England 2021/22

[BPM]

Feels way more like a real solution as opposed to a stop gap.

Needs to cut out the silly yellows though …

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Needs to cut out the silly yellows though …

Agreed, one yellow in 36 caps is an unacceptable rate IMO


Edit: Or 3 yellows in 83 club games, never more than one in a season

 

[BPM]

Maybe I should have said penalties …

 

[ncurd]

Maybe I should have said penalties …

Do we have a forward who doesn't do this?

 

[BPM]

Different when you're the captain though. It wouldn't be a good look if a fair chunk of your dialogue with the ref is about your own infringements!

I'm a massive fan of Curry but I didn't think he was great in the AIs or the Lions tour and gave away some poor penalties. Hopefully he's got that out of his system.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

I'm a massive fan of Curry but I didn't think he was great in the AIs

He was quieter at 8 when asked to play a different role, but whenever he shifted back to 7 he was standout
Against SA he made the most tackles of any player (more than Underhill/Lawes combined, and more than the entire SA backrow combined) and won the most turnovers too

 

[Crash Hamster]

Smith ought to be, but Ford's presence complicates things, particularly if the weather lends itself to more of a kicking game.

I've seen absolutely nothing to suggest that Smith can't kick and plenty to suggest that he can. Indeed, Ford's recent propensity to kick it away (when keeping it in hand might have been more productive) has seen Tigers run close in Europe and lose to Wasps, both in games which they've dominated.

Quins, however, keep winning games at the death, generally involving the skills of one M. Smith.

As I've said before, I can see the danger of England dominating a game for 65 minutes then the result being within 3 points either way.

 

[Goodey]

Think Daly is a perfectly sensible call up considering Lawes and May are two of the most experienced players in a side that doesn't have a lot.

Lawes is a frustrating injury as 6 was probably the least covered spot in the squad and we have had to replace him with a second row. I wonder if it means that Chessum will get a bench gig since EJ has compared him to Lawes in the media.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

The Scottish back three is pretty good and I'm not sure throwing OHC in to a debut test at Murrayfield is a good idea - even more so if the conditions are poor. I don't think he's likely to be able to play to his strengths and the weaker aspects of his game would be exposed.

While I'd much prefer to see Marchant at 13, but I wouldn't be that surprised to see him used out wide - he's defensively excellent and is handy under the high ball.

Assuming he's not used on the wing, I'm curious as to why would you prefer Atkinson over Marchant? Atkinson offers size and is a similar kind of 12 to what Smith is used to at Quins. However, I think in all other respects, Marchant is a far superior player who has always looked good when he's had chances with England.

OHC would definitely be a risk but one worth taking. We're also now at the stage of balancing immediate results with half an eye on the RWC - I can't see Daly or Nowell starting on the wing in Fra but OHC just might be. And we'll learn far more about him in a game like this than scooting around in space v Ita.

Ref Atkinson, mainly balance - Slade and Marchant are great in open field but give little oomph in heavy traffic. And Slade v SA notwithstanding they're both fundamentally 13s. And as you say, Smith's used to a big 12 - if that's what brings out the best in him, why would you give him a different set up when he's stepping up a level?

 

[BPM]

Think Daly is a perfectly sensible call up considering Lawes and May are two of the most experienced players in a side that doesn't have a lot.

Lawes is a frustrating injury as 6 was probably the least covered spot in the squad and we have had to replace him with a second row. I wonder if it means that Chessum will get a bench gig since EJ has compared him to Lawes in the media.

Lawes is completing return to play protocols this week. I would fully expect him to be back next week and fit for Scotland.

 

[BPM]

OHC would definitely be a risk but one worth taking. We're also now at the stage of balancing immediate results with half an eye on the RWC - I can't see Daly or Nowell starting on the wing in Fra but OHC just might be. And we'll learn far more about him in a game like this than scooting around in space v Ita.

Ref Atkinson, mainly balance - Slade and Marchant are great in open field but give little oomph in heavy traffic. And Slade v SA notwithstanding they're both fundamentally 13s. And as you say, Smith's used to a big 12 - if that's what brings out the best in him, why would you give him a different set up when he's stepping up a level?

Ideally I would give him a similar set up, but doing so with a significantly inferior player (Atkinson is a long way off Esterhuizen IMO) is arguably counter-productive. Aside from being big, I'm just not convinced Atkinson is good enough to be a starter for England.

 

[Geordie]

Id actually prefer Sam Simmonds at 12 over Atkinson. i think he'd be more dynamic in that 12 role. Not sure his handling etc are up for the job though.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Id actually prefer Sam Simmonds at 12 over Atkinson. i think he'd be more dynamic in that 12 role. Not sure his handling etc are up for the job though.

Our of all the stupid crazy Eddie Jones tactics, I wouldn't hate to see this trialed off the bench at some point, but at the same time it makes me sick that we don't have a stand out 12 still.

 

[Duck a l'Orange]

Our of all the stupid crazy Eddie Jones tactics, I wouldn't hate to see this trialed off the bench at some point, but at the same time it makes me sick that we don't have a stand out 12 still.

Letting Johnny Williams go to Wales was a mistake.

*Smug Falcons fan noises*

 

[Which Tyler]

Our of all the stupid crazy Eddie Jones tactics, I wouldn't hate to see this trialed off the bench at some point, but at the same time it makes me sick that we don't have a stand out 12 still.

We've had a couple - we just keep giving them to the Celts so that St Owen doesn't get stressed.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Letting Johnny Williams go to Wales was a mistake.

*Smug Falcons fan noises*

Redpath wanted to play for England until EJ dropped him from the EPS and Scotland swept in, too
Addison ended up playing 15 over the sea, but he started life as a 12

 

[BPM]

Redpath can't have wanted to play for England that much. It's not like he was playing brilliantly and continually overlooked. At the point he wasn't selected he was only just starting to get a run in the Bath side.

He should have been picked, but equally, I'd have like to have seen a bit more patience given the interest was clearly there.

Less fussed on Williams TBH.

Ultimately, Eddie can't pick what we don't have.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

I don't really think Williams is any better than Atkinson tbh, although he is a good bit younger.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Kelly has more potential than all of them tbh.

 

[Geordie]

Seb Atkinson
Max Ojomoh
Dan Kelly
Ollie Lawrence
Ollie Hartley

Lets just focus on getting at least one of these lads up to scratch for post 2023