The new Super 15 format is kind of bullshit..

[ranger]

The main problem is nearly all leagues i've ever heard of have an even number of teams. 15 is just bizarre to say the least. It distorts and makes all kinds of issues for a competition. When you think one idea is good, it will disadvantage in a different way.

My suggestion is (if you are listening SupeRugby chiefs ) you could have the 3 national conferences of 5 teams, where the teams play home and away games against just their group opponents.. that makes an equal amount of home and away games. Totalling 8 purely domestic games. Then, the top team in each group will qualify for the 3-team round-robin, like the tri-nations, but they'd play home and away. So that's another 4 games. The winner of that group final, is SupeRugby champion. As each team would play the other home and away, there is no home/away draw advantage.

As for the 2nd-5th place teams in each conference, the final format is repeated for each all the 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th placed teams. So essentially, every team will play 12 games, and it will determine actual placings from 1 to 15.

So, an individual team would have 8 games in each group, then it can be totally fair that the best regional teams win. No easy games against 'weak' franchises as such. It would also give much better travel costs, fans would prefer more local derbies.. ok, so you don't get all the cross-conference games so much, but really the distances are so far in these 3 nations, that away travel is nigh on impossible.. but no matter what team you support, you will.. after the 'regular season' play what would really be hopefully an equal performing team from the other 2 sanzar nations, home and away.

They could use the idea that Seven's has, which is to give a trophy for each tier, so every team will have something to play for (Plate, Shield).. and it will be realistic for what they've actually achieved in the regular season.



The winner of the Super15 could then play the Heineken Cup winner at some point, and we'd have a world champion too.

No thanks. Thats just the ITM cup/ Currie Cup with 4 games tacked on. The ITM cup is now down to seven NZ teams playing each other, then the Super 14 would be 5 NZ teams playing each other. Thats pretty much the same competition with different uniforms and more expensive tickets. The dwindling Trination attendances is proof that more of the same is the wrong way to go.

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

Agree with ranger. We already have the Currie Cup and ITM Cup

 

[Kiwiwomble]

and the idea of qualifying for super comp on the back of the ITM cup?

 

[Seaton]

You guys are being as fickle as Aberdeen fans, shooting down the new manager even
Though he hasn't been announced yet

There is no point in even considering a new format as the SARU is going to use the old
"It's my way or the highway" routine, with regards to the addition of a sixth franchise

And remember, South African broadcaster provides 65 percent of S14/15 TV sponsorship
So it is not as the NZRU or the Ozzies can say, "Well then, **** right off"

 

[Shaggy]

and the idea of qualifying for super comp on the back of the ITM cup?

I'm pretty sure that that's the way it was in NZ when the competition was the Super 10 (when Rugby was still Amateur)... it won't happen due to the amount of money already used in setting up the existing franchises, the loses incurred by relegated teams, and the disadvantage financially that promoted teams would incur ... plus the national unions want all of their top/contracted players actually playing.

As for the current format, I wouldn't expect it to remain the same as it will be in 2011 ... I expect that the comp will increase the number of teams (probably to accommodate Argentinian teams) ... a clue to this is that they are now calling it SupeRugby, not including the number of teams in the comp name anymore, so increased number of teams requires a change of format

 

[nickdnz]

I still like my idea, taken from the Heineken Cup.

Have the NPC, Curry Cup, Japan Pro League and (insert new Australian, Argentinian etc league), and give it a format like the H Cup. For example, six teams from the CC, NPC etc etc go into the competition which is mid way through the regular season, and they compete HC style. In terms of New Zealand, it would help us out, because we can put forward six competitive teams, and it helps out the game in developing places, while not ruining the domestic rugby of NZ or SA. It's pretty much a win-win, although it would take a while to get off the ground.

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

The whole idea of the Heineken Cup is quite nice but for that to happen the Australian Rugby Union should get off their asses first and start a domestic competition first.

 

[Shaggy]

I still like my idea, taken from the Heineken Cup.

Have the NPC, Curry Cup, Japan Pro League and (insert new Australian, Argentinian etc league), and give it a format like the H Cup. For example, six teams from the CC, NPC etc etc go into the competition which is mid way through the regular season, and they compete HC style. In terms of New Zealand, it would help us out, because we can put forward six competitive teams, and it helps out the game in developing places, while not ruining the domestic rugby of NZ or SA. It's pretty much a win-win, although it would take a while to get off the ground.

Sounds good, but I guess it really all seems to come down to money these days - If Heineken type comp profit + domestic comp profit = or > SupeRugby profit + domestic comp profit, then you've got a viable alternative competition

... I know that money isn't the only consideration, but the national unions do rely on these competitions to pay the players

 

[Faatau82]

You could copy the 7's format and have a group and knockout cup based in each of South Africa, Australia and New Zealand, in which you'd have 3 groups of 5 seeded (by nation) sanzar teams.
So like..

Crusaders
Reds
Stormers
Waratahs
Lions

Bulls
Western Force
Hurricanes
Chiefs
Rebels

Brumbies
Sharks
Blues
Cheetahs
Highlanders

After each stage, the seedings will be updated from the last stage, as you finish 1-5. Knockout doesn't count. The 3 group winners will be guaranteed a top group seed for the next stage.. and so forth for each positions after. That is fair to all teams.

The two best ranked teams via competition points (progression in knockout rounds, of course) will play in a Grand Final, in a designated/randomly drawn nation that is neutral to both for fairness.

That's as about abstract as i can dream up.. the fixtures, i can't work out.. i'd need a while to account for all the byes! (again, stupid odd numbers logic)

 

[Seaton]

Or why don't we have 3 different groups, and to prevent too much travel
The groups can be regionalized

After which the group winners going into semis, joined by the winning team from a playoff between the
Two best runners-up

Sorted

 

[Feicarsinn]

Wouldn't it be best to give the current format a year or two before changing? Who knows, it might be fine.

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

Well, I would love to, but with Argentina joining SANZAR, you can only assume in 2012 there will be plans for Argentinian teams being added to the mix

 

[Dougydeluxe]

We can only assume.

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

sorry, wrong choice of words I mean "We only wait" (for that to happen)

 

[Faatau82]

Super16 would be nice, but the format would have to change again as 16 into 3 doesn't go.

 

[nickdnz]

Super 16 starts to sound a little redundant. I wish SANZAR chose a better name than Super Rugby.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

when was the Super 15 announced? I thought it was well over a year ago so I would say they would have to have announced and started working on any new format for 2012.

I would say it will be the same in 2012 and the Argies will only be in the Tri (quad?) nations, If I remember correctly they were "Invited" to join, Dont think that means they are now part of SANZAR (or a replacement Body) so dont have "Rights" to a Super Team...Yet

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

No, but it is the next logical step.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

of course the logical next step (and I'm all for it) but I think the travel problems (lets along setting up brand new teams) etc will mean it is a few more years off then 2012

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

Travelling distance? The distance from South Africa to New Zealand is the same as from South Africa to Argentina. Australia and New Zealand travel over the Pacific covering the same distance as well. Setting up a team might be something of a challenge but Argentina (maybe together with Uruguay) can set up at least 2 Super franchise teams to include in the competition. Maybe they can replace some of the teams who are playing for empty stadiums and don't perform anway (Lions, Highlanders)