South Africa RWC 2011

[TRF_stormer2010]

With JJR and me posting possible line-ups in another thread (what you expect realistically from your country at the RWC 2011) I thought it woud be a good idea to get that discussion on another thread.




For me the question with SA and our RWC chances are to what extent do you trust the youngsters (its too late to integrate new blood at this stage) and to what extent do you trust your old warhorses to perform one last time.

In the tight five the top men for the job are set with the only question being who starts; Bismarck or Smit? Bekker or Matfield? Botha?Those who are assured a place include Bismarck du Plessis, brother Jannie, John Smit, Guthro Steenkamp (currently injured but on course), Tendai Mtawarira. The men who might make it; its probably between Adriaan Strauss and Chiliboy Ralepelle to back up at hooker. Personally I don't care as their involvement would be minimal bar tragedy. At prop we have seen CJ van der Linde and Coenie Oosthuizen at EYOT 2010 and S15 while Brian Mujati and BJ Botha are probably on PdV's radar. Personally I'd go for Mujati; Van der Linde has been a liability in the scrum and while Oosthuizen has been penalized heavily at scrum as well at least he brings a solid game otherwise even leading pilfers made in the S15. BJ Botha along with Heinke van der Merwe and Wian du Preez remain question marks playing overseas while no other props have erally stood out for any SA frnachize. The locks are covered between Matfield, Botha, Bekker, Rossouw and Van der Merwe. I'm glad that the combo of Bakkies and Matfield had a good game against the Sharks on the weekend. There might be some hpe yet.

At the backrow its a question of will the two Free State (Brussow and captain Juan Smith) men be fit and available? Apart from them Schalk Burger has had a consistently good season if not great. Pierre Spies has been a little more solid in defense but less effective on attack and getting front-foot ball which makes him less desirable IMO actually as others to the basics better. Apart from utility forward Rossouw who can cover the backrow (and is my preferd choice at 8) there is probably space for one more and while Alberts has made a big impact from the bench on the EOYT last year I can't help but feel that Vermeulen has been more consistent during the S15. If Spies could be out I'd take both along but that is probably not going to happen. Should we consider another specialist fetcher if, God forbid, Brussow is unavailable? FLouw is the likeliest but he hasn't functioned AT ALL in green and relies on others tackling for his pilfers unlike Brussow who hardly goes to ground while making a tackle.

The question of youth vs experience really comes to the fore in the halves department. Morne Steyn has really missed an in-form FdP on his inside and with the latter out injured for a short while again just as he was starting to regain form.. the other options are Ruan Pienaar at either 9 or 10, Francois Hougaard at 9 and then Butch James or a youngster in either Lambie or Jantjies at 10. Pienaar is an obvious choice for his ability to cover both position though he might not necessarily be the 2nd in either. While I'd back the encumbent Bulls combo with a bench of Hougaard, Pienaar and Lambie (more to cover 15 than 10) I am glad the decision isn't mine. Januarie was dropped to the bench for Hougaard last year with FdP unavailable and I feel PdV
has seen the light or at least I hope he has.

The centres are pretty easy to predict; the Stormers 3 has been in good shape though they might benefit from quicker ball. I don't know if it's worth taking another out-and-out centre in either Jacobs or Olivier with the utility we have in the backs. Probably not

Though Brian Habana is probably THE SA winger he is certainly not the form winger and this is one spot where I wouldn't back the incumbent. Bjorn Basson, Gio Aplon, JP Pietersen and Odwa Ndungane (for utility value) have been the form SA winger IMO.
Fullback is the one spot where I think SA lacks a world class player and where no-one has really settled; Kirschner and Jantjes just don't have enough. Frans Steyn remains a question mark and while he is probably one of our better prospects judging on his last performances in green and gold he was just too much off the pace and looked totally disinterested in playing. Aplon is not a test 15 IMO. Short of asking Percy to come back we have the youngsters; Ludik, Viljoen and Lambie. Lambie hasn't played at 15 since middle 2010, Ludik has had injuries and hasn't had the spark that he had last year. Riaan Viljoen is the dark horse IMO and I am praying that he gets the nod (though it would probably be seen a a gamble) to get some time in the 3N and takes his chances.

 

[ZeFrenchy]

Interesting topic, although I admit not being too informed about SA S15 teams. So, if I got you right, your 30 (or a combinations between what you would like and you expect) would be:

Props: Mtawarira, Steenkamp, Du Plessis, Mujati
Hookers: Du Plessis, Smit, Ralepelle/Strauss
Locks: Matfield, Botha, Bekker, VdMerwe
Backrow: Smith, Brussow, Roussow, Spies, Burger, Vermeulen

Halfbacks: Du Preez, Hougaard, Pienaar, Steyn, Lambie
Centres: De Villiers, Fourie, de Johng
Ouside backs: Basson, Aplon, Pietersen, Ndungane, Viljoen

I guess I don't have much to add... whi would you play at 2? Who to captain? (hoping that this thread won't become a thread about John Smit's form)

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Interesting topic, although I admit not being too informed about SA S15 teams. So, if I got you right, your 30 (or a combinations between what you would like and you expect) would be:

Props: Mtawarira, Steenkamp, Du Plessis, Mujati
Hookers: Du Plessis, Smit, Ralepelle/Strauss
Locks: Matfield, Botha, Bekker, VdMerwe
Backrow: Smith, Brussow, Roussow, Spies, Burger, Vermeulen

Halfbacks: Du Preez, Hougaard, Pienaar, Steyn, Lambie
Centres: De Villiers, Fourie, de Johng
Ouside backs: Basson, Aplon, Pietersen, Ndungane, Viljoen

I guess I don't have much to add... whi would you play at 2? Who to captain? (hoping that this thread won't become a thread about John Smit's form)

That would be my personal dream squad (with Spies replaced by Alberts) and though the vast majority of those players will be in the squad I expect some of the following to be picked as well (wrongly IMO but I can't speak for everyone);

Zane Kirschner*
Brian Habana*
Pierre Spies*
Ricky Januarie
CJ van der Linde

with these (*) players even likely to be in the run-on XV.

As to who to start at hooker... a very difficult choice since Bismarck is our tpop hooker withuot a doubt. Smit hasn't had much chance and I don't know whether the extended rest is a good thing or not. The games he has played this year he did really well in. Whether he should be starting or some kind of off-field-on-bench captain like the Sharks are doing I wouldn't know. His scrumming and throw-ins are good and if he can get his defense back up to his best I would definately consider starting him. Where I think everyone is on the same page though, thankfully, is that Smit shouldnt' be considered as a prop LOL. Starting or on the bench I'd have Smit as captain. the other senior players have stated as much and I guess they should know. Their are other options of course; Juan Smith, Victor Matfield and Schalk Burger all captain their provincial sides. JdV was the Stormers' captain before he went to play at Munster and Burger took over. I don't know if I have as much faith in those as captain as I do Smith though.

