[EOYT] England vs. Australia 02/11/13

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Scrum-half/ fly-half: Ben Youngs and Farrell. Questions over Youngs, and the alternative is Lee Dickson. I haven't seen him play for Northampton this season, but can't get the image of previous times I've seen him play for England having his damn foot on the ball at the bottom of each ruck, looking round and assessing his options and slowing everything down. I hope he was eradicated this from his game.

Thats the exact opposite, Dickson gives quick ball consistently, he is much better at the SH basics than Youngs and Care. His problem in the past was that he offers very little running threat which Care and Youngs did.
This season however Dickson has been in the form of his life, making breaks and doing all the basics to a very high standard.

It would be criminal to start Youngs after his awful form compared to Dickson who is playing better in every single way.

 

[Wasps For Life]

I can see why you d think Dickson would be good but I honestly can be arsed with him waiting around the rucks for ages!

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Is Hartley really that strong of a scrummager, though? Even in a dominant scrum he always pops up first. If we wanted the strongest scrummager then we should look at the newly-called-up Webber. Won't happen, though.

Yes, I think Hartley is a stronger scrummager than Tom Youngs. With Mako in the side, he will make up for Tom's carrying ability in the loose. In the second Lions test we had Mako, Youngs and Adam Jones (who is a stronger scrummager than Cole) and the Wallabies front row managed to get parity with the Lions. It was a different story in the first test ( before the front row was replaced) where Corbs superior scrummaging helped make up for Tom Youngs' deficiency in this area. I'm just not convinced with a front row of Mako, Youngs and Cole; especially with Parling and another (Launcbury, Lawes or Attwood) as the locks behind. At least with the Lions we had AWJ at 19 stone locking behind Adam Jones. I'm not sure our other 3 locks have the necessary grunt in the scrum compared to AWJ.

I'd be happy to see Dickson start. I, too, have horrible memories of him spending 15-20minutes at the base of the ruck, but luckily they brought in the 5s rule just after (coincidence? ) and he's been on fire this season for Saints. Flip a coin for Youngs/Care on the bench, there's not a lot between them at the moment to be honest.

Ah yes forgot about the 5 second rule. Well in that case whoever combines best with Farrell and as long as whoever is scrum half gets to the rucks quickly and delivers quick, quality ball to our backs.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I think that says more about Mako's poor scrummaging, than it does Youngs, to be honest.
I'm not trying to say that Youngs is an amazing scrummaging hooker, just that Hartley isn't noticeably better (imo).

 

[ratsapprentice]

I'm not sure our other 3 locks have the necessary grunt in the scrum compared to AWJ.

Attwood and Wilson make an extremely strong scrummaging pair.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

So likely Australian team to face England?

1. Slipper
2. Moore
3. Alexander
4. Simmons
5. Horwill
6. Fardy
7. Hooper
8. Mowen

9. Genia
10. Cooper
11. Tomane
12. Leali'ifano
13. Kuridrani
14. Ashley-Cooper
15. Folau

16. Polota-Nau
17. Robinson
18. Kepu
19. Timani
20. McCalman
21. White
22. Toomua
23. Foley/Cummins

 

[Wasps For Life]

Kuridrani who's he??

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Kuridrani who's he??

http://www.brumbies.com.au/Team/PlayerProfile/tabid/1208/playerid/44/Default.aspx

Played for the ACT Brumbies against the Lions IN June and scored a try. He's been pretty decent at 13 for the Wallabies in the last 3 games.

 

[lynam1104]

Kuridrani who's he??

Kuridrani has been playing 13 for Aus for the last 2 or 3 tests and doing a bloody good job of it. Provides a big physical presences in a fairly light weight back line . Had a very good game against the AB's two weeks ago.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

Australia: 15 Israel Folau, 14 Adam Ashley-Cooper, 13 Tevita Kuridrani, 12 Matt Toomua, 11 Nick Cummins, 10 Quade Cooper, 9 Will Genia, 8 Ben Mowen (c), 7 Michael Hooper, 6 Scott Fardy, 5 James Horwill, 4 Sitaleki Timani, 3 Ben Alexander, 2 Stephen Moore, 1 James Slipper.

