Dylan Hartley charged over Headbutt

[TRF_heineken]

I think the sympathy some have for this guy is a bit over the top.

Just look at the types of foul play he has been found guilty on:
Eye-gouge
Biting
Headbutting
Elbowing

I'm no expert, but that is not acts that belongs on the rugby field. Those are malicious acts, and dirty antics which shouldn't warrant sympathy. And not just to Hartley but to every rugby player. Yes, that includes Schalk Burger and Bakkies Botha.

I would have a much different opinion if he had citings of rugby-related acts such as dangerous clearing at a ruck, illegal tackling (in all its forms), stomping and others.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

It's his own damn fault he gets singled out or put under a microscope though. It's the exact same thing that happened with Bakkies Botha towards the end of his carreer and I have little sympathy. Half of the penalties/cards/citations Bakkies recieved weren't anything out of the ordinary other than it was him and he had built up a deserved reputation for off the ball ****le. Live by the 'sword', die by the 'sword'.

The big pity is both these players are or were extremely good rugby players but become liabilities for the teams they play in.

 

[goodNumber10]

I think the sympathy some have for this guy is a bit over the top.

Just look at the types of foul play he has been found guilty on:
Eye-gouge
Biting
Headbutting
Elbowing

I'm no expert, but that is not acts that belongs on the rugby field. Those are malicious acts, and dirty antics which shouldn't warrant sympathy. And not just to Hartley but to every rugby player. Yes, that includes Schalk Burger and Bakkies Botha.

I would have a much different opinion if he had citings of rugby-related acts such as dangerous clearing at a ruck, illegal tackling (in all its forms), stomping and others.

Don't think it's sympathy, the fact is his disciplinary record should have zero to do with him being cited and everything to do with his sentence.

The underlying fact of it is: is it a cit-able offense or not.

I personally say it isn't.

 

[TRF_heineken]

Don't think it's sympathy, the fact is his disciplinary record should have zero to do with him being cited and everything to do with his sentence.

The underlying fact of it is: is it a cit-able offense or not.

I personally say it isn't.

Wut??

His Disciplinary record should be taken into consideration for his sentence...

A serial killer/rapist's previous offences are used to give harsher sentences, why should it be different with other judicial systems.

 

[Mrs. Peter Quinn]

Wut??

His Disciplinary record should be taken into consideration for his sentence...

A serial killer/rapist's previous offences are used to give harsher sentences, why should it be different with other judicial systems.

...I think you're agreeing with him. He's saying disciplinary record has nothing to do with citing and everything to do with sentencing.
In other words you have to work out whether it's deemed a citeable offence - e.g whether it was dangerous or deliberate, and the answer to is it citeable is a yes or no question. The disciplinary record then informs the severity of the sentence which is not a yes or no question, but a consideration of what are the aggrivating and mitigating factors to be considered. You both agree.

 

[smartcooky]

Don't think it's sympathy, the fact is his disciplinary record should have zero to do with him being cited and everything to do with his sentence.

The underlying fact of it is: is it a cit-able offense or not.

I personally say it isn't.

ANY intentional head on head contact with an opponent is citable... zero tolerance applies with the emphasis being currently being placed on reducing incidences of concussion in the modern game.

 

[goodNumber10]

ANY intentional head on head contact with an opponent is citable... zero tolerance applies with the emphasis being currently being placed on reducing incidences of concussion in the modern game.

yes, and i maintain i don't think it was intentional... i think it was posturing done badly and the head contact wasn't intentional. That's just my opinion mind.

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Wut??

His Disciplinary record should be taken into consideration for his sentence...

A serial killer/rapist's previous offences are used to give harsher sentences, why should it be different with other judicial systems.

That's exactly what i said.

