[November Tests 2017 EOYT] Ireland vs. South Africa (11/11/2017)

[munstermuffin]

Relaxed?!?

Unless your running around like this:

Who knows what those crazy Yanks would get up to next!

Ha ha here it all modernised. Trump said he will look after us.
On a side note got to meet A Rod too. That guy might actually have made a Solid 6 in his day .

 

[AM_Bokke]

Oh man! I am excited.

I think Ireland are 65% percent favorites. If this match were later in the tour I would give the Boks basically zero chance but since it's the first one I think that their greater continuity playing together will help them against it being Ireland's first game in awhile. I am mildly worried about the Boks getting psyched out, BUT playing with great expectations on their shoulders is just what it means to be a Springbok.

Honestly, how many points are Ireland going to score? I think that the Boks can easily score 20-25 points. Ireland needs to score more. Will they? I say 65% yes, but 35% no. Ireland are a low scoring team.

 

[AM_Bokke]

We need to win most of our games on this tour to prove that we are actually improving as AC has time to implement his ideas along with his assistants. Ireland will probably be the most difficult of all the teams we face on this tour.
I cant see us being beaten by the French (who we destroyed earlier in the year), Wales or Italy. And even though i also did not expect us to lose against Italy last year you kind of hope that was an anomaly.
We don't have aspirations to just be a top 6 or top 5 team. So it a non negotiable that the expectations are to beat every team on this tour as Wales and Ireland are competing with us for rankings spots (largely symbolic now after WC draw) . We simply need to beat our direct rivals otherwise we are getting nowhere. Anything more than one loss would be a complete failure.

More than winning I think that we need to see each player playing better. Ireland is the biggest game of the tour for me. They are the best team that we are playing and I expect the best players to play. I expect the best Boks to beat basically everyone.

I am OK with Italy and Wales being more experimental. If we lose, but players like Bosch, Am, Gelant, Botha, Cassiem, Mahoje play well then I am OK with that.

France is somewhere in the middle between Ireland and Italy/Wales.

All that said, AC will be in deep doodoo if we don't win two games.

 

[Leinster Fan]

Rob Kearney has been a great servant for Leinster and Ireland for years but I'd be disappointed if he started tomorrow. Even if he's our best full back now (I don't know but Schmidt seems to think he is) he definitely won't be in two years. Better to give Carbery a chance to get some international GamePro time under his belt.

I don't think CJ's form justifies him starting and given SOB's performance at 8 against Ulster I be tempted to pick him there on Sunday.

I'd also like McCloskey to get a chance.

1. McGrath
2. Best (c)
3. Furlong
4. Toner
5. Henderson
6. O'Mahony
7. Leavy
8. O'Brien

9. Murray
10. Sexton
11. Stockdale
12. McCloskey
13. Henshaw
14. Earls
15. Carbery

16. Scannel
17. Healy
18. Ryan
19. Ryan
20. Stander/Ruddock
21. McGrath/Marmion
22. Keatley? (In an ideal scenario this remains unused or we could put in a FB and move Carbery to 10 if Sexton comes off)
23. Conway

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Oi ... Oi, I can't wait for this!

Full bill of health with only Treadwell, en route from SA, not training being reported.

I'd like to see Carbery, Stockdale, Henshaw, McCloskey, Earls, Sexo, Murray, CJ, SOB, Ruddock, Hendo, Toner, Furlo, Best, Healo

Tracey, McGarth-o, Ryan, Ryan, POM, McGarth, Aki, Conway

Wouldn't want Keatley near the team, he's grand at pro 14 and has his moments in Europe but even with lack of match fitness in the position Carbery is the better option with an eye to the next world cup in an experimental team, which it becomes without Sexton or PJ.

 

[Groundhog]

I don't know about starting McCloskey at 12, I think Aki has more variety to his game and can free players around him, while McCloskey is good for offloading out of contact I don't think he has the ability Aki does, but he's a great option to have.
My only worry is Aki goes lone wolf like he has to for Connacht sometimes. He'll be surrounded by quality here and needs to fall in line a bit more than anyone has to with Connacht.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Stu Mac is in beefier form though and neither have any real experience at this level.

Anyway, Allister Coetzee insulted Ireland by saying we're the "All Blacks of Europe", try All Blacks of the world Allister, try that.

I'm kind of fearing a loss here, I don't really know why because my head tells me we should be stronger in the front row, back row, halfbacks and have parity at the very least in the rest of the back line but I have a bad feeling which I never normally get. Head is saying Ireland to win reasonably comfortably, gut saying SA by 2, heart saying I'll be mad drunk regardless!

 

[Diomedes]

I'm kind of fearing a loss here, I don't really know why because my head tells me we should be stronger in the front row, back row, halfbacks and have parity at the very least in the rest of the back line but I have a bad feeling which I never normally get. Head is saying Ireland to win reasonably comfortably, gut saying SA by 2, heart saying I'll be mad drunk regardless!

I feel the same way for some reason...an inquantifiable feeling deep in my gut foreshadowing disappointment...no idea why - almost like the sum of this team will be less its parts. The backrow looks much better on paper than I think it'll actually be (POM and Stander have been off pace IMO), I've still a lingering worry over Sexton (I know he wasn't named in the injury report but these things are often not the full truth) and then some uncertainty over the centres and our hookers - I think it's some combination of these factors dampening my comfidence.

