[2021 Six Nations] England Squad

[Wasps92]

To get into the Eng back row now you have to excel. Good isn't enough. Which is as it should be.

Actually cancel that. To be an Eng flanker you need to excel.

Unbelievable how much talent we have there now when it was an area of weakness for so long.

 

[Scotty]

If ever there was a case of over-hyping a player long before it was due , Cockanasinga was the prime example. I remember Sir Clive dribbling with profuse praise and even comparing him with Jonah Lomu ffs . embarrasing really. A few weeks ago (cant remember which game) his attempt to tackle and stop a try was woeful. For a big guy he does appear to be a bit too soft.

I hope Odogwu isnt over hyped, he definitly has defencive issues. But we dont have a winger like him so it would be good to see if he can step up.

 

[Jimbo]

I hope Odogwu isnt over hyped, he definitly has defencive issues. But we dont have a winger like him so it would be good to see if he can step up.

Don't recall seeing him have too many defensive lapses if I am honest, recently he chased back and stopped a certain try, defiantly doesn't lack for work rate in either attack or defence so plenty to work with there.

 

[Reiser99]

So for me one of the key questions is will we see any development of the attack?

We know he apparently wants to develop it after the Lions tour, maybe so he can see some younger or alternative players when he's forced to pick them? However, I would be very surprised if the tour goes ahead this year and 2022 will be leaving it late to develop an attack, test it out, make adjustments and get your team confident with it. The current kick tactics also stop us from seeing some players true potential like Lawrence. Easy to say he didn't do much, but when the halfbacks are kicking it so much there is not a lot he will be able to do. Another point though is with so many of the coaching setup unavailable is there any point trying to start something new when there will be limited input?

Basically I fully expect another tournament of boring kick rugby that will win games, but won't be enjoyable to watch.

 

[BPM]

Don't recall seeing him have too many defensive lapses if I am honest, recently he chased back and stopped a certain try, defiantly doesn't lack for work rate in either attack or defence so plenty to work with there.

Agreed. As you say, he's done some good defensive work recently and I've even seen him do some very solid jackalling at the breakdown.

I think he's always had talent, but he does seem to fall out with people and failing to settle at Tigers or Sale has delayed his development. Perhaps he just needed to find an environment that suited him.

I also think he's probably suffered from coaches preferring taller leaner wingers who are better under a high ball.

 

[BPM]

So for me one of the key questions is will we see any development of the attack?

We know he apparently wants to develop it after the Lions tour, maybe so he can see some younger or alternative players when he's forced to pick them? However, I would be very surprised if the tour goes ahead this year and 2022 will be leaving it late to develop an attack, test it out, make adjustments and get your team confident with it. The current kick tactics also stop us from seeing some players true potential like Lawrence. Easy to say he didn't do much, but when the halfbacks are kicking it so much there is not a lot he will be able to do. Another point though is with so many of the coaching setup unavailable is there any point trying to start something new when there will be limited input?

Basically I fully expect another tournament of boring kick rugby that will win games, but won't be enjoyable to watch.

Who knows? It would be strange to pick players like Lawrence and Odogwu for their line breaking ability and then never pass to them.

 

[Scotty]

Who knows? It would be strange to pick players like Lawrence and Odogwu for their line breaking ability and then never pass to them.

Maybe they will work on attack for that first week when EJ isnt there

 

[Jimbo]

Agreed. As you say, he's done some good defensive work recently and I've even seen him do some very solid jackalling at the breakdown.

I think he's always had talent, but he does seem to fall out with people and failing to settle at Tigers or Sale has delayed his development. Perhaps he just needed to find an environment that suited him.

I also think he's probably suffered from coaches preferring taller leaner wingers who are better under a high ball.

