[2016 Super Rugby] Sharks vs. Lions (Round 7) 09/04/2016

[TRF_heineken]

Venue: Growthpoint Kings Park
Time: 17:05 CAT (SA, GMT+2)​

 

[unrated]

I cant find the link but there was an article on News 24 that stated Marcel Coetzee has a clause in his contract with Ulster.
If the new Springbok Coach includes him in his plans and Saru offers Marcel a better contract that they are currently offering than he has the option to renege on his contract with Ulster and stay in South Africa.

I hope Saru can cough up the money to keep a future Springbok regular.

Here is a similar article on Supersport http://www.supersport.com/rugby/super-rugby/news/160323/Marcell_could_stay_in_SA

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

Our franchize teams could certainly be helped if our best stayed put. Especially those players between 22 and 28 years old. We don't seem to have a lot of those guys in their prime around compared to the other nations' teams.

 

[unrated]

Exactly this is where Saru has to show their intent if they are serious about selecting Springboks from home. We just cant allow our guys who are yet to reach their prime go play overseas. Guys like Goosen has slipped through and because he is playing in france evereyone only talks of Pollard, Lambie and Jantjies as possible Springbok flyhalves.

 

[0tago]

Really would love to see the Lions win this, they play an excellent brand of rugby and are by far my favourite SA team to watch. The Sharks on the other hand are really poor and conservative, grinding out a few wins and taken their opportunities, but given some of their players, they have the potential to play far better than that.

 

[unrated]

At the beginning of the season the sharks appointed Robert du Preez as their new attacking coach. They promised a new dawn for the Sharks where they would play some brilliant attacking rugby. It seems its not that easy to change a culture very fast and they have now adapted their stance in the media that they are now rather defending to score points and only attacking from the right areas http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/SuperRugby/sharks-defend-to-score-points-20160406 .
Unlike the lions who just sometimes throws the ball out wide from within their own 22. Even though The sharks have not really succeeded in adopting their desired play style yet im very glad the work has started and i must say the defense looks good well done to Omar. FC Barcelona has adopted a certain play style and persisted with it, it has won them many throphies. While Real Madrid has just moved on between different coaches with no philosophy in mind and look where it got them. So i am pleased that the sharks has now started to work on creating their own playing style and even though we are getting results already we might become even better the more work is done on the attack to complement our defence.

 

[SomeOke]

I'm completely dissatisfied with the big unions and there lies about playing a more expansive brand of rugby. None of them are actually willing to stick to their guns and absorb a few losses in the short term to create a better culture in the long term.

The Lions were horrible until last season but since Ackers has been in charge he's stuck to his guns, and after a couple years the players have started playing running rugby effectively. Sometimes that's what it takes, 3 or 4 years ago the Hurricanes were exciting but didn't win games, last year showed the culmination of the their insistence to play expansive rugby.

The Sharks, Stormers and Bulls are so afraid of losing they are unwilling to try something new and it's getting very very tiring to support those sides. That's why on principle I'll be supporting the Lions against everyone but the Stormers this year, I really hope they can prove that SA does belong in the new rugby era. Like it or not rugby has changed, "winning rugby" is no longer synonymous with "boring rugby", tell that to the Chiefs this year. Offloading has changed the game forever and the sooner the South African coaching staff realize this the better. We can certainly keep to our traditional strengths, but it's pointless to spend all of our possession grinding out 15 points when the top NZ sides will score 3 tries in 5 minutes.

We have to learn to counter-attack and we have to learn to take risks when we're on the offensive.

Edit: In summary Sharks will probably grind out a win here, but I sincerely hope they get pumped for all of our sakes.

 

[0tago]

What are your thoughts on the Stormers SA users? Their style of rugby is undoubtedly completely defensive.


@TRF_heineken Interested to know your thoughts on the other users comments about defensive rugby and wanting to adopt a new playing style, as you vehemently defended the style and advocated for a defensive approach due to the new BP system.



This game is a complete contrast in styles, the Lions seem to be the only progressing South African team in my opinion, everyone else looks stuck in the mud.

 

[TRF_heineken]

What are your thoughts on the Stormers SA users? Their style of rugby is undoubtedly completely defensive.


