for most people in the private sector Saturday is a regular day.
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for most people in the private sector Saturday is a regular day.
Most people in private sector don't do jobs where other people's health and well being are directly at risk from being overworked.
HGV drivers, air traffic controllers, chemists, sparkeys, builders, fork lift driver in a warehouse, maintence people of all description etc etc and working a Saturday noemally means a day off in the week so I dont get your point of working Saturday means being over worked
Oh yes it is. Read this thread for a start. What you mean is it isn't logical, but use the word carefully.
LiRFCMatt
Bench Player
This junior doctor's contract makes me angrier than the thought of Ford at 10 with Farrell at 12
He saves money. I'm pretty sure that's all there is to this. Unless you believe the conspiracies about deliberately forcing them into private practice to kick the NHS.
I certainly don't believe this is about improving the NHS. It doesn't.
I certainly don't believe this is about improving the NHS. It doesn't.
1. The new contracts are not being "forced" on the poor dears. They only apply to the new intake of junior doctors starting work in the summer.
2. No contracts can be "forced" on the poor dears as they are already contracted and they would be entitled to wrongful dismissal compensation.
3. No one is asking anything more from them than they knew when they signed up and, in the vast majority of cases, would be better off.
4. The poor dears are being led by the nose by certain political radicals who have come into the ascendancy in their profession!
5. They are junior doctors not consultants and will have to refer the vast majority of "life threatening" decisions to their superiors!!
6. Don't the BBC and other left wing meedjah love misleading everyone with one sided reporting!!
2. No contracts can be "forced" on the poor dears as they are already contracted and they would be entitled to wrongful dismissal compensation.
3. No one is asking anything more from them than they knew when they signed up and, in the vast majority of cases, would be better off.
4. The poor dears are being led by the nose by certain political radicals who have come into the ascendancy in their profession!
5. They are junior doctors not consultants and will have to refer the vast majority of "life threatening" decisions to their superiors!!
6. Don't the BBC and other left wing meedjah love misleading everyone with one sided reporting!!
Can we not just import a load more from Africa and the far east?
Except for the fact most estimates predict by August 80% of junior doctors will have to have accepted the new contract to continue working in the NHS due to how often they change roles as is the nature of their job.
Tallshort I wrote a fair bit to you I'll try to some up, first up some of those jobs are no where near as life critical as a doctor. They already work Saturdays. Overtime pay trys to stop silly scheduling by admintrators believe my wife use to work in the NHS those people only care about staffing targets. A HGV driver usually has specific rules about breaks and hours worked as do ambulance personnel(guaranteed breaks, frequency of shifts) the doctors are not being given those safeguards which is the worrying thing.
Most doctors and Hunt are making this out to be a debate over public health and safety. I know which group probably more about what they are talking about here and it's not the politician.
optimuswolf
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Of course its totally possible for this to be about both quality and cost. The research suggests that quality needs to