As you say has always been a talent pretty sure he has the try record on the sevens circuit, I didn't realise he had really had issues with coaches, just thought he hadn't been given the opportunities probably due to as you say taller alternatives being preferred, coming from a sevens background he thrives off of unstructered rugby which Wasps IMHO are pretty much the best at on turn over ball in the prem, England wise he just offers something a bit different, I just hope it isn't a ploy to stop Italy capping him and deprive a quality player a fair crack at an international career.

 

[higgik]

The team I would like to see, but won't
15. Malins
14. Watson
13. Slade
12. Lawrence
11. May
10. Farrell
9. Robson
1. Marler
2. George
3. Stuart
4. Itoje
5. Launchbury
6. Underhill
7. Curry
8. Wilson

 

[BPM]

As you say has always been a talent pretty sure he has the try record on the sevens circuit, I didn't realise he had really had issues with coaches, just thought he hadn't been given the opportunities probably due to as you say taller alternatives being preferred, coming from a sevens background he thrives off of unstructered rugby which Wasps IMHO are pretty much the best at on turn over ball in the prem, England wise he just offers something a bit different, I just hope it isn't a ploy to stop Italy capping him and deprive a quality player a fair crack at an international career.

I would hope not. We could have done that with plenty of players, but thankfully we don't seem to do so and Eddie doesn't generally pick players for the sake of it. Typically when he brings a new player in to the set up, they will get a chance (as Furbank did for example). He says he's seen something in Odogwu that he likes. Hopefully we see that come out on the pitch.

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Is Odogwu more a 13 or wing?

 

[Scotty]

Is Odogwu more a 13 or wing?

I like him as a 13 but atm he is a winger who has had a few games at 13. Next to slade as 13 who can put him in space he could be class.

 

[Pieter Steph du Teague]

Yeah, a winger who can cover 13 I think. Very similar to the Nowell mould IMO.

 

[Scotty]

Yeah, a winger who can cover 13 I think. Very similar to the Nowell mould IMO.

I do think he could be a great 13 in the future if he is made a 13 at club level then international when ready...

That acceleration making an outside break has more space at 13, and improved passing game and he COULD be something special. But havnt seen enough of him maybe hes best to stay as a winger. I just want to find out for wasps not chuck him in at the deep end for england and hope like EJ did with Daly.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

From what I've read he's been moved infield (a) to increase his involvement and (b) because has some defensive deficiencies on the wing, particularly under the high ball. If his defensive game has been exposed at club level (I haven't seen enough of him to say if that's right), then I don't want to see him on the wing for Eng except in an emergency.

In terms of the centre I'd like to see Lawrence and Slade given time to develop. But if we're just going to hoof it in the air then you might as well play Wilson and Earl there.

 

[Not Eddie Jones]

But if we're just going to hoof it in the air then you might as well play Wilson and Earl there.

Now you're talking!

 

[Don't Skip Leg Day]

Now you're talking!

I wouldn't put it past Jones with his obsession on playing people out of position.

what about Robson on the wing or Young's maybe? Or even a lock at hooker?

 

[Scotty]

I dont like it EJ picked a team we are all quite happy with and now have nothing to moan about!

 

[will311293]

The thing about Odogwu is he loves to make a hit and jackal over the ball. So at 13 he gets that chance and can get out the line to make the hit, albeit his issue on the wing where he leaves it exposed. He has been helped by having experienced 12/14 in his team (For us old man Jimmy and Kilibrige) as they cover him well and let him learn his trade at 13.

The thing that stands him out is he explodes out of tackles and with such a low level of gravity is tough to tackle. Bit like Sinoti, just doesn't go down.

 

[Vieux Talonneur]

I dont like it EJ picked a team we are all quite happy with and now have nothing to moan about!

Well the squad's OK, but fret not we'll still have plenty to moan about when Lawes gets picked at 6, Binny and Youngs play the full 80 every game, Farrell does nothing but average kicks and Daly plays at FB. It would just be nice to have something new to moan about....which I guess will have to be Randall and Odogwu getting no game time.