@TRF_heineken Interested to know your thoughts on the other users comments about defensive rugby and wanting to adopt a new playing style, as you vehemently defended the style and advocated for a defensive approach due to the new BP system.



This game is a complete contrast in styles, the Lions seem to be the only progressing South African team in my opinion, everyone else looks stuck in the mud.

Irrelevant to this thread. Stay on topic.

 

[Bull]

Sharks
15. Willie le Roux, 14. JP Pietersen, 13. Paul Jordaan, 12. Andre Esterhuizen, 11. Lwazi Mvovo, 10. Joe Pietersen, 9. Cobus Reinach, 8. Daniel du Preez, 7. Jean-Luc du Preez, 6. Marcell Coetzee, 5. Stephan Lewies, 4. Etienne Oosthuizen, 3. Coenie Oosthuizen, 2. Franco Marais, 1. Tendai Mtawarira (captain)
Substitutes: 16. Kyle Cooper, 17. Juan Schoeman, 18. Lourens Adriaanse, 19. Hyron Andrews, 20. Keegan Daniel, 21. Michael Claassens, 22. Garth April, 23. Odwa Ndungane

Lions
15 Andries Coetzee, 14 Ruan Combrinck, 13 Lionel Mapoe, 12 Rohan Janse van Rensburg, 11 Courtnall Skosan, 10 Elton Jantjies, 9 Ross Cronje, 8 Warren Whiteley, 7 Warwick Tecklenburg, 6 Jaco Kriel, 5 Franco Mostert, 4 Andries Ferreira, 3 Julian Redelinghuys, 2 Malcolm Marx, 1 Dylon Smith
Substitutes: 16 Armand van der Merwe, 17 Corne Fourie, 18 Ruan Dreyer, 19 Ruan Ackermann, 20 Cyle Brink, 21 Faf de Klerk, 22 Howard Mnisi, 23 Jaco van der Walt

 

[0tago]

Irrelevant to this thread. Stay on topic.

I was staying on topic, he was referring to the Sharks current style and wanting to to change it and I asked you about your thoughts on that. Granted I asked for thoughts on the Stormers to, interested to hear from other SA users. This is a game against contrasting styles, attacking rugby vs defensive rugby, which has become a topic of debate in South African rugby, progression vs regression or staying the same, it's really not that far off topic to just shut me down like that.

Just trying to have a discussion mate, no need for the hostility and avoiding it.

 

[TRF_heineken]

I was staying on topic, he was referring to the Sharks current style and wanting to to change it and I asked you about your thoughts on that. Granted I asked for thoughts on the Stormers to, interested to hear from other SA users. This is a game against contrasting styles, attacking rugby vs defensive rugby, which has become a topic of debate in South African rugby, progression vs regression or staying the same, it's really not that far off topic to just shut me down like that.

Just trying to have a discussion mate, no need for the hostility and avoiding it.

This is a match thread between the Sharks and the Lions. If you want a discussion about the Stormers, then do it in the Stormers match thread, or one of the many threads about SA Rugby.

The topic of debate on this thread is about the upcoming match. Anything else is irrelavant.

 

[unrated]

everyone else looks stuck in the mud.

I would not say that. If the sharks wanted to throw the ball around in their own 22 and risk getting caught out then they would but they know they have to win matches most importantly and then play attractive rugby. I love how the Jaguares play rugby but honestly id rather have my team winning matches then playing "Champagne" rugby and losing. My post was about how the Sharks are playing defensively to score points and starting to develop their attacking culture while still winning.

 

[0tago]

This is a match thread between the Sharks and the Lions. If you want a discussion about the Stormers, then do it in the Stormers match thread, or one of the many threads about SA Rugby.

The topic of debate on this thread is about the upcoming match. Anything else is irrelavant.

So what are you thoughts on the Sharks defensive rugby and the Lions attacking rugby and the other South African posters perspectives?