 

[psychic duck]

South Africa squad in my opinion

Forwards (16):
Loosehead (2): Gurthrö Steenkamp, Tendai 'Beast' Mtawarira (Coenie Oosthuizen)
Hooker (3): Bismarck du Plessis, Schalk Brits, Chiliboy Ralepelle (Adriaan Strauss)
Tighthead (2): Jannie du Plessis, Brian Mujati (CJ van der Linde)
Lock (3): Victor Matfield, Bakkies Botha, Johann Muller (Andries Bekker)
Openside (2): Heinrich Brüssow, Schalk Burger (Keegan Daniel)
Blindside (2): Juan Smith, Willem Alberts (Dewald Potgieter)
Number 8 (2): Pierre Spies, Ryan Kankowski (Joe van Niekerk)

Backs (14):
Scrum Halves (3): Fourie du Preez, Ruan Pienaar, Sarel Pretorius/Francois Hougaard
Fly Halves (2): Morné Steyn, Patrick Lambie (Butch James)
Inside centres (2): Jean de Villiers, François Steyn (Wynand Olivier)
Outside centres (2): Jaque Fourie, Juan de Jongh (Robert Ebersohn)
Wingers (4): Bryan Habana, Bjorn Basson, JP Pietersen, Odwa Ndungane (Lwazi Mvovo)
Full Backs (1): Gio Aplon (Riaan Viljoen)

*replacements in case of injury in brackets

Starting XV
15 Aplon, 14 Pietersen, 13 Fourie, 12 F Steyn, 11 Basson, 10 M Steyn, 9 du Preez; 1 Steenkamp, 2 B du Plessis, 3 J du Plessis, 4 Botha, 5 Matfield, 6 Brüssow, 7 Smith, 8 Spies

I agree with stormer2010 that Aplon isn't really an international full back, but there are few options, and I like Frans Steyn at centre.

For me despite poor form, this side will win the World Cup, at World Cups's old battle hardened sides do well in tight scrappy matches which could suit South Africa.

Morné Steyn because any penalties missed in tight knockout matches are crucial (remember Stirling Mortlock, 2007)

Habana and Smit's form isn't good enough to get in the team

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

South Africa squad in my opinion

Forwards (16):
Loosehead (2): Gurthrö Steenkamp, Tendai 'Beast' Mtawarira (Coenie Oosthuizen)
Hooker (3): Bismarck du Plessis, Schalk Brits, Chiliboy Ralepelle (Adriaan Strauss)
Tighthead (2): Jannie du Plessis, Brian Mujati (CJ van der Linde)
Lock (3): Victor Matfield, Bakkies Botha, Johann Muller (Andries Bekker)
Openside (2): Heinrich Brüssow, Schalk Burger (Keegan Daniel)
Blindside (2): Juan Smith, Willem Alberts (Dewald Potgieter)
Number 8 (2): Pierre Spies, Ryan Kankowski (Joe van Niekerk)

Backs (14):
Scrum Halves (3): Fourie du Preez, Ruan Pienaar, Sarel Pretorius/Francois Hougaard
Fly Halves (2): Morné Steyn, Patrick Lambie (Butch James)
Inside centres (2): Jean de Villiers, François Steyn (Wynand Olivier)
Outside centres (2): Jaque Fourie, Juan de Jongh (Robert Ebersohn)
Wingers (4): Bryan Habana, Bjorn Basson, JP Pietersen, Odwa Ndungane (Lwazi Mvovo)
Full Backs (1): Gio Aplon (Riaan Viljoen)

*replacements in case of injury in brackets

Starting XV
15 Aplon, 14 Pietersen, 13 Fourie, 12 F Steyn, 11 Basson, 10 M Steyn, 9 du Preez; 1 Steenkamp, 2 B du Plessis, 3 J du Plessis, 4 Botha, 5 Matfield, 6 Brüssow, 7 Smith, 8 Spies

I agree with stormer2010 that Aplon isn't really an international full back, but there are few options, and I like Frans Steyn at centre.

For me despite poor form, this side will win the World Cup, at World Cups's old battle hardened sides do well in tight scrappy matches which could suit South Africa.

Morné Steyn because any penalties missed in tight knockout matches are crucial (remember Stirling Mortlock, 2007)

Habana and Smit's form isn't good enough to get in the team

It's very interesting to get a foreigners take on things. I wouldn't be able to start on F Steyn or Brits and Muller as I've watched very few NH matches. Dropping Smit might well be the best thing to do... probably is LOL but there is no way he is going to get the axe (I've pretty much accepted that). Who would you select as captain?

 

[madflyhalf]

South Africa squad in my opinion

Forwards (16):
Loosehead (2): Gurthrö Steenkamp, Tendai 'Beast' Mtawarira (Coenie Oosthuizen)
Hooker (3): Bismarck du Plessis, Schalk Brits, Chiliboy Ralepelle (Adriaan Strauss)
Tighthead (2): Jannie du Plessis, Brian Mujati (CJ van der Linde)
Lock (3): Victor Matfield, Bakkies Botha, Johann Muller (Andries Bekker)
Openside (2): Heinrich Brüssow, Schalk Burger (Keegan Daniel)
Blindside (2): Juan Smith, Willem Alberts (Dewald Potgieter)
Number 8 (2): Pierre Spies, Ryan Kankowski (Joe van Niekerk)

Backs (14):
Scrum Halves (3): Fourie du Preez, Ruan Pienaar, Sarel Pretorius/Francois Hougaard
Fly Halves (2): Morné Steyn, Patrick Lambie (Butch James)
Inside centres (2): Jean de Villiers, François Steyn (Wynand Olivier)
Outside centres (2): Jaque Fourie, Juan de Jongh (Robert Ebersohn)
Wingers (4): Bryan Habana, Bjorn Basson, JP Pietersen, Odwa Ndungane (Lwazi Mvovo)
Full Backs (1): Gio Aplon (Riaan Viljoen)

*replacements in case of injury in brackets

Starting XV
15 Aplon, 14 Pietersen, 13 Fourie, 12 F Steyn, 11 Basson, 10 M Steyn, 9 du Preez; 1 Steenkamp, 2 B du Plessis, 3 J du Plessis, 4 Botha, 5 Matfield, 6 Brüssow, 7 Smith, 8 Spies

I like your squad... maybe I'd have a couple of changes:

Hooker (3): John Smit, Bismarck du Plessis, Adriaan Strauss (Chiliboy Ralepelle)
Locks (4): Victor Matfield, Bakkies Botha, Andries Bekker, Danie Rossouw
Blindside (1): Juan Smith (Wilhelm Alberts) *with Rossouw covering as backrow (blindside/8), if a lock would be injuried, I'd call Alberts anyway.

Anyone else in the forward are ok, but:

Scrum Halves (3): Fourie du Preez, Ruan Pienaar, Sarel Pretorius (R. Januarie)
Fly Halves (2): Morné Steyn, Patrick Lambie (Butch James)
Centres (4): Jean de Villiers, Jaque Fourie, Juan de Jongh, Wynand Olivier (Robert Ebersohn)
Wingers (3): Bryan Habana, François Hougaard, JP Pietersen (Lwazi Mvovo)
Full Backs (2): François Steyn, Gio Aplon (Riaan Viljioen)

These IMO are the most likely to be selected by PDV, not only because of their form now, but also because of their experience at test level too.
This is an important factor...

But, if I had to select the team, I'll drop Matfield, Spies, Chiliboy, and I would pick Flip Van Der Merwe, François Louw/Duane Vermeulen and Adriaan Strauss.
And as a cover for injuries in the fullback: Stefan Terblanche.
Yes, him!

That doesn't mean some of those can't have a chance: in the next few months, spotlight will be on
- François Louw, already tested, seemed not ready, but much has changed, also due to Juan Smith injury
- Duane Vermeulen, because he's playing much better than Spies...
- Flip van der Merwe, if Botha goes mad again or Matfield keep performing like that...

BTW
- At this moment, I don't see Spies in the match 22, Rossouw for workrate is playing much better
- Hard battle at prop... maybe PdV is gonna take BJ Botha ahead of Mujati.
- Big trouble in the backrows... I mean: I'd like to pick a side-team of 20 players, only backrows :lol:
But someone between Duane Vermeulen, François Louw, Wilhelm Alberts, Jacque Botes, Keegan Daniel, Jean Deysel, Ryan Kankowski, Deon Stegman, Dewald Potgieter, Ashley Johnson etc... would be dropped.

