A conference championship?

[Croket66]

First, escuse my bad english...

I think a conference championship like the Super Rugby can be interesting.
4 conferences :
Irish conference : Leinster, Munster, Ulster, Connacht
Welsh conference : Ospreys, Cardiff Blues, Scarlets, Newport Gwent Dragons
Scottish conference : Edinburgh Rugby, Glasgow Warriors, Melrose, Gala RFC
Italian conference : Benetton Treviso, Aironi, Cavalieri Prato, Calvisano

Each team plays 2 times the teams of his conference (home and away) and 1 time others teams = 18 games
Play-off like the Super Rugby the best team of each conference and 2 others teams with the more points

the baddest team of scottish and italian conference is relegated in his championship and the italian and scotland champion take part of the RaboDirect

3 betters teams from Irish and Welsh conference and 2 betters teams from Scottish and Italian conference are gong inHeineken Cup, others teams in Amlin Cup

Why this system?
- to have a ranking by country
- Scottish championship and italian championship became true "ProD2" and these Will have a real goal (its different with Wales and Ireland because they have provinces and not clubs)

 

[stus768]

Good idea

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

I don't mind the idea but doubt Scotland and Italy would be strong enough to support 4 teams each. Teams like Gala, Melrose, Cavalieri Prato and Calvisano would be so weak that inevitably Aironi, Treviso, Glasgow and Edinburgh would make the playoffs every year.

 

[Peat]

Its not without its merits, but simply put you won't persuade any club involved to accept a season with 4 less games in it due to cash. Plus Scotland and Italy do not have the strength to support 4 strong enough teams.

 

[Croket66]

If Prato or Gala plays RaboDirectPro12 and Amlin Cup they can find sponsors to buy italians and Scottish players who are playing in France/England and to recruits foreign players

 

[Croket66]

4 games less, like the Magners League (before the entry of italians teams)

 

[Peat]

If these sponsors exist, why aren't they're stepping forwards and saying "We have a plan that will make this a Rabo worthy club, we have the cash, let us in?" The respective unions would push for it massively. Although I'm not certain there are enough quality players abroad interested in moving of either nationality to form the guts of a decent ProDirect squad. Scotland maybe.

Another barrier: Persuading Ireland (and Wales to a lesser extent) to accept a lesser chance of winning trophies and a lower percentage of playoff receipts (as they won't have as many teams in there) in exchange for less gates to take money from anyway.

I strongly doubt they'd accept.

edit: Yes, I know they had less games before the Italians. Why do you think they let them in?

 

[TRF_Cymro]

If these sponsors exist, why aren't they're stepping forwards and saying "We have a plan that will make this a Rabo worthy club, we have the cash, let us in?" The respective unions would push for it massively. Although I'm not certain there are enough quality players abroad interested in moving of either nationality to form the guts of a decent ProDirect squad. Scotland maybe.

Another barrier: Persuading Ireland (and Wales to a lesser extent) to accept a lesser chance of winning trophies and a lower percentage of playoff receipts (as they won't have as many teams in there) in exchange for less gates to take money from anyway.

I strongly doubt they'd accept.

edit: Yes, I know they had less games before the Italians. Why do you think they let them in?

A. Nice trips to Italy?

 

[Croket66]

If these sponsors exist, why aren't they're stepping forwards and saying "We have a plan that will make this a Rabo worthy club, we have the cash, let us in?" The respective unions would push for it massively. Although I'm not certain there are enough quality players abroad interested in moving of either nationality to form the guts of a decent ProDirect squad. Scotland maybe.

Another barrier: Persuading Ireland (and Wales to a lesser extent) to accept a lesser chance of winning trophies and a lower percentage of playoff receipts (as they won't have as many teams in there) in exchange for less gates to take money from anyway.

I strongly doubt they'd accept.

edit: Yes, I know they had less games before the Italians. Why do you think they let them in?

Why a lesser chance of winning trophies and a lower percentage of playoff receipts ?
if the best team of each conference is qualified + 2 others teams with the most of points, you can easily have Leinster Munster Ulster Scarlets Treviso and Edinburgh for example.
If they want plays most games, they can plays 1 game against teams of his conference, 2 times the others = 27 games...
Or better, you can take my first option and add 4 extra-games...

 

[Seaton]

If Prato or Gala plays RaboDirectPro12 and Amlin Cup they can find sponsors to buy italians and Scottish players who are playing in France/England and to recruits foreign players

The current existing pro teams in both countries already struggle to do that!

 

[Peat]

Why a lesser chance of winning trophies and a lower percentage of playoff receipts ?
if the best team of each conference is qualified + 2 others teams with the most of points, you can easily have Leinster Munster Ulster Scarlets Treviso and Edinburgh for example.
If they want plays most games, they can plays 1 game against teams of his conference, 2 times the others = 27 games...
Or better, you can take my first option and add 4 extra-games...

At the moment, there is nothing stopping Wales or Ireland getting all 4 playoff spots, except for the poor quality of certain teams. That possibility would go.

Since most games will be against their fellow conference dwellers, one side getting the points for that second slot more or less gurantees the other two teams won't. So at best you'll get two. Two from six is obviously far worse percentages than two from four, which is fairly standard, nevermind the three from four Ireland managed last year. And, given how some of the Scottish and Italian teams would be absolutely dire at first, you can bet they'd sneak in.

The 1 vs 2 method would even that out, but less games against local rivals means less really big pay days, plus a 27 league game would really not appeal to nations who believing in holding their players back (Ireland).

What would the four extra games be?

 

[Feicarsinn]

I can't see any advantage of this system for the Pro12. All the countries involved are close enough together that travel is no major issue and as far as I can tell the format has proven itself highly unpopular in Super rugby.

 

[welshglory]

The only way it would be successful is with a lot more teams like the NFL.

 

[welshglory]

And for them to be privatised or at least semi privatised unlike the Australian or New Zealand model.

 

[SelimNiai]

I don't mind the idea but doubt Scotland and Italy would be strong enough to support 4 teams each. Teams like Gala, Melrose, Cavalieri Prato and Calvisano would be so weak that inevitably Aironi, Treviso, Glasgow and Edinburgh would make the playoffs every year.

That's pretty much my thoughts. In theory it's an idea that has potential but unless you can get sides like the above on a level playing field then it's not going to last in those areas

 

[Croket66]

Here this idea in details :
http://lemondeovale.wordpress.com/2012/01/02/la-ligue-celte-en-conference/

with google translate here :
http://translate.google.fr/translat....com/2012/01/02/la-ligue-celte-en-conference/

 

[Peat]

Having read, the extended playoffs makes it mildly more tenable, but not entirely.

Also, if the RFU won't do everything in their power to stymie the creation of a London Scottish team playing in London as a Scottish professional team in a Celtic league, I am Zombie Pope Jean Claude van Damme and a monkey's uncle. It'd be interesting to see what they were actually able to do in that case but whatever they could they would.