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USA v England - 19/07/25

TRF_Olyy said:
Doubt it's fitness, he came back from injury in March
He wasn't included in the original squad so probably just behind Davison in the pecking order
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Very true, but (without wanting to throw out caps willy nilly), i just think its a waste of an opportunity to give some match time to a young lad with massive potential over a guy who isnt going to be in the squad for a whole lot of time to come.
 
Geordie said:
Very true, but (without wanting to throw out caps willy nilly), i just think its a waste of an opportunity to give some match time to a young lad with massive potential over a guy who isnt going to be in the squad for a whole lot of time to come.
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I think you’re overestimating the effect that 20 minutes off the bench against USA would have on Fasogbon’s development. It’s pretty inconsequential. Him getting on tour and spending time with the squad was the main thing.
 
Pieter Steph du Teague said:
I think you're overestimating the effect that 20 minutes off the bench against USA would have on Fasogbon's development. It's pretty inconsequential. Him getting on tour and spending time with the squad was the main thing.
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No im not actually overestimating it, its 20 mins against USA. I get that, but in the same breath why not give that 20 mins to a young lad with a massive future over a guy whos probably unlikely to even be in the squad again.
 
Because they've seen them all season and all training sessions and decided Davison is better?
It's not like Fasogbon was consistently great for Gloucester, he was getting handled once sides knew not to underestimate him and knew that his technique wasn't there yet, but that didn't make the highlight reels (they loved to show him waving Genge off the pitch, but not him getting folded into a pretzel by Woolmore the rest of the match)

He's like 19? 20? No need to rush him just cause he's massive

I'm happy getting minutes into Davison, not like we have mega depth at tighthead and getting more time into a more seasoned operator is always useful - it's an attritional position, and Stuart is gonna have a ton of stand down after the Lions. Say Heyes does a hamstring in his first game back for Tigers then we've got only teenagers in reserve
 
TRF_Olyy said:
Because they've seen them all season and all training sessions and decided Davison is better?
It's not like Fasogbon was consistently great for Gloucester, he was getting handled once sides knew not to underestimate him and knew that his technique wasn't there yet, but that didn't make the highlight reels (they loved to show him waving Genge off the pitch, but not him getting folded into a pretzel by Woolmore the rest of the match)

He's like 19? 20? No need to rush him just cause he's massive

I'm happy getting minutes into Davison, not like we have mega depth at tighthead and getting more time into a more seasoned operator is always useful - it's an attritional position, and Stuart is gonna have a ton of stand down after the Lions. Say Heyes does a hamstring in his first game back for Tigers then we've got only teenagers in reserve
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Yep. Experience is a massive thing for front rowers. We’ve seen it with both Stuart and Heyes who are unrecognisable from 2 or 3 years ago.

Solid international props at 20, 21 are hen’s teeth.

Fasogbon and AOF are exciting talents for sure. AOF might be a little further down the road but they’re still really basically 90% potential.

At LH Baxter was also quite young, but mainly through necessity and he definitely got his backside presented to him on a plate a couple of times by the big boys. Also lucky to have a mentor of Marler’s calibre to learn from.
 
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Vieux Talonneur said:
Yep. Experience is a massive thing for front rowers. We've seen it with both Stuart and Heyes who are unrecognisable from 2 or 3 years ago.

Solid international props at 20, 21 are hen's teeth.

Fasogbon and AOF are exciting talents for sure. AOF might be a little further down the road but they're still really basically 90% potential.

At LH Baxter was also quite young, but mainly through necessity and he definitely got his backside presented to him on a plate a couple of times by the big boys. Also lucky to have a mentor of Marler's calibre to learn from.
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100% our problem was hat we had a gap from the Cole era to Stuart and Heyes. The props that might have been expected to fill that gap never really made the grade - Paul Hill probably being the most notable example.

It would be useful if some of the tightheads in the 22-24 age group kick on in the next couple of seasons to help bridge the gap between the current crop and the U20s (AOF, Fasogbon and Sela). Will Hobson is apparently very highly rated at Quins but hasn’t had the game time to show for it. Could be one to watch out for? Could the move to Saracens be the making of Marcus Street?
 
The problem was Sinckler moving from Quins
IDK Sinckler was the perfect player to take over from Cole but it just didn't click mentally (Maybe too much pressure)
Still he's only 32 and apparently the time away from England is helping his form. I can see him coming back for a final go in the next RWC.
 
I'm yet to see what the hype is about re Fasogbon . Saw a fair bit of him and barring 3-4 nice scrums he is miles behind a ton of THs.
Yes he is very big but so are loads of props. Doesn't mean they can scrum.
 
LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan) said:
What's been up with Harper of late @TRF_Olyy ? Looked really promising prior to this season
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Just dropped off a cliff after his latest injury
Don't know if it's mental or his body failing him - he's really looked the business at times, especially when given a run of games, but last season was as poor as I've seen him

Hopefully a full off/pre season, not taken up by injury and physio, has him going into next season looking like the player he's shown he can be
 

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