And my Starting XV (considering all fit for the RWC) would be:

15 F. Steyn
14 JP Pietersen
13 J. Fourie
12 J. De Villiers
11 F. Hougaard
10 M. Steyn
9 F. Du Preez
8 D. Rossouw
7 J. Smith (c)
6 S. Burger
5 A. Bekker
4 B. Botha
3 J. Du Plessis
2 B. Du Plessis
1 T. Mtawarira

16 J. Smit
17 G. Steenkamp
18 F. Van Der Merwe
19
20 R. Pienaar
21
22
These 4 are the only sure for the bench, backs replacements depends by every single match: Lambie, De Jongh, Aplon and Olivier are all candidates.
Same story for backrows: Brussow o Louw for the spot.

 

[Draggs]

Draggs' foreigner opinion Saffa 30:

Props (4): Steenkamp, JN du Plessis, Mtawarira, van der Linde
Hooker (3): BW du Plessis, Smit, ?
Second Row (3): Matfield, Bekker, Botha
Openside (2): Burger, Brussow
Blindside (2): Smith, Alberts/Deysel
Eight (3): Spies, Vermuelen/Kankowski, Rossouw (4-5/7/8)

Scrum half (3): du Preez, Hougaard,
Outside half (3): Grant, Lambie, Steyn
Centre (3): de Villiers, Fourie, de Jongh
Wing (3): Pietersen, Basson, Aplon
Fullback (1): Steyn

Rossouw is selected to cover blindside, eight and second row.
Hougaard can cover scrum half and wing.
Lambie can cover inside centre and fullback.
de Villiers can cover wing. (According to PdV)
Aplon can cover fullback.
Steyn can cover centre and outside half.

Obivously this depends on certain players performances during the Tri Nations, and only what I would like to see.

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

When South Africa will go to the World Cup in september, we have had a very long Super15 season and will be looking to succesfully defend our World ***le. This will be very very difficult given the fact it is held in New Zealand. The Springboks have only won a couple of matches so having a RWC there, will actually boost our win-ratio on New Zealand soil. This goes for any other top10 team as well I assume. Having been drawn in a group with Wales, Fiji, Samoa and Namibia it's safe to say we are the group favorites. We start off the 11th op September in a match which will already decide the group winner. We play Wales that day in Wellington. Our second match is against Fiji, 3rd against our brothers from Namibia and we end with a nice warm-up for the quarters against Samoa.

What will be the case if we be winners of our group? We will play the nr. 2 of group C. This will be Ireland or, who knows, Italy who will come second behind the Australians. The tricky thing is the semi final. If all goes according to what I predict, we will meet the hosts in the semi finals at Eden Park in Auckland. I think it's a waste to play the 4 remaining matches (semi finals, final and 3rd/4th place match) all at the same stadium, but okay.

I think we will have to be on the top of our game to even stand a chance. Can we actually beat New Zealand in Auckland? The Stormers have done pretty well in last weekend's practice run, defeating the Blues haha.

When it comes to the squad, I have 2 completely different squad selections in my head. First of all, there's my fav. 30, and then there is P Divvy's choice. Man o man. To illustrate the difference I will use a table. Just because it looks nice . My picks are on the left, Peter de Villiers' likely picks on the right

Props:


I think Steenkamp and Jannie du Plessis are the best scrumming props we have at the moment. Tendai Mtawarira is a true Beast who can come on to the field and perform perfectly as well. BJ Botha plays for Ulster in Ireland but is a much better option than CJ van der Linde in my opinion.

Hookers:


When it comes to hookers, there has been so much debate. Should Smit play since he is the captain or should the best hooker (Bismarck du Plessis) play? I prefer skill over captaincy any day when it comes to a World Cup. If this was a Tour, it would be different. I think Adriaan Strauss should be picked as a back up because he has shown this year he is the next best thing. He has pace, strength and his line-out throws are also good. As a 3rd choice I prefer Gary Botha who should be the first choice in the Bulls line up as well, but has to deal with the staff having a crush on Chiliboy Ralepelle.

Locks:


For the lock-position it's simple. Everyone knows Matfield and Bekker are the best locks we have and Flip van der Merwe is an amazing talent. Why does Bakkies Botha keep on appearing in the Bok jersey? We don't need a hot head like him. Danie Rossouw is the perfect back-up for the lock position with his experience and his versatility. He can play in any of the backrow-positions as well.

Backrow:


The backrow is what is worrying me the most. Last November we had the chance to see Deon Stegmann being overthrown with every scrum and losing grip on the match. Keegan Daniel is a much better option since he is quicker, has a better defense and is versatile. He can play no. 8 as well. Pierre Spies is one of those players who keeps on getting picked despite his form crisis. I don't know if I prefer Ryan Kankowski (who is my favorite, no need to explain there) or Duane Vermeulen who shows in his performance for the Stormers he is an incredible talent and has what it takes. I'll have to flip a coin for that. Willem Alberts is a good player to come on as a sub. There, nothing more, nothing less. A true wrecking ball who should not play the full 80. With Brussow, Smith and Burger there is no explanation needed.

Scrumhalf:


Scrumhalf, a position that needs to be taken care of after the World Cup when Fourie du Preez moves to Japan. Ruan Pienaar is a remarkable scrumhalf, being voted player of the year in the Magners League this season and being versatile, he can play fly-half and full back if necessary. Sarel Pretorius deserves a chance. At least being in the squad. His running, passing, try scoring and offloads are amazing to watch. P Divvy will go for Ricky Januarie, his secret lover, and he will pick Francois Hougaard, who I decided to pick as a winger since he is better on the wing than near the scrum and ruck.

Flyhalf:


Patrick Lambie is my first choice. He has everything. Running, kicking, offloading and vision. As a backup I pick Peter Grant who is a better all-round player than Morne Steyn.

Wingers:


On the wing I pick Bjorn Basson and JP Pietersen. Both are doing well this year and have shown great pace and strength. Gio Aplon and Francois Hougaard (there he is!) are my back-up wingers with Bryan Habana watching every match on DSTV.

Centers:


Well, for the center position I have a surprise. Of course Jean and Jaque are the first options with Juan a backup for both but who to pick as a 4th center? Wynand Olivier will make the squad when P Divvy is coach and Adrian Jacobs will be called up despite him being a benchwarmer in Durban. As an impact player I like Jacobs but I prefer Waylon Murray. The outside center of the Lions forming a good partnership with Doppies la Grange this year has surprised me so much and he brings something extra. It was a close call though

Fullback:


Francois Steyn is the first choice, no arguments there. I pick Riaan Viljoen over Zane Kirchner though. Viljoen, having a massive boot, a good run and vision is a sight for sore eyes when you are used to Kirchner's up-and-unders. Louis Ludik and Conrad Jantjes were also serious options for me though.

 

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TRF_stormer2010

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• May 24, 2011

• #9

RE ^

Agree with 90% of your post except;

- I think PdV is more likely to pick De Jongh over Jacobs taking into accoutn that he picked him for the midyear games last year and he did splendidly
- though I agree Strauss is the 2nd best hooker in SA I am worried about dropping Smit at this stage when all would expect im to lead. It should have been done but is too late now IMO.
- I would be surprised to see Stegmann picked. Then again maybe I give PdV too much credit LOL
- Grant is my hero LOL but i wouldn't have him at the RWC as his field kicking is schoolboyish and we (Stormers) have lost 2 games this directly related to this fact. Goalkicking matches Steyn though and general play is just better.


