Please World Rugby, ban the Haka

[goodNumber10]

Genuine question:
What would the All Blacks do if, after the Haka, the opposition start singing their anthem again? Not with the band, and singer, etc. but the 23 players (plus however many in the crowd).

I reckon it cause serious issues, like Johnsons crew in 2003 when they wouldn't move from the side they were already on.

 

[Pedro]

The Haka would be a great way to start a game if the other team has a reciprocal war dance. They should go head to head, move for move and get everyone revved right up! These war dances must be reviewed before performance to ensure respect is foremost. We can't have effigies hung or torched, for example. It seems ridiculous that only one team does the war dance...yet it could be a big plus to the sport if both teams were required to have a dance.

 

[Feicarsinn]

The Haka would be a great way to start a game if the other team has a reciprocal war dance. They should go head to head, move for move and get everyone revved right up! These war dances must be reviewed before performance to ensure respect is foremost. We can't have effigies hung or torched, for example. It seems ridiculous that only one team does the war dance...yet it could be a big plus to the sport if both teams were required to have a dance.

 

[dasNdanger]

[video=youtube;uq-v1TTUyhM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uq-v1TTUyhM

That's a bit harsh.

The Haka would be a great way to start a game if the other team has a reciprocal war dance. They should go head to head, move for move and get everyone revved right up! These war dances must be reviewed before performance to ensure respect is foremost. We can't have effigies hung or torched, for example. It seems ridiculous that only one team does the war dance...yet it could be a big plus to the sport if both teams were required to have a dance.

Some teams - specifically the Pacific Islanders - already have their own 'hakas'. Many countries, however, don't have a 'war dance', per se. Sure, Native Americans/First People have chants and dances, but it would be considered disrespectful for non-Native peoples to perform them for a sporting event. And then what are the Irish going to do? Riverdance? So, while some teams may be able to put on a display equivalent to the haka, most cannot.

As this discussion goes round and round, I can't see any perfect solution. Bottom line for me is that I see nothing wrong with the other team advancing on the ABs, as long as they don't get up in their faces. It's really the only thing that every team can do, and that isn't disrespectful (to me advancing during the haka is a sign of accepting the challenge).



das

 

[ENZED-88]

The Haka would be a great way to start a game if the other team has a reciprocal war dance. They should go head to head, move for move and get everyone revved right up! These war dances must be reviewed before performance to ensure respect is foremost. We can't have effigies hung or torched, for example. It seems ridiculous that only one team does the war dance...yet it could be a big plus to the sport if both teams were required to have a dance.

Would love to see the pumas tango before kick off.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

Would love to see the pumas tango before kick off.

That's nothing, England morris dancing would be a sight to see.

 

[dasNdanger]

That's nothing, England morris dancing would be a sight to see.

I agree...

Next time NZ plays England, England should counter with their team performing a Morris dance. That'll shut the haka naysayers up REAL quick.

das

das

 

[Shaggy]

Genuine question:
What would the All Blacks do if, after the Haka, the opposition start singing their anthem again? Not with the band, and singer, etc. but the 23 players (plus however many in the crowd).

Probably what they have done when the Australian side sung Waltzing Matilda, the English sing Swing low sweet Chariot, and the Welsh sing .,. Play Rugby

 

[thechosenfamily]

That's nothing, England morris dancing would be a sight to see.

Making sure Nonu got a good slap upside the head by the fool carrying the pigs bladder

That would get him at it

 

[flashash2k9]

1st time they did it, Wales challenged them with the national anthem.

 

[petite]

I would love to see the irish performing the lord of the dance as a challenge!

 

[TRF_heineken]

Genuine question:
What would the All Blacks do if, after the Haka, the opposition start singing their anthem again? Not with the band, and singer, etc. but the 23 players (plus however many in the crowd).

Well I think it has to be but in context with the Haka. The Haka is a challenge given to the other team. Singing "God save our gracious Queen" isn't really a challenging anthem.

If the other teams developed some sort of challenge ritual, I can't see the problem with it, and neither should the AB's.

I have been thinking, what would happen if the opposing team went into a huddle after the Haka, and said a prayer together? It could be used to "accept" the challenge and to ask God to bless them in their upcoming battle.

There's a lot of players who say a prayer just before kick-off, how would this be different?

 

[nickdnz]

It could be used to "accept" the challenge and to ask God to bless them in their upcoming battle.

There's a lot of players who say a prayer just before kick-off, how would this be different?

Because religion shouldn't be pressured upon players. Although it would certainly add an amusing sense of irony to Sunday games.

I can't help but feel that this thread - coming up with solutions to 'the haka' - sort of misses the point. Rugby is a game born in England, for most international matches between the UK, South Africa and the Pacific Islands the referees speak exclusively in English, the broadcasting of sport originates in England, the fact that national anthems are even sung in rugby matches is due to a Welsh response to the haka in 1905 - and has subsequently been practised by every national team pre-game. If any UK person cannot see the profound cultural impression that they have had on international rugby then they must be blind. With all this it is baffling that there is such resistance of other cultures practices in rugby to the point that there must be further UK representation - even if it requires re-purposing historical cultural practices to make a response. How about instead of challenging the haka, it is mandatory that Queen Elizabeth takes all kicks at goals? If responses are going to be arbitrary and contrived, they may as well at least be ridiculous.

