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The Eastern Province Kings and Southern Kings thread

TRF_Ezequiel

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The Southern and EP Kings:

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The Southern Kings are a South African rugby union team that applied, but failed, to gain a place in Super Rugby from 2011 in a to-be-formed Australian conference in Super Rugby. They were formed in 2009 in time to coincide with the 2009 British and Irish Lions tour to South Africa. On November 12, 2009, SANZAR arbitrators rejected their bid to join Super Rugby, awarding the 15th licence to the Melbourne Rebels.
The franchise was formally announced at the opening of the Nelson Mandela Bay Stadium on June 16. The idea for the team was to develop rugby in the Eastern Cape but there were only two current Border Bulldogs in the team against the Lions. There were also worries that the team would remain a one game wonder and fold much like its predecessors, the Southern Spears

The Southern Kings franchise area would be made up of Eastern Cape, and parts of the Western Cape. They will draw players from 3 provincial unions, namely the Eastern Province Kings, based in Port Elizabeth, the Border Bulldogs, based in East London and the SWD Eagles, based in George. The SWD Eagles represent the South Western Districts of South Africa, in the Western Cape. The Eastern Province Kings represent the southern half of the Eastern Cape, while the Border Bulldogs represent the northern half of the Eastern Cape.

History:
The Southern Kings are the latest attempt to bring a Super Rugby side to the Eastern Cape Province of South Africa. Previously in 2005, there was an attempt to do so in the form of a franchise called the Southern Spears, who were intended to participate in the Super 14 from 2007 onwards; however, their proposed entry into the competition led to considerable controversy within the country's rugby establishment. In April 2006, after concerns over the franchise's financial stability and sporting competitiveness, the Spears were denied entry into the Super 14. Following this, the Southern Spears effectively ceased to exist.
In January 2009, the SARU announced that a new franchise in the Eastern Cape Province would be launched in June of that year to coincide with the arrival of the British and Irish Lions in Port Elizabeth for one of their midweek tour matches.[3] The franchise is to be launched with the goal of a future place in Super Rugby, but no timetable for its inclusion has been set. The President of the Eastern Province, Cheeky Watson, said "There is a desperate hunger for top-flight rugby in the South Eastern Cape and this is the first step to satisfying it,â€. The franchise was officially announced on the SARU website in April 2009

With Jaco Engels, Ronnie Uys, Monty Dumond, Tiger Mangweni, Barend Pieterse and De Wet Barry are some players who bring experience into the team and with news reaching the world that Luke Watson is moving there, it can't be long before the Provincial team promotes to the Premier Division.

Stadium:
The Eastern Province Kings play their matches in the Nelson Mandela Bay Stadium in Port Elizabeth.

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The Southern Kings will also be using this venue when they finally get into the Super Rugby competition.

For everyone who wants to talk in detail about this team and the future franchise, Go ahead!
 
Sounds interesting, don't know any of the players you mentioned but is there a need to have a sixth SA team in Super rugby?
 
Maybe not a sixth team but definitely Super Rugby in that area of the country. With the Lions only 100 km south of the Bulls, I wouldn't mind, seeing the Southern Kings replacing the Lions
 
But wouldn't this just mean to pass on the torch?
A side from discussing the Lions ( altho they do play attractive rugby this season) you also need to look at the financial status of that side.

If I'm not mistaken the Lions have a big budget but lose all their good players to other francises.
 
I think there is enough money, a good stadium (Nelson Mandela Bay Stadium) and a large fanbase (the Currie Cup play offs had 40.000 people watching in PE)
 
Sounds great, maybe in the near future they will join.
I wouldn't be to harsh for the Lions tho, the same was being sad about the Highlanders before the satrt of the season and they are on a roll.
 
If SA ran its franchises like NZ, I am sure all the sides would have little trouble in being competitive.
I know I've drawn up this list somewhere, but for the sake of it I'll do it again
It's where I feel SA's best players in positions are clumped together.

Front-rowers- Sharks
Locks- Bulls
Loosies- Sharks
Half-backs- Not really, however the Bulls have the 9s
Centers- Stormers
Back 3- Stormers/ Sharks

While money may not be everything, I think SA has the better hand of cards when dealing in SANZAR decisions, as Supersport provides just under 2 thirds of SupeRugby's income
 
I was thinking about this whole idea and what bugs me so much is that the players of Eastern Province, SWD Eagles and Border Bulldogs (the first 2 made it to the play offs for promotion to the Currie Cup Premier Division last year) have no franchise to play for. How cruel is that? Why don't they just add the EP and Border players to the Sharks franchise for now and the Eagles to the Stormers?
 
I was thinking about this whole idea and what bugs me so much is that the players of Eastern Province, SWD Eagles and Border Bulldogs (the first 2 made it to the play offs for promotion to the Currie Cup Premier Division last year) have no franchise to play for. How cruel is that? Why don't they just add the EP and Border players to the Sharks franchise for now and the Eagles to the Stormers?

To be honest, if the players were good enough to play Super Rugby, they wouldn't be at the Kings, Eagles or Bulldogs. That is the problem the Kings are faced with now - they need to attract players good enough to help them a) win promotion to the Currie Cup Premier Division and b) become a reasonably competitive Super Rugby franchise.

They are basically targeting two kinds of players - those that are willing to drop down a division in order to get more game time (or more money), and players that are from that region and want to join their local team.

For ages, rugby in the region was administered very badly, which is why all three teams are in the First Division. I read somewhere that there are more registered rugby players in the Eastern Cape region than in all of New Zealand.

So I would say that they DO need a representative Super Rugby team. But they will have to earn the right, not just get given it by kicking out another team (I think the Cheetahs are more at risk than the Lions, to be honest).

I also don't think Super Rugby has finished expanding. Argentina are joining the Tri-Nations from next year onwards, so they should really also get representation at Super Rugby level. During this expansion, a spot might open up for another South African team.
 
Isn't it an option to go back to the Cats (just merge the Cheetahs and Lions together) and give the Southern Kings the spot that opens up?
 
Good point, maybe in a couple of years they could replace the Bulls :)
 
Well, the Bulls already played in red shirts last weekend, so who knows ;)
 
Anyway, it's good to see the Kings keeping themselves busy in the meantime, they'll be playing in the IRB Nations Cup next month...

The Argentina Jaguars are also playing, I wonder how similar that team will be to the Pampas XV playing in the Vodacom Cup.
 

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