Thats it, I also hope to not see Spies, vd Linde, Januarie, Habana and Kirschner anywhre near the squad and agree with Viljoen though I'd have Hougaard as 3rd choice scrummie ahead of Pretorius unless the latter starts improving his missed tackle count drastically and consistently over the last 4 weeks. Where I think we have to take the gamble but i am suspicious of his form is F Steyn at 15; his last games there were terrible.

 

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madflyhalf

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• May 24, 2011

• #10

IMO South Africa needs Bakkies Botha.
He's mad, he has clearly anger problem, but if he stays focused on the game, he's the best second row in world rugby. For what he does in the lineout and, most important, in the whole plays.
He runs, tackles, mauls and rucks like no other lock on this planet.

Give him camomile, valium, prozac or some other pills, but make him play.

 

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TRF_Ezequiel

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• May 24, 2011

• #11

RE ^

Agree with 90% of your post except;

- I think PdV is more likely to pick De Jongh over Jacobs taking into accoutn that he picked him for the midyear games last year and he did splendidly
- though I agree Strauss is the 2nd best hooker in SA I am worried about dropping Smit at this stage when all would expect im to lead. It should have been done but is too late now IMO.
- I would be surprised to see Stegmann picked. Then again maybe I give PdV too much credit LOL
- Grant is my hero LOL but i wouldn't have him at the RWC as his field kicking is schoolboyish and we (Stormers) have lost 2 games this directly related to this fact. Goalkicking matches Steyn though and general play is just better.


Thats it, I also hope to not see Spies, vd Linde, Januarie, Habana and Kirschner anywhre near the squad and agree with Viljoen though I'd have Hougaard as 3rd choice scrummie ahead of Pretorius unless the latter starts improving his missed tackle count drastically and consistently over the last 4 weeks. Where I think we have to take the gamble but i am suspicious of his form is F Steyn at 15; his last games there were terrible.

So you think he will pick De Jongh and Olivier as back up centers?

 

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psychic duck

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• May 24, 2011

• #12

You should have Pierre Spies in the squad at least, with the hope that he rediscovers his form

Agree with you on Habana though, not sure why he is so bad now, doesn't get himself involved enough and his handling has been poor lately, does anyone know whether he would be a good outside centre?

I've never see Kirchner do anything particularly good to be honest, wouldn't have him in the squad

Nobody wants Januarie in the squad, enough said

I think when it gets to the point that a player is only in the team because of his "captaincy", I think it's easier for the player and the team for him to step aside, and regain his place on form alone.

It just creates a bad atmosphere round a player and the team, when he's getting scrutinized so much by the media and fans for not being good enough

 

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T

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• May 24, 2011

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From a naive Scotsman, here would be my 22 for the World Cup for Sa (take into accoutn i dont watch South African rugby that often)
1. The Beast
2. B du Plessis
3. J du Plessis
4. Botha
5. Matfiled (c)
6. Brussow (either him of Burger)
7. Smith
8. Spies (I know his form isn't great but such a force when he plays well)
9. Du Preez
10. M Steyn
11. Basson
12. De Villiers
13. Fourie
14. Pietersen
15. F Steyn

16. S Brits
17. Van Der Linde
18. Bekker
19. S Burger
20. Pienaar
21. de Jongh
22. Aplon/Habana

Is it a good team? I would have Smit in my 30man squad but i dont think hes good enough anymore for the 22. Habana on the bench only because of his pace and that if he plays well he can be a real threat. No fly-half on the bench as if Morné Steyn was to be injured i would move Pienaar there. Lambie, Mujati, Smit, Rossouw, Hougaard, Vilojen, Alberts etc would also be in my 30 man squad.
Overall I think it is quite a good team and that experience will and does count for a lot in the latter stages of a big tournament like the WC, so i would definitely consider having Burger in the XV instead of Brussow but Brussow is more talented i would say.

 

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ZeFrenchy

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• May 24, 2011

• #14

I had forgotten about Brits... I would play that guy at 12 ffs, he's absolutely awesome. I think he's better than Ralepelle and Smit, don't really know Strauss.

 

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B

Boggle

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• May 24, 2011

• #15

I've always been a huge fan of Schalk Brits when he was playing for the Stormers, and he was probably the best hooker in the country after John Smit back then (this was a few years ago). He's not the biggest guy, but he's absolutely excellent in almost everything, and he's got the pace of a winger for goodness sake.

The problem is that he's not been playing in South Africa or been anywhere near the Springbok setup, so there's realistically no way he'd make it into the World Cup squad.

 

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Darwin

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• May 24, 2011

• #16

I'll continue the trend of naive foreigners posting teams
(Unfortunately) I think the Boks best chance at this RWC is to use the tactics that were so effective in 2009. Though the new law interpretations have lessened the effectiveness of these tactics, if they execute these tactics well they can still be effective. Last season the Boks seemed to be caught between two game plans, and didn't execute either particularity well. Though in the long run I think a more expansive gameplan will benefit the Boks, I don't think they have enough time to change their style, and they would lose out to the likes of NZ and Australia who have been playing this more expansive style for the last few years.

My 30-man squad is the squad that I would pick if I was the Boks coach, rather than the squad I think will be picked. Basically it's the players that I hope the AB's won't come up against if we play the Boks in the RWC

1. Steenkamp
2. B du Plessis
3. J du Plessis (Mjuati and BJ Botha are other options)
4. Bekker (not really a fan of pairing Bekker and Matfield, however I don't particularly rate Bakkies Botha or Rossouw, and van der Merwe isn't really getting enough game-time)
5. Matfield
6. Burger (Brussow keeps get injured, and I'm not yet convinced how he will go under the new law interpretations)
7. Smith (if fit)
8. Vermuleon (I don't rate Spies or Kankowski)
9. du Preez
10. Morne Steyn (not a big fan, but as mentioned above I think the Boks best chance is to use the tactics that were so effective in 2009)
11. Bryan Habana (certainly not on form. He is still amongst the best kick chasers in the game, and covers very well on defense. If the the Boks play a more expansive game plan I possibly wouldn't even have him in my 30-man squad)
12. de Villiers
13. Fourie
14. JP Pieterson
15. F Steyn (Huge punting and long-range goal kicking ability could be vital)

16. A Strauss
17. Mujati (or BJ Botha/ van der Linde. I would like to have Mtawarira on the bench for impact, but that would leave not and tight-head cover on the bench)
18. Bakkies Botha (mainly for his experience, though I wouldn't mind if he was dropped altogether)
19. Rossouw (Would genuniely consider him at the starting 8)
20. Deysel (I think a 5/2 split will suit the Boks, especially if they play a forward orientated game)
21. Pienaar
22. Aplon

23. Smit (his experience would be invaluable to the squad)
24. Mtawarira
25. van der Merwe
26. Brussow
27. Hougaard (I rate Pretorius, but I think he is a huge liability on defense, and this would be exposed at test level)
28. Lambie
29. de Jongh
20. Basson (would definitely be starting if the Boks adopted a more expansive gameplan)

 

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TRF_stormer2010

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• May 25, 2011

• #17

So you think he will pick De Jongh and Olivier as back up centers?

I think De Jongh is a sure pick for PdV. I wouldn't be surprised if that is it (with JdV and JF) as far as out-and-out centres go with Frans Steyn, Lambie and Butch also likely possibilities in the squad that can cover the centers.