 

[SomeOke]

Just to further add to your worries I don't think you have us in the front row either, Coenie Oosthuizen has had the season of his life, really improving his scrummaging in an already strong game around the park. Marx is a monster, I'd back him against just about any hooker in world rugby at the moment. That said your back row and your entire back line is basically man for man better.

You should absolutely have this! I'd say intellectually Ireland have got this sown up, but I do think we have a reasonable chance.

So jacked for the game!

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Just to further add to your worries I don't think you have us in the front row either, Coenie Oosthuizen has had the season of his life, really improving his scrummaging in an already strong game around the park. Marx is a monster, I'd back him against just about any hooker in world rugby at the moment. That said your back row and your entire back line is basically man for man better.

You should absolutely have this! I'd say intellectually Ireland have got this sown up, but I do think we have a reasonable chance.

So jacked for the game!

I'd definitely give you Marx, he's fantastic, but Cian Healy is back to near his best, Jack McGrath is as good as ever and Furlong is the best 3 in the world for me while Rory Best is far from a slouch. I don't think there's a front row in the world as good as Ireland's to be honest and all of our props have at one point in their career been the world's best in my biased opinion!

 

[SomeOke]

I'd definitely give you Marx, he's fantastic, but Cian Healy is back to near his best, Jack McGrath is as good as ever and Furlong is the best 3 in the world for me while Rory Best is far from a slouch. I don't think there's a front row in the world as good as Ireland's to be honest and all of our props have at one point in their career been the world's best in my biased opinion!

OK fair, that's more a reflection on my lack of knowledge of Irish rugby than anything else. I can only make assumptions about how good you guys are.
Beast and Coenie are great players in serious form but shy of being the best in the world. Our up and comers (Kitsoff and Louw) could get there one day though but they still need a fair bit of seasoning.

In that case as I said it's hard to see a way in!

Talk is Handre Pollard will start which is a small improvement for me, but he's probably 2 years of consistent rugby away from being world class. Hopefully we can pick up wins in the other three. Perhaps this is just a game to show some pride and put up a decent performance, score some points and get within a reasonable margin.

 

[Caitlyn Jenner]

I find it hard to split these teams, so I'm calling a draw!

 

[MikeTheNative]

I think Ireland at home will be too strong for SA although I don't think it will be by anymore than 10.

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

I think Ireland at home will be too strong for SA although I don't think it will be by anymore than 10.

Pretty much my feeling until we see selections. Ireland aren't built to win handsomely. But they are built to win.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

If the SA that nearly beat NZ turn up then they can definitely take it.

 

[Leonormous Boozer]

Leavy, Conan and O'Donnell all carrying knocks, presumably after the only heavy contact session of the weak so we should be ok elsewhere fortunately as of those three only Conan had a crack at starting.

I feel the same way for some reason...an inquantifiable feeling deep in my gut foreshadowing disappointment...no idea why - almost like the sum of this team will be less its parts. The backrow looks much better on paper than I think it'll actually be (POM and Stander have been off pace IMO), I've still a lingering worry over Sexton (I know he wasn't named in the injury report but these things are often not the full truth) and then some uncertainty over the centres and our hookers - I think it's some combination of these factors dampening my comfidence.

I definitely agree regarding the centres, regardless of who we play the wings won't get brought into the game much unless JC is at 15, Henshaw will hopefully step up and be even better from Cap 30 onward but he has had his struggles defending the 13 channel. (Does a South African poster want to give me a bit of info on your centres, I didn't pay attention to them in the RC games I watched and just remember how much they struggled in the 1st test in 2016, the only one I could watch) From what I can tell the Sexton rumour came from some nobody on Boards and had no credibility so we should be sound there. My biggest worry is just not turning up, which isn't a characteristic of Schmidt sides in Dublin, at a guess its the hype, I'm too familiar with expecting big things from Ireland sides and watching them under perform (6n this year) or have their previously unnoticed weakness exploited to oblivion (Those damn Argentinians) so I'm weary of that! All that said, losing this would be as disastrous as Scotland this year, I think it could be reasonably argued that beating Ireland in Dublin is as hard as beating NZ outside of NZ and is the third biggest challenge in rugby after NZ in NZ and England in Twickenham so a side that has only won a single away game since the RWC, against Argentina, should be swatted aside with relative ease.

 

[munstermuffin]

Conan is fine. Was rested due to workload.
On Sexton he has been pictured training and seems fine. Add in there in no report of him injured so as Alpha said think it's just a rumour with no legs.

Can't say I share the cautious mind. I think 10 points minimum we will win. And it pains me to say that a bit but this isn't a great SA team. Building and improving yes but they're still on that journey. It's 2 teams at different stages on that path and the stronger team is at home, fresher and prepared

 

[SomeOke]

I think 10 points minimum we will win.

Triggered.
Bokke by 20.
Your fields to be sown with the tears of the fallen.

 

[munstermuffin]

Triggered.
Bokke by 20.
Your fields to be sown with the tears of the fallen.

It won't bothèr me either way regards result. Have lost a bit of love for internationals but can't see it. Boks are improving but not there yet

 

[User1245]

If I was a betting man I'd put money on Ireland to win.

I hope we take the win because then some pressure will be taken off so AC will feel comfortable experimenting with the uncapped players. I'd be bitterly disappointed if Am and Gelant don't get a decent run on tour. Getting beaten by Ireland might derail this.