Who do you think will come out on top? Going to be a cracker. Home advantage for the Sharks though, could prove decisive, I hope the Lions aren't too dejected from last week either.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

It surprises me to say this but I feel the Lions have the stronger, more impactful bench. Armand van der Merwe looks like a loose cannonball or what a highly trained ballerina who happens to be a rhinoceros would look like playing rugby and 21. Michael Claassens, 22. Garth April, 23. Odwa Ndungane VS Faf de Klerk, 22 Howard Mnisi, 23 Jaco van der Walt ? C'mon. I like April, I actually was surprised he isn't deputizing for Lambie but Ndungane and Claassesns? The one would be earning big bucks in Europe if it weren't for the fact the continent is flooded with Fijian wingers who can actually creae a try on their own and the other is back from Europe having finished his pension run and is now just hanging about Durban not believing his luck that the Sharks look adament on having a 34 year old on the bench rather than invest in a player that might add something for them later on.

Home advantage is huge and my head says Sharks by a whisker but I too am for the Lions when the Stormers aren't playing them.

That said and somewhat in response to @0tago 's question I feel we have the player personel to adapt our approach to rugby. I actually think our game as a collective was more running orientated in the pas but something crept in post 2003 and I don't blame England for a second. The 2003 English team weren't playing 10-man rugby IMO. They had threats across the board and could win ugly if needed but they had the good stuff in the bag as well. But between Jake White and Pieter de Villiers our rugby became formulaistic and we've struggled to break the mold and perceptions. When our packs dominate we can score some beautiful tries but our packs aren't dominating to the extent they used too and we havn't adapted the way we use our backs. I don't even think its a case of defense vs offense and you have to have either the one or the other. But change takes time and our approach t the game is to a large extent influenced by our grassroots rugby where its won or lost in the forwards so that is where our focus lies. I think I'm just rambling incoherently now so I'm just going to stop right there because I don't have a clue what I'm talking about LOL.

 

[TRF_heineken]

I think the Lions will win this one. Not because of their style of play, but more so that their team is more on form than the Sharks.

If it's going to rain, which seems to be the case, and turns out into a kicking fest, then the Lions have better goal kickers than the Sharks. For me their forwards pack are on the same level, where one team is better in one facet, the other is better in another.

For me, it's going to go down the backline, the defence and how they use the space. I'm interested to see the match-up between Combrink and Mvovo.

 

[0tago]

If Crombrink stays in form there's no more excuses not to pick. Same goes for Jacob Kriel and Warent Whiteley, these guys are simply too good not to pick. Also Mapoe is looking good and could be in with a shout for the Spring Boys.

 

[TRF_stormer2010]

@0tago

We have racial quotas to contend with though. That might see Combrinck missing out as well as as Jaco Kriel and/or Whiteley. I for one wouldn't mind at all seeing Mapoe in the mix though and he will probably get his chance too; De Allende only back and on the bench tonight, Serfontein in suspect form and Jesse Kriel out injured for a spell. I'd back Mapoe to get a crack at it.

 

[TRF_heineken]

@0tago

We have racial quotas to contend with though. That might see Combrinck missing out as well as as Jaco Kriel and/or Whiteley. I for one wouldn't mind at all seeing Mapoe in the mix though and he will probably get his chance too; De Allende only back and on the bench tonight, Serfontein in suspect form and Jesse Kriel out injured for a spell. I'd back Mapoe to get a crack at it.

Serfontein started to get some form back last week. And Jesse had to play fullback because of Gelant's injury. But Jesse is back at 13 this weekend with SP Marais coming in at fullback.

But yeah, I like Mapoe, and he's certainly in with a chance if the Quota system were to be strictly followed by the new Bok-coach... Combrink has a very slim chance of making Springbok, because of the position he plays and his skin colour... If Mnisi and Mapoe is picked for the Boks however, I see no problem with Combrink getting a shout too...

 

[0tago]

@0tago

We have racial quotas to contend with though. That might see Combrinck missing out as well as as Jaco Kriel and/or Whiteley. I for one wouldn't mind at all seeing Mapoe in the mix though and he will probably get his chance too; De Allende only back and on the bench tonight, Serfontein in suspect form and Jesse Kriel out injured for a spell. I'd back Mapoe to get a crack at it.

Wow, sorry my previous post was full of predictive spelling errors from my phone!

I'm quite impressed with the depth in the Spring Boks backs and loose forwards, actually in all departments there's a lot of depth there currently, definitely going to be a force for years to come.