From a naive Scotsman, here would be my 22 for the World Cup for Sa (take into accoutn i dont watch South African rugby that often)
1. The Beast
2. B du Plessis
3. J du Plessis
4. Botha
5. Matfiled (c)
6. Brussow (either him of Burger)
7. Smith
8. Spies (I know his form isn't great but such a force when he plays well)
9. Du Preez
10. M Steyn
11. Basson
12. De Villiers
13. Fourie
14. Pietersen
15. F Steyn

16. S Brits
17. Van Der Linde
18. Bekker
19. S Burger
20. Pienaar
21. de Jongh
22. Aplon/Habana

Is it a good team? I would have Smit in my 30man squad but i dont think hes good enough anymore for the 22. Habana on the bench only because of his pace and that if he plays well he can be a real threat. No fly-half on the bench as if Morné Steyn was to be injured i would move Pienaar there. Lambie, Mujati, Smit, Rossouw, Hougaard, Vilojen, Alberts etc would also be in my 30 man squad.
Overall I think it is quite a good team and that experience will and does count for a lot in the latter stages of a big tournament like the WC, so i would definitely consider having Burger in the XV instead of Brussow but Brussow is more talented i would say.

I think that is both a good team and close enough to the mark; somewhere between what I think management/PdV will pick and what most fans want.

I'll continue the trend of naive foreigners posting teams
(Unfortunately) I think the Boks best chance at this RWC is to use the tactics that were so effective in 2009. Though the new law interpretations have lessened the effectiveness of these tactics, if they execute these tactics well they can still be effective. Last season the Boks seemed to be caught between two game plans, and didn't execute either particularity well. Though in the long run I think a more expansive gameplan will benefit the Boks, I don't think they have enough time to change their style, and they would lose out to the likes of NZ and Australia who have been playing this more expansive style for the last few years.

My 30-man squad is the squad that I would pick if I was the Boks coach, rather than the squad I think will be picked. Basically it's the players that I hope the AB's won't come up against if we play the Boks in the RWC

1. Steenkamp
2. B du Plessis
3. J du Plessis (Mjuati and BJ Botha are other options)
4. Bekker (not really a fan of pairing Bekker and Matfield, however I don't particularly rate Bakkies Botha or Rossouw, and van der Merwe isn't really getting enough game-time)
5. Matfield
6. Burger (Brussow keeps get injured, and I'm not yet convinced how he will go under the new law interpretations)
7. Smith (if fit)
8. Vermuleon (I don't rate Spies or Kankowski)
9. du Preez
10. Morne Steyn (not a big fan, but as mentioned above I think the Boks best chance is to use the tactics that were so effective in 2009)
11. Bryan Habana (certainly not on form. He is still amongst the best kick chasers in the game, and covers very well on defense. If the the Boks play a more expansive game plan I possibly wouldn't even have him in my 30-man squad)
12. de Villiers
13. Fourie
14. JP Pieterson
15. F Steyn (Huge punting and long-range goal kicking ability could be vital)

16. A Strauss
17. Mujati (or BJ Botha/ van der Linde. I would like to have Mtawarira on the bench for impact, but that would leave not and tight-head cover on the bench)
18. Bakkies Botha (mainly for his experience, though I wouldn't mind if he was dropped altogether)
19. Rossouw (Would genuniely consider him at the starting 8)
20. Deysel (I think a 5/2 split will suit the Boks, especially if they play a forward orientated game)
21. Pienaar
22. Aplon

23. Smit (his experience would be invaluable to the squad)
24. Mtawarira
25. van der Merwe
26. Brussow
27. Hougaard (I rate Pretorius, but I think he is a huge liability on defense, and this would be exposed at test level)
28. Lambie
29. de Jongh
20. Basson (would definitely be starting if the Boks adopted a more expansive gameplan)

I agree completely with the fact that the game we played in 2009 in the B&I Lions and 3N is our best bet. Though I also agree that it is not the way forward I think we can still compete if we keep up the pressure for the full 80 minutes and get the accuracy right. That is where we really missed FdP in 2010 (more his absence than the change in rule interpretations IMO).

My only changes to the run on side would be to have Bakies starting with either Matfield or Bekker but not those two together; at his best he is still my choice scrummaging lock in world rugby, Thorn the only one close to him but probably better because of greater discipline and consistency but at his best and focussed Bakkies is untouchable. On the wing Basson for me is a better option than Habana; he actually fields those kicks on a regular basis while Habana only spoils. His work rate is pretty good as well and on turn-over ball theres no SA winger I'd rather have out wide (that reminds me I hope Brussow is back as we missed those opportunities off of the turn-overs that we had in 2009- the few games he's played this year suggest the changes to the game has had little effect on his effectiveness). I think it is a 3 way battle between Basson, Pietersen and Aplon on the wing for me unless Habana can get back to some semblense of form real quick.

 

Last edited: May 25, 2011

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Darwin

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• May 25, 2011

• #18

I agree completely with the fact that the game we played in 2009 in the B&I Lions and 3N is our best bet. Though I also agree that it is not the way forward I think we can still compete if we keep up the pressure for the full 80 minutes and get the accuracy right. That is where we really missed FdP in 2010 (more his absence than the change in rule interpretations IMO).

My only changes to the run on side would be to have Bakies starting with either Matfield or Bekker but not those two together; at his best he is still my choice scrummaging lock in world rugby, Thorn the only one close to him but probably better because of greater discipline and consistency but at his best and focussed Bakkies is untouchable. On the wing Basson for me is a better option than Habana; he actually fields those kicks on a regular basis while Habana only spoils. His work rate is pretty good as well and on turn-over ball theres no SA winger I'd rather have out wide (that reminds me I hope Brussow is back as we missed those opportunities off of the turn-overs that we had in 2009- the few games he's played this year suggest the changes to the game has had little effect on his effectiveness). I think it is a 3 way battle between Basson, Pietersen and Aplon on the wing for me unless Habana can get back to some semblense of form real quick.

Yeah I do agree that pairing Matfield and Bekker would possibly not be the best idea, but my theory was that the Boks should kick the ball out and really attack the opponents lineout. In reality though, having a tighter lock (Rossouw/Botha/van der Merwe) would probably be a much better idea, and I was tossing up between having Rossouw/Bekker, Botha/Bekker, or Bekker/Matfield.

I was also tossing up between Basson, Pieterson, and Habana in my starting lineup. What swayed my decision was the greater experience and defense ability of both Habana and Pieterson (not that I've seen much wrong with Basson's defense, just i think Habana and Pieterson are both very good defense players). I've only seem 3-4 Bulls games this year (v Highlanders, Hurricanes, Crusaders are the only ones that come to mind), so I probably haven't seen enough of Basson to make a fair judgment on him though.

 

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P

Please-Buy-Baywatch

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• May 26, 2011

• #19

Smith is injured guys, he is out of the world cup from the looks of it.

1. Guthro
2. Bismark
3. BJ Botha
4. Bakkies
5. Matfield
6. Brussouw
7. Schalk
8. Alberts
9. FDP
10. Butch James
11. Habana
12. De Villiers
13. Fourie
14. JPP
15. Frans Steyn

16. Smit (can cover prop and hooker)
17. CJ (can cover both tight and loose)
18. Bekker
19. Rousouw
20. Pienaar
21. De Jongh
22. Aplon

Strong tight 5, versatile bench, strong defensively and lots of experience

The other 8 would consist of the following, players in brackets are my preferred players, but we have to have players of colour because we have political quotas we need to hit. So we cant take out best side, we have to take a side that has people who are not white. * denotes players who are there on merit

Beast*, Maku (Strauus), , Spies, Johnson (Deysel), Morne Steyn, Ricky January (Hougaard), Juan de Jongh*,

 

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TRF_stormer2010

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• May 26, 2011

• #20

Yeah I do agree that pairing Matfield and Bekker would possibly not be the best idea, but my theory was that the Boks should kick the ball out and really attack the opponents lineout. In reality though, having a tighter lock (Rossouw/Botha/van der Merwe) would probably be a much better idea, and I was tossing up between having Rossouw/Bekker, Botha/Bekker, or Bekker/Matfield.

