Life after Eddie …

[BrokenWing]

Congrats on the RWC win. (I should really block this man but his brand of bullshit is so intriguing!)

I'm fairly sure he said they'd win the last one too.

 

[ncurd]

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And Slade at FB.

Look gentleman Halloween was over a month a go its winter solstice time now and this is only supposed to bring us joy!

 

[Scotty]

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And Slade at FB.

I do not want slade at FB, that said playing out of position he played well there, but going forward with a squade that has Steward, Freeman and Arundell in it he shouldnt be playing there.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Telegraph saying RFU to pay 200k for Borthwick to be released. (Could've waited till end of season and got him for free lol)
Sinfield, Walters and Wigglesworth also to be brought out early

So tigers will have no coaches but decent wedge and the RFU are spending a lot of money that they don't have just to give a head coach an extra 4 months, instead of investing all this early buy outs into you know other areas and keeping Eddie for 8 months

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Isn't Wigglesworth still technically a player?

So the England setup will just be the Tigers lot with one, or both, of Proudfoot/Dick Cock as forwards coach?
Hmm

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Isn't Wigglesworth still technically a player?

So the England setup will just be the Tigers lot with one, or both, of Proudfoot/Dick Cock as forwards coach?
Hmm

Wig is a player coach.
He's down on the coaching team page at Tigers as backs.

Could see Cockers staying and becoming scrum coach

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Wig is a player coach.

Be mad if England's backs coach is turning out for Tigers in the off week in the 6N because their 1st and 2nd choice 9s are in camp

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Be mad if England's backs coach is turning out for Tigers in the off week in the 6N because their 1st and 2nd choice 9s are in camp

He'll leave full time I guess.

 

[McTallshort]

Just a thought. England's abject performance against the Boks was almost entirely down the poor performance of the forwards. Now the forwards coach is in charge.

I'm certainly not against the sacking of Jones, to be honest with 20/20 hindsight he should have left after the 2019 WC but if you are going to sack someone at least have a plausible back up plan and Cockers isn't a back up plan. It was his area of responsibility that was the problem so I'm not sure what he's going to achieve by taking full responsibility.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

have to say, it does feel weird someone getting the sack when they have the highest win percent of any coach

fozzie has our worst record in 30 years and can do no wrong apparently

 

[TRF_Olyy]

have to say, it does feel weird someone getting the sack when they have the highest win percent of any coach

While technically true, the first world cup cycle does a lot of heavy lifting in that
"He had a record equalling win streak!" - sure, but 5-6yrs ago
He's also went 1-3-1in our last 5 vs Scotland, gotten our worst 6N results, broke some records for worst 6N performances (think he's bagged lowest tries scored and worst points difference?) and lost to Argentina for the first time in over a decade

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

have to say, it does feel weird someone getting the sack when they have the highest win percent of any coach

fozzie has our worst record in 30 years and can do no wrong apparently

Eddie pre and post WC are two very different beasts. A lot of his wins post WC have been fluke and with sore England performances.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

yeah, fair, of course, you just know these things get simplified over time and both cases will look weird down the track looking back

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Tigers apparently not letting Walters and Sinfield go

 

[ncurd]

have to say, it does feel weird someone getting the sack when they have the highest win percent of any coach

fozzie has our worst record in 30 years and can do no wrong apparently

Because this year was a 42% win rate and last year was 62.5% (and that included a game against Tonga).

You have to remember first year in charge he had a a huge winning streak so it take time to knock the percentages back to something more modest.

Woodward built to his 72%, Eddie fell to his 73. Woodward had 3 six nations just like Eddies and equal amount world cups. EJ had 7 six nations, Woodward 6. On of those guys won their World Cup final.

Not saying Woodward was brilliant but Eddies most winningness coach is the story of his first 4 years. Not that the last 3.

 

[Ragey Erasmus]

have to say, it does feel weird someone getting the sack when they have the highest win percent of any coach

fozzie has our worst record in 30 years and can do no wrong apparently

Jones record is very heavily skewed by his first 4 years, particularly his first 2. I did a bit of number crunching. This is Jones' win % against T1 opposition in the seasons following the WC:

2019-2020 80%
2020-2021 63%
2021-2022 55%
2022 - Current 0%

Admittedly only 4 games into 2022 but that is a clear downward trend. Considering 2018 was also terrible, it seems 2019 was the exception, not the rule. England have been in decline for 4 years now and absolutely nothing suggested Jones was going to reverse that. Couple that with Jones also having to his name the record worst 6N performance by England, the worst points difference in the 6N ever by England, worst points conceded against Scotland, Wales, France and some other negative records, he is dragging England down. The Joe Schmidt cards up sleeve defence doesn't fly, keeping some thing secret doesn't involve putting in abysmal performances. Jones was done, he should have gone over a year ago.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Honestly I would be massively happy if Eddie takes over SCW spot in punditry ****

 

[ncurd]

While technically true, the first world cup cycle does a lot of heavy lifting in that
"He had a record equalling win streak!" - sure, but 5-6yrs ago
He's also went 1-3-1in our last 5 vs Scotland, gotten our worst 6N results, broke some records for worst 6N performances (think he's bagged lowest tries scored and worst points difference?) and lost to Argentina for the first time in over a decade

The Scotland results are worse when you consider he got the dubious honour of loosing our winning home streak to Scotland last year. 37 years...

That's like being the coach if Wales beat NZ

 

[Jimbo]

Genuinely think there is a lot of him losing the dressing room, just getting England players to enjoy their rugby will be a huge step in the right direction, anything feels like it could be a huge improvement, if England play boring rugby but win convincingly I can cope, if they play some slightly more expansive risky rugby as a fan I can cope with it what I can't cope with is headless clueless rudderless losses that are boring as hell. Recent form apparently plays no part in selections it's telling that Daly hasn't had any recent involvement with England but is playing some of his best stuff in recent memory (appreciate some of that is at 13).

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Not sure which paper it's in but I've just seen excerpts from an article and it says that he's completely lost the changing room and that's why he's gone - senior players had raised concerns about the way he treats staff and fringe players, including one time where he berated Max Malins so much that he cried and then dropped him from the squad

Edit
The Times:

archive.ph

The other coaches have also been pulled in for reviews - wonder if that means Proudfoot is gone too. Our scrum has gone backwards over the past few seasons (both metaphorically and literally)