatland was given credit for the player development and squad depth that markedly increased that season.
In fact I think it was Graafhuis who made a statement and likened Gatlands season to the famously failure season of Graham Henry with Wales 2004.
So just to confirm, I'm agreeing Gatland should probably leave, it's time to move up or move on, and I agree he may isn't infalable, however what I am saying is you nor I have no idea what's going on behind the scenes, and most criticism of Gatland is stupidity.
His words are harsh but exactly what everyone is saying, our development pathway has left us with the weakest welsh squad certainly in the last 20 odd years, maybe even further and rivals the dross of the 90s.
You don't heal wounds by popping making up on them and telling them they look pretty, you cut dead flesh away. If now isnt the time for tough talk and hard truths I don't know when is.
To truly judge Gatland we have to consider what he reinserted, what he's done from a results position, but also a player development standing, and what the conditions are he's endured.
Results have been poor, but I don't think any other coach in world rugby could have done any better, with the over the hill squad inherited, and lack of deloped Jr's behind them.
Since his first game of 2023 4 of the starting pack retired soon after, 1 has been injured since. Come 31st Jan, the welsh pack will be half the age, it was in 2023, and be unrecognisable from 2 years ago, with maybe Gareth Thomas the only regular. Which other int team has 7 new forwards starters and is successful? Similarly 5 of the backline from 2023 have retired, 1 has been injured extensively. Tomos William's might be the only survivor (maybe Liam Williams too).
Think of the players who have been forced to start last season, in replacement of what we all agree have been legends of the game...
Evan Lloyd > Ken owens
Daf Jenkins > AWJ
Alex Mann > Wainright
Costelow > Biggar
Murray > North
Winnet > William's
How does any coach win games, when replacing genuine world class talent with kids who have barely played, let alone won a game of pro rugby 2-3 years later?
If you even compare man for man us vs Italy last season, they are easily the better team, I'd argue that maybe Gareth Thomas, Wainright and Tomos William's get into the Ital lineup, every other position they have us dead to rights.
He's also had to endure the WRU and it's never ending cycle of nonsense, player pay row, women's pay row, players threatening to strike, a sexism row, appointing non rugby head amongst a sexism row because she's a woman and fits some criteria, the TWC proved difficult on coach agenda (Ask Borthwick), the region debacle, the financial issues etc... he's only been here 2 years and dealt with maybe 4 major issues outside of his control, before we mention player drain, and difficulties with young players being lost to english educational opportunities, or larger contracts Wabo, Hawkins, LRZ...
So the question is, is Gatland losing games, but building a foundation and player base to compete in the future, like he did previously with us, and how he did at Chiefs?
The average age is lower obviously, and without some selections like smith, Willgriff, Parry, Falatau, William's, Rhodri, Adams and Rowlands who realistically all could have not been selected, the squad is rebuilding and giving experience to younger players.
A few players have kicked on in the last 2 years, but realistically, the young players coming through don't seem to have high ceilings, and Gatland is forced to pick clubman, and younger players hoping they have something more.
Winnet and Evan Lloyd are great examples of a desperate coach selecting young players because there is nothing else to select. Lloyds selection over Belcher says it all.
So in 2023 I gave Gatland a B, he built to what could have been an Aus level disaster RWC, losing key players in the summer etc, and managed a quarter final thrown away by Costelows introduction to the game.
2024 I gave Gatland a C+. Difficult rebuild, lots of young players, lots of off field stupidity.
I think winning 1 game this 6N is a step in the right direction, we need to see a few players kick on, Assirati needs to prove he can play at int level, Morgan and Jenkins need to kick on and lead, Tomos needs to become a leader also, we need to establish a long term regular back 3 combo, find a TH and 10 from anywhere, and finally replace Jon Davies at 13.
If we head towards all those things, this season will be a huge success, with or without the win.
At this stage, I'd just like to see us impose a game plan on opposition, and execute the basics, which is a real frustration of mine with welsh rugby in general. The amount of set peice ball all regions and Wales fluff is maddening!
So ye, Gats isn't doing a bad job, it's just most people don't understand what his job is currently, it should be winning games, but it can't be when you don't have the ability to compete, and you are having to select kids with a small number of pro appearances, Gatlands rebuild is deeper than any tier 1 nation I've ever seen, he's almost having to coach skills that most nations have installed by u20s.
www.bbc.com