I was also tossing up between Basson, Pieterson, and Habana in my starting lineup. What swayed my decision was the greater experience and defense ability of both Habana and Pieterson (not that I've seen much wrong with Basson's defense, just i think Habana and Pieterson are both very good defense players). I've only seem 3-4 Bulls games this year (v Highlanders, Hurricanes, Crusaders are the only ones that come to mind), so I probably haven't seen enough of Basson to make a fair judgment on him though.

Fair enough. You do know a lot about SA rugby though. Botha in the engine room for me is a must. I have faith that the guy can sort out his act (discipline wise) and a full tilt 80 minutes from Botha wins games IMO. The only reason I am afraid of Habana is his lack of confidence in attack (comes down to him being rushed on attack) and his tendencies (2010 Springboks and earlier in the S15 season) to rush off of the line at the wrong times and really put us under pressure in defense. Basson is a solid winger with blistering pace and very suited to SA's style; better in the air than Rob Kearny version 2009. Has had limited opportunities but has silently managed to score 7 tries this S15 thus far in a struggling bulls outfit; who even when on top form rarely spread the ball to their wings LOL.

Smith is injured guys, he is out of the world cup from the looks of it.

1. Guthro
2. Bismark
3. BJ Botha
4. Bakkies
5. Matfield
6. Brussouw
7. Schalk
8. Alberts
9. FDP
10. Butch James
11. Habana
12. De Villiers
13. Fourie
14. JPP
15. Frans Steyn

16. Smit (can cover prop and hooker)
17. CJ (can cover both tight and loose)
18. Bekker
19. Rousouw
20. Pienaar
21. De Jongh
22. Aplon

Strong tight 5, versatile bench, strong defensively and lots of experience

The other 8 would consist of the following, players in brackets are my preferred players, but we have to have players of colour because we have political quotas we need to hit. So we cant take out best side, we have to take a side that has people who are not white. * denotes players who are there on merit

Beast*, Maku (Strauus), , Spies, Johnson (Deysel), Morne Steyn, Ricky January (Hougaard), Juan de Jongh*,

Smith has to heal! I can't accept him and/or FdP missing this RWC LOL. If I had the money, I'd personally pay for him to live in an oxygen tank for the next 2 months. I guess we can only speculate who will make the cut. The sure thing is there will be some unlucky players who would surely have made most other international teams.

WRT quotas I am sure there are enough players of 'color' who are there on merit for it not to effect our chances. I am more worried about injuries/form of key players. Beast, De Jongh, Pietersen, Basson and Aplon should all make the starting 22 with the only problem being a 'pile-up' on the wing positions though Aplon and De Jongh will probably do bench duty. Guys I wouldn't have a problem with but who are probably not the best choices; Habana, Ralepelle and Mujati. They've all had their moments and could very well shine. TBF the only players within the Springbok fringes that I'd see as 'quota' players would be Januarie, Jacobs and Kirschner. But selecting them wouldn't necessarily be down to quota's as most coaches tend to have a few 'oog appeltjies'. But lets cross that bridge when we get to it. Matbe our fears don't come true, maybe injury forces some selections, maybe those players surprise us if they get the chance. Hell, Guthro Steenkamp is there as well. The best thing is to not look at a player's tone of skin. Easier said than done with our politicians ramming the race 'issue' down our throats every day. The true issue is an economic/education/class issue which unfortunately is tide up with race in SA due to past imbalances in opportunities along racial lines but is irrelevant in sport IMO or at least should be.

 

Last edited: May 26, 2011

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[TRF_stormer2010]

RE ^

Agree with 90% of your post except;

- I think PdV is more likely to pick De Jongh over Jacobs taking into accoutn that he picked him for the midyear games last year and he did splendidly
- though I agree Strauss is the 2nd best hooker in SA I am worried about dropping Smit at this stage when all would expect im to lead. It should have been done but is too late now IMO.
- I would be surprised to see Stegmann picked. Then again maybe I give PdV too much credit LOL
- Grant is my hero LOL but i wouldn't have him at the RWC as his field kicking is schoolboyish and we (Stormers) have lost 2 games this directly related to this fact. Goalkicking matches Steyn though and general play is just better.


Thats it, I also hope to not see Spies, vd Linde, Januarie, Habana and Kirschner anywhre near the squad and agree with Viljoen though I'd have Hougaard as 3rd choice scrummie ahead of Pretorius unless the latter starts improving his missed tackle count drastically and consistently over the last 4 weeks. Where I think we have to take the gamble but i am suspicious of his form is F Steyn at 15; his last games there were terrible.

 

[madflyhalf]

IMO South Africa needs Bakkies Botha.
He's mad, he has clearly anger problem, but if he stays focused on the game, he's the best second row in world rugby. For what he does in the lineout and, most important, in the whole plays.
He runs, tackles, mauls and rucks like no other lock on this planet.

Give him camomile, valium, prozac or some other pills, but make him play.

 

[TRF_Ezequiel]

RE ^

Agree with 90% of your post except;

- I think PdV is more likely to pick De Jongh over Jacobs taking into accoutn that he picked him for the midyear games last year and he did splendidly
- though I agree Strauss is the 2nd best hooker in SA I am worried about dropping Smit at this stage when all would expect im to lead. It should have been done but is too late now IMO.
- I would be surprised to see Stegmann picked. Then again maybe I give PdV too much credit LOL
- Grant is my hero LOL but i wouldn't have him at the RWC as his field kicking is schoolboyish and we (Stormers) have lost 2 games this directly related to this fact. Goalkicking matches Steyn though and general play is just better.


Thats it, I also hope to not see Spies, vd Linde, Januarie, Habana and Kirschner anywhre near the squad and agree with Viljoen though I'd have Hougaard as 3rd choice scrummie ahead of Pretorius unless the latter starts improving his missed tackle count drastically and consistently over the last 4 weeks. Where I think we have to take the gamble but i am suspicious of his form is F Steyn at 15; his last games there were terrible.

So you think he will pick De Jongh and Olivier as back up centers?

 

[psychic duck]

You should have Pierre Spies in the squad at least, with the hope that he rediscovers his form

Agree with you on Habana though, not sure why he is so bad now, doesn't get himself involved enough and his handling has been poor lately, does anyone know whether he would be a good outside centre?

I've never see Kirchner do anything particularly good to be honest, wouldn't have him in the squad

Nobody wants Januarie in the squad, enough said

I think when it gets to the point that a player is only in the team because of his "captaincy", I think it's easier for the player and the team for him to step aside, and regain his place on form alone.

It just creates a bad atmosphere round a player and the team, when he's getting scrutinized so much by the media and fans for not being good enough

 

[The Tuilagi Brothers]

From a naive Scotsman, here would be my 22 for the World Cup for Sa (take into accoutn i dont watch South African rugby that often)
1. The Beast
2. B du Plessis
3. J du Plessis
4. Botha
5. Matfiled (c)
6. Brussow (either him of Burger)
7. Smith
8. Spies (I know his form isn't great but such a force when he plays well)
9. Du Preez
10. M Steyn
11. Basson
12. De Villiers
13. Fourie
14. Pietersen
15. F Steyn

16. S Brits
17. Van Der Linde
18. Bekker
19. S Burger
20. Pienaar
21. de Jongh
22. Aplon/Habana

Is it a good team? I would have Smit in my 30man squad but i dont think hes good enough anymore for the 22. Habana on the bench only because of his pace and that if he plays well he can be a real threat. No fly-half on the bench as if Morné Steyn was to be injured i would move Pienaar there. Lambie, Mujati, Smit, Rossouw, Hougaard, Vilojen, Alberts etc would also be in my 30 man squad.
Overall I think it is quite a good team and that experience will and does count for a lot in the latter stages of a big tournament like the WC, so i would definitely consider having Burger in the XV instead of Brussow but Brussow is more talented i would say.