 

[TRF_heineken]

Because religion shouldn't be pressured upon players. Although it would certainly add an amusing sense of irony to Sunday games.

I can't help but feel that this thread - coming up with solutions to 'the haka' - sort of misses the point. Rugby is a game born in England, for most international matches between the UK, South Africa and the Pacific Islands the referees speak exclusively in English, the broadcasting of sport originates in England, the fact that national anthems are even sung in rugby matches is due to a Welsh response to the haka in 1905 - and has subsequently been practised by every national team pre-game. If any UK person cannot see the profound cultural impression that they have had on international rugby then they must be blind. With all this it is baffling that there is such resistance of other cultures practices in rugby to the point that there must be further UK representation - even if it requires re-purposing historical cultural practices to make a response. How about instead of challenging the haka, it is mandatory that Queen Elizabeth takes all kicks at goals? If responses are going to be arbitrary and contrived, they may as well at least be ridiculous.

Be careful now Nick. Isn't the point some are trying to make here that the Haka shouldn't be pressured upon players?

Look, I've said it many times, I love the Haka, I don't want it gone, and if there is going to be a vote on it. I'll vote for it, and I'll bring a hell of a lot of Saffas along who would vote that it should stay.

Maybe this thread has run its course?

 

[Feicarsinn]

Threads run their course when people want to stop discussing the topic. No point closing it and having another one cropping up in another couple of months eh?

 

[nickdnz]

Be careful now Nick. Isn't the point some are trying to make here that the Haka shouldn't be pressured upon players?

Look, I've said it many times, I love the Haka, I don't want it gone, and if there is going to be a vote on it. I'll vote for it, and I'll bring a hell of a lot of Saffas along who would vote that it should stay.

Maybe this thread has run its course?

I'm not aware that is an argument at all. I haven't heard any criticism of it from any New Zealander (who are the ones performing the haka).

People should be asked to show respect to everyone's culture, however I don't believe they should be forced to perform religious practices that they don't believe. It's pretty offensive to make that compulsory.

It's nice that you like it - but again it's sort of not the point. It shouldn't matter what anyone who isn't from New Zealand thinks of it, as it's not their culture (one could argue that it's not even all of New Zealanders culture, but is used to represent a proportion of its society). Providing its not against the laws of the host country, shouldn't any cultural practices in general be respected, whether it is of interest or not? If I am completely honest I could quite happily do without the haka as I've seen it 100 times and its certainly be commodified. I just find it bizarre that anyone who doesn't find it a part of their culture would rally against its practice. If it's not for you, go make a cup of tea in the 30 extra seconds it takes from your life...

 

[Tony Manx]

If it's not for you, go make a cup of tea in the 30 extra seconds it takes from your life...

Totally agree with that!

 

[nickdnz]

On a totally unrelated note: I was walking down Cuba Street the other day when I heard an indigenous Australian busker playing the didgeridoo. As you can imagine I was outraged. I wrote a letter of complaint immediately to the city council. First of all he was situated closest to the 'bucket-fountain' which gets the most foot-traffic. Why should his cultural practice be advantaged over our local buskers? In our host country nonetheless! At first I thought the best response was to grab a bunch of my mates, around 100 of them, and start singing boisterously over the top of the guy the 'Chesdale Cheese' song. As a spurious expert on aboriginal culture I decided heckling was the intended response. However this just created a bigger crowd who gave him money. If the city council won't ban the busker outright, there needs to be some guidelines set in place. Firstly, during the didgereedo performance there must be a simultaneous busker performing 'The Exponents: Why Does Love Do This To Me'. An alternative is to organize a prayer group in the surrounding area. Indigenous Australian practices are so prevalent in everyday New Zealand culture it must be resisted, for the obvious disadvantages it brings upon the other buskers in Cuba Street.

 

[goodNumber10]

7/10, would read again.

 

[Feicarsinn]

On a totally unrelated note: I was walking down Cuba Street the other day when I heard an indigenous Australian busker playing the didgeridoo. As you can imagine I was outraged. I wrote a letter of complaint immediately to the city council. First of all he was situated closest to the 'bucket-fountain' which gets the most foot-traffic. Why should his cultural practice be advantaged over our local buskers? In our host country nonetheless! At first I thought the best response was to grab a bunch of my mates, around 100 of them, and start singing boisterously over the top of the guy the 'Chesdale Cheese' song. As a spurious expert on aboriginal culture I decided heckling was the intended response. However this just created a bigger crowd who gave him money. If the city council won't ban the busker outright, there needs to be some guidelines set in place. Firstly, during the didgereedo performance there must be a simultaneous busker performing 'The Exponents: Why Does Love Do This To Me'. An alternative is to organize a prayer group in the surrounding area. Indigenous Australian practices are so prevalent in everyday New Zealand culture it must be resisted, for the obvious disadvantages it brings upon the other buskers in Cuba Street.

Gr8 strawman m8.