Replacements: 16 Saia Faingaa, 17 Benn Robinson, 18 Sepoke Kepu, 19 Kane Douglas, 20 Ben McCalman, 21 Nic White, 22 Christian Lealiifano, 23 Bernard Foley

Horwill axed as captain but retains place because Simmons is injured. Mowen captains the Wallabies.

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,16024_9000239,00.html

 

[Peat]

Ah yes forgot about the 5 second rule. Well in that case whoever combines best with Farrell and as long as whoever is scrum half gets to the rucks quickly and delivers quick, quality ball to our backs.

You want to poach a Kiwi? Good call.

Lee Dickson is the only scrum-half I've seen pinged for taking longer than 5 seconds. He slows the pace of the game to an agonising crawl at times. He's quick when he decides to be, but not wonderfully accurate. People will say he's in the best form, I'd say he's behind the best pack. Unfortunately, Youngs is erratic as anything, while Danny Care manages to combine being the best club scrum-half in England with very patchy international form. Sooooo...

Yeah, lets poach some Kiwis or Saffas.

p.s. If Hartley is a stronger scrummager than Youngs, it means Youngs is actively awful.

 

[Patchey]

When was the last time England had a stand out, world class nine whose form didn't swing about like a yoyo?

 

[Bada-Bing!]

You want to poach a Kiwi? Good call.

Lee Dickson is the only scrum-half I've seen pinged for taking longer than 5 seconds. He slows the pace of the game to an agonising crawl at times. He's quick when he decides to be, but not wonderfully accurate. People will say he's in the best form, I'd say he's behind the best pack. Unfortunately, Youngs is erratic as anything, while Danny Care manages to combine being the best club scrum-half in England with very patchy international form. Sooooo...

Yeah, lets poach some Kiwis or Saffas.

p.s. If Hartley is a stronger scrummager than Youngs, it means Youngs is actively awful.

Neither are a Bismark Du Plessis in the scrum, but yes I think Hartley is stronger in the set piece than Youngs. That's probably because Hartley is bigger and the old adage of a good big 'un beats a good small 'un applies here. It will not help that Corbs is injured on Saturday, which will diminish England's scrum.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Now that you "have" to took again, being shorter is actually an advantage.

 

[Patchey]

Whihc makes it even more baffling as to why stumpy Youngs doesn't hook...

 

[TRF_Cymro]

Starting XV: 15 Mike Brown, 14 Chris Ashton, 13 Joel Tomkins, 12 Billy Twelvetrees, 11 Marland Yarde, 10 Owen Farrell, 9 Lee Dickson, 1 Mako Vunipola, 2 Tom Youngs, 3 Dan Cole, 4 Joe Launchbury, 5 Courtney Lawes, 6 Tom Wood, 7 Chris Robshaw (c), 8 Billy Vunipola.
Replacements: 16 Dylan Hartley, 17 Joe Marler, 18 David Wilson, 19 Dave Attwood, 20 Ben Morgan, 21 Ben Youngs, 22 Toby Flood, 23 Ben Foden.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Not happy with lawes starting, but c'est la vie.
We're gonna have a poo lineout with none of Parling, Croft or Attwood there.
Excited to see Binny start, though. He could well monster Mowen, if the latter performs as poorly as he has in big games this season.

 

[Patchey]

Agree with Olyy, we don't have a line out leader in the starting XV and that is a big issue. Does look like the pack will be incredibly dynamic in the loose though, possibly a hangover from our thumping by the Welsh back row in Cardiff. Thats fine as long as A) Binny carries well B) The scrum is stable with two relatively light second rows.

 

[ratsapprentice]

Could be a very long day at the office for the front row.

I am excited to see the Attwood/Wilson scrummaging combo off the bench though.
It's the strongest TH combo we have by a considerable distance IMO.

 

[Crapspray]

I'll trust that Rowntree's confidence is well placed in a Lawes-run lineout. There's no doubt in his form elsewhere on the pitch.

If only we had Corbs and Parling; we could have really attacked the Wallaby scrum and tried to do a third test on them. Hopefully the comparatively big back row will compensate for the weaker locks and loosehead.