 

[ZeFrenchy]

I had forgotten about Brits... I would play that guy at 12 ffs, he's absolutely awesome. I think he's better than Ralepelle and Smit, don't really know Strauss.

 

[Boggle]

I've always been a huge fan of Schalk Brits when he was playing for the Stormers, and he was probably the best hooker in the country after John Smit back then (this was a few years ago). He's not the biggest guy, but he's absolutely excellent in almost everything, and he's got the pace of a winger for goodness sake.

The problem is that he's not been playing in South Africa or been anywhere near the Springbok setup, so there's realistically no way he'd make it into the World Cup squad.

 

[Darwin]

I'll continue the trend of naive foreigners posting teams
(Unfortunately) I think the Boks best chance at this RWC is to use the tactics that were so effective in 2009. Though the new law interpretations have lessened the effectiveness of these tactics, if they execute these tactics well they can still be effective. Last season the Boks seemed to be caught between two game plans, and didn't execute either particularity well. Though in the long run I think a more expansive gameplan will benefit the Boks, I don't think they have enough time to change their style, and they would lose out to the likes of NZ and Australia who have been playing this more expansive style for the last few years.

My 30-man squad is the squad that I would pick if I was the Boks coach, rather than the squad I think will be picked. Basically it's the players that I hope the AB's won't come up against if we play the Boks in the RWC

1. Steenkamp
2. B du Plessis
3. J du Plessis (Mjuati and BJ Botha are other options)
4. Bekker (not really a fan of pairing Bekker and Matfield, however I don't particularly rate Bakkies Botha or Rossouw, and van der Merwe isn't really getting enough game-time)
5. Matfield
6. Burger (Brussow keeps get injured, and I'm not yet convinced how he will go under the new law interpretations)
7. Smith (if fit)
8. Vermuleon (I don't rate Spies or Kankowski)
9. du Preez
10. Morne Steyn (not a big fan, but as mentioned above I think the Boks best chance is to use the tactics that were so effective in 2009)
11. Bryan Habana (certainly not on form. He is still amongst the best kick chasers in the game, and covers very well on defense. If the the Boks play a more expansive game plan I possibly wouldn't even have him in my 30-man squad)
12. de Villiers
13. Fourie
14. JP Pieterson
15. F Steyn (Huge punting and long-range goal kicking ability could be vital)

16. A Strauss
17. Mujati (or BJ Botha/ van der Linde. I would like to have Mtawarira on the bench for impact, but that would leave not and tight-head cover on the bench)
18. Bakkies Botha (mainly for his experience, though I wouldn't mind if he was dropped altogether)
19. Rossouw (Would genuniely consider him at the starting 8)
20. Deysel (I think a 5/2 split will suit the Boks, especially if they play a forward orientated game)
21. Pienaar
22. Aplon

23. Smit (his experience would be invaluable to the squad)
24. Mtawarira
25. van der Merwe
26. Brussow
27. Hougaard (I rate Pretorius, but I think he is a huge liability on defense, and this would be exposed at test level)
28. Lambie
29. de Jongh
20. Basson (would definitely be starting if the Boks adopted a more expansive gameplan)

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

So you think he will pick De Jongh and Olivier as back up centers?

I think De Jongh is a sure pick for PdV. I wouldn't be surprised if that is it (with JdV and JF) as far as out-and-out centres go with Frans Steyn, Lambie and Butch also likely possibilities in the squad that can cover the centers.

From a naive Scotsman, here would be my 22 for the World Cup for Sa (take into accoutn i dont watch South African rugby that often)
1. The Beast
2. B du Plessis
3. J du Plessis
4. Botha
5. Matfiled (c)
6. Brussow (either him of Burger)
7. Smith
8. Spies (I know his form isn't great but such a force when he plays well)
9. Du Preez
10. M Steyn
11. Basson
12. De Villiers
13. Fourie
14. Pietersen
15. F Steyn

16. S Brits
17. Van Der Linde
18. Bekker
19. S Burger
20. Pienaar
21. de Jongh
22. Aplon/Habana

Is it a good team? I would have Smit in my 30man squad but i dont think hes good enough anymore for the 22. Habana on the bench only because of his pace and that if he plays well he can be a real threat. No fly-half on the bench as if Morné Steyn was to be injured i would move Pienaar there. Lambie, Mujati, Smit, Rossouw, Hougaard, Vilojen, Alberts etc would also be in my 30 man squad.
Overall I think it is quite a good team and that experience will and does count for a lot in the latter stages of a big tournament like the WC, so i would definitely consider having Burger in the XV instead of Brussow but Brussow is more talented i would say.

I think that is both a good team and close enough to the mark; somewhere between what I think management/PdV will pick and what most fans want.

I'll continue the trend of naive foreigners posting teams
(Unfortunately) I think the Boks best chance at this RWC is to use the tactics that were so effective in 2009. Though the new law interpretations have lessened the effectiveness of these tactics, if they execute these tactics well they can still be effective. Last season the Boks seemed to be caught between two game plans, and didn't execute either particularity well. Though in the long run I think a more expansive gameplan will benefit the Boks, I don't think they have enough time to change their style, and they would lose out to the likes of NZ and Australia who have been playing this more expansive style for the last few years.

My 30-man squad is the squad that I would pick if I was the Boks coach, rather than the squad I think will be picked. Basically it's the players that I hope the AB's won't come up against if we play the Boks in the RWC

1. Steenkamp
2. B du Plessis
3. J du Plessis (Mjuati and BJ Botha are other options)
4. Bekker (not really a fan of pairing Bekker and Matfield, however I don't particularly rate Bakkies Botha or Rossouw, and van der Merwe isn't really getting enough game-time)
5. Matfield
6. Burger (Brussow keeps get injured, and I'm not yet convinced how he will go under the new law interpretations)
7. Smith (if fit)
8. Vermuleon (I don't rate Spies or Kankowski)
9. du Preez
10. Morne Steyn (not a big fan, but as mentioned above I think the Boks best chance is to use the tactics that were so effective in 2009)
11. Bryan Habana (certainly not on form. He is still amongst the best kick chasers in the game, and covers very well on defense. If the the Boks play a more expansive game plan I possibly wouldn't even have him in my 30-man squad)
12. de Villiers
13. Fourie
14. JP Pieterson
15. F Steyn (Huge punting and long-range goal kicking ability could be vital)

16. A Strauss
17. Mujati (or BJ Botha/ van der Linde. I would like to have Mtawarira on the bench for impact, but that would leave not and tight-head cover on the bench)
18. Bakkies Botha (mainly for his experience, though I wouldn't mind if he was dropped altogether)
19. Rossouw (Would genuniely consider him at the starting 8)
20. Deysel (I think a 5/2 split will suit the Boks, especially if they play a forward orientated game)
21. Pienaar
22. Aplon

23. Smit (his experience would be invaluable to the squad)
24. Mtawarira
25. van der Merwe
26. Brussow
27. Hougaard (I rate Pretorius, but I think he is a huge liability on defense, and this would be exposed at test level)
28. Lambie
29. de Jongh
20. Basson (would definitely be starting if the Boks adopted a more expansive gameplan)

I agree completely with the fact that the game we played in 2009 in the B&I Lions and 3N is our best bet. Though I also agree that it is not the way forward I think we can still compete if we keep up the pressure for the full 80 minutes and get the accuracy right. That is where we really missed FdP in 2010 (more his absence than the change in rule interpretations IMO).