 

[SteveB]

Hi, new member, go easy on me 36 year old , big rugby union fan and player for years

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...rge-can-be-the-saint-of-england-10186180.html

Lancaster will be furious i bet. Especially after dealing with Tuilagi. Now to have this dropped on him. Hartley not available for any warm-ups or the first game, means Lancaster needs focus on other options building to that first game. I agree with other posters on this, Hartley isn't one of our stars, doesn't give much extra, if anything than others in squad, and his discipline issues are a big risk. I was surprised George maybe didn't sneak in the training squad in the first place, afater a good season at Sarries, cementring the number one hooker spot. Could drop Hartley and get George in? Thoughts?

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I am telling no lie, i just put that post up, and then went on the BBC website , and this has come up....

http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/rugby-union/32931690

Called it!

 

[Raggs]

Think he was slightly unlucky for it to get cited, but during the game they never watched a replay with an angle showing clear head contact. A brainless act by someone who should know better, who once again pays the price of a pointless act.

Supposedly he's going to be dropped out the training squad, if that's true I'll be very pleased, but who's going to step up! George is the most like for like replacement.

 

[Bada-Bing!]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/32931690

Hartley to be dropped.

 

[SelimNiai]

Serves him right.

 

[Every Time Ref]

Yes!!!!!!!!!

 

[yaboyjj]

Absolutely the right call by Lancaster- now just hope the rest of training camp and last games of the season go without incident....
It's a huge opportunity now for one of the young'uns to have a stormer and book a world cup spot (possibly even start)- we know that one of George or LCD will make it into the final 31 now, it's set up for one of them to make a name for themselves.
Having said that, I must be one of the only ones who really rates Tom Youngs- imo you only have to look at how the Leicester front row gobbled everyone before them (they gave the Leicester backs all the ball and possesion they needed to win the Bath game). A 5% drop in lineout is worth it for what he does around the field- his non-hooking ability is hardly a big deal in this day and age and for what its worth, with the form of Cole (and possibly a Corbs resurgance, Marler+Mako if not) I would expect England to have scrum dominance against pretty much any team (the scrum has often improved when Youngs has come on actually, IIRC).

 

[91jmay]

Understand the decision, but would still have taken him as he doesn't need the warm up games or Fiji because he is England's best hooker. LCD should get in and on bench with Young's starting. George nowhere near.

 

[munstermuffin]

Understand the decision, but would still have taken him as he doesn't need the warm up games or Fiji because he is England's best hooker. LCD should get in and on bench with Young's starting. George nowhere near.

Issue was if another hooker in squad got a non-tournament injury before game vs Fiji then you'd only have 1 hooker. It may have been soft but Hartley is extremely foolish to even gamble it like he did.
Lancaster just keeps growing in my eyes. Serious balls to make the call and be consistent.

 

[McTallshort]

No fan of Hartley's but 2 Irish players escape citing after last night's baa baa game for an offence that saw a French player banned and he gets banned for what was really nothing. Last time he was banned he called Tom youngs a cheating so and so and the ref took it to heart he does seem unlucky.

 

[Tony Manx]

No fan of Hartley's but 2 Irish players escape citing after last night's baa baa game for an offence that saw a French player banned and he gets banned for what was really nothing. Last time he was banned he called Tom youngs a cheating so and so and the ref took it to heart he does seem unlucky.

+1

 

[McTallshort]

And you also have a French full back not cited for stamping on someone's face. If I was Hartley I would feel some what aggrieved given what's happened this last week with other players commiting worse offences and getting away with them. Obviously we will get a few Irish fans come on and say that kneeing a prone player in the back is perfectly fine but in reality Hartley has been dealt with harshly

 

[goodNumber10]

And you also have a French full back not cited for stamping on someone's face. If I was Hartley I would feel some what aggrieved given what's happened this last week with other players commiting worse offences and getting away with them. Obviously we will get a few Irish fans come on and say that kneeing a prone player in the back is perfectly fine but in reality Hartley has been dealt with harshly

I really think the Huget incident is a complete accident... I could understand him getting cited, but i don't think there is anything in it, he shows genuine concern for the guy who gets hit in the face and stops playing to see to him. He's clearly off balance as the guy holds his leg back and he's off balance.

 

[McTallshort]

You having a laugh?