My only changes to the run on side would be to have Bakies starting with either Matfield or Bekker but not those two together; at his best he is still my choice scrummaging lock in world rugby, Thorn the only one close to him but probably better because of greater discipline and consistency but at his best and focussed Bakkies is untouchable. On the wing Basson for me is a better option than Habana; he actually fields those kicks on a regular basis while Habana only spoils. His work rate is pretty good as well and on turn-over ball theres no SA winger I'd rather have out wide (that reminds me I hope Brussow is back as we missed those opportunities off of the turn-overs that we had in 2009- the few games he's played this year suggest the changes to the game has had little effect on his effectiveness). I think it is a 3 way battle between Basson, Pietersen and Aplon on the wing for me unless Habana can get back to some semblense of form real quick.

 

[Darwin]

I agree completely with the fact that the game we played in 2009 in the B&I Lions and 3N is our best bet. Though I also agree that it is not the way forward I think we can still compete if we keep up the pressure for the full 80 minutes and get the accuracy right. That is where we really missed FdP in 2010 (more his absence than the change in rule interpretations IMO).

My only changes to the run on side would be to have Bakies starting with either Matfield or Bekker but not those two together; at his best he is still my choice scrummaging lock in world rugby, Thorn the only one close to him but probably better because of greater discipline and consistency but at his best and focussed Bakkies is untouchable. On the wing Basson for me is a better option than Habana; he actually fields those kicks on a regular basis while Habana only spoils. His work rate is pretty good as well and on turn-over ball theres no SA winger I'd rather have out wide (that reminds me I hope Brussow is back as we missed those opportunities off of the turn-overs that we had in 2009- the few games he's played this year suggest the changes to the game has had little effect on his effectiveness). I think it is a 3 way battle between Basson, Pietersen and Aplon on the wing for me unless Habana can get back to some semblense of form real quick.

Yeah I do agree that pairing Matfield and Bekker would possibly not be the best idea, but my theory was that the Boks should kick the ball out and really attack the opponents lineout. In reality though, having a tighter lock (Rossouw/Botha/van der Merwe) would probably be a much better idea, and I was tossing up between having Rossouw/Bekker, Botha/Bekker, or Bekker/Matfield.

I was also tossing up between Basson, Pieterson, and Habana in my starting lineup. What swayed my decision was the greater experience and defense ability of both Habana and Pieterson (not that I've seen much wrong with Basson's defense, just i think Habana and Pieterson are both very good defense players). I've only seem 3-4 Bulls games this year (v Highlanders, Hurricanes, Crusaders are the only ones that come to mind), so I probably haven't seen enough of Basson to make a fair judgment on him though.

 

[Please-Buy-Baywatch]

Smith is injured guys, he is out of the world cup from the looks of it.

1. Guthro
2. Bismark
3. BJ Botha
4. Bakkies
5. Matfield
6. Brussouw
7. Schalk
8. Alberts
9. FDP
10. Butch James
11. Habana
12. De Villiers
13. Fourie
14. JPP
15. Frans Steyn

16. Smit (can cover prop and hooker)
17. CJ (can cover both tight and loose)
18. Bekker
19. Rousouw
20. Pienaar
21. De Jongh
22. Aplon

Strong tight 5, versatile bench, strong defensively and lots of experience

The other 8 would consist of the following, players in brackets are my preferred players, but we have to have players of colour because we have political quotas we need to hit. So we cant take out best side, we have to take a side that has people who are not white. * denotes players who are there on merit

Beast*, Maku (Strauus), , Spies, Johnson (Deysel), Morne Steyn, Ricky January (Hougaard), Juan de Jongh*,

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Yeah I do agree that pairing Matfield and Bekker would possibly not be the best idea, but my theory was that the Boks should kick the ball out and really attack the opponents lineout. In reality though, having a tighter lock (Rossouw/Botha/van der Merwe) would probably be a much better idea, and I was tossing up between having Rossouw/Bekker, Botha/Bekker, or Bekker/Matfield.

I was also tossing up between Basson, Pieterson, and Habana in my starting lineup. What swayed my decision was the greater experience and defense ability of both Habana and Pieterson (not that I've seen much wrong with Basson's defense, just i think Habana and Pieterson are both very good defense players). I've only seem 3-4 Bulls games this year (v Highlanders, Hurricanes, Crusaders are the only ones that come to mind), so I probably haven't seen enough of Basson to make a fair judgment on him though.

Fair enough. You do know a lot about SA rugby though. Botha in the engine room for me is a must. I have faith that the guy can sort out his act (discipline wise) and a full tilt 80 minutes from Botha wins games IMO. The only reason I am afraid of Habana is his lack of confidence in attack (comes down to him being rushed on attack) and his tendencies (2010 Springboks and earlier in the S15 season) to rush off of the line at the wrong times and really put us under pressure in defense. Basson is a solid winger with blistering pace and very suited to SA's style; better in the air than Rob Kearny version 2009. Has had limited opportunities but has silently managed to score 7 tries this S15 thus far in a struggling bulls outfit; who even when on top form rarely spread the ball to their wings LOL.

Smith is injured guys, he is out of the world cup from the looks of it.

1. Guthro
2. Bismark
3. BJ Botha
4. Bakkies
5. Matfield
6. Brussouw
7. Schalk
8. Alberts
9. FDP
10. Butch James
11. Habana
12. De Villiers
13. Fourie
14. JPP
15. Frans Steyn

16. Smit (can cover prop and hooker)
17. CJ (can cover both tight and loose)
18. Bekker
19. Rousouw
20. Pienaar
21. De Jongh
22. Aplon

Strong tight 5, versatile bench, strong defensively and lots of experience

The other 8 would consist of the following, players in brackets are my preferred players, but we have to have players of colour because we have political quotas we need to hit. So we cant take out best side, we have to take a side that has people who are not white. * denotes players who are there on merit

Beast*, Maku (Strauus), , Spies, Johnson (Deysel), Morne Steyn, Ricky January (Hougaard), Juan de Jongh*,

Smith has to heal! I can't accept him and/or FdP missing this RWC LOL. If I had the money, I'd personally pay for him to live in an oxygen tank for the next 2 months. I guess we can only speculate who will make the cut. The sure thing is there will be some unlucky players who would surely have made most other international teams.

WRT quotas I am sure there are enough players of 'color' who are there on merit for it not to effect our chances. I am more worried about injuries/form of key players. Beast, De Jongh, Pietersen, Basson and Aplon should all make the starting 22 with the only problem being a 'pile-up' on the wing positions though Aplon and De Jongh will probably do bench duty. Guys I wouldn't have a problem with but who are probably not the best choices; Habana, Ralepelle and Mujati. They've all had their moments and could very well shine. TBF the only players within the Springbok fringes that I'd see as 'quota' players would be Januarie, Jacobs and Kirschner. But selecting them wouldn't necessarily be down to quota's as most coaches tend to have a few 'oog appeltjies'. But lets cross that bridge when we get to it. Matbe our fears don't come true, maybe injury forces some selections, maybe those players surprise us if they get the chance. Hell, Guthro Steenkamp is there as well. The best thing is to not look at a player's tone of skin. Easier said than done with our politicians ramming the race 'issue' down our throats every day. The true issue is an economic/education/class issue which unfortunately is tide up with race in SA due to past imbalances in opportunities along racial lines but is irrelevant in sport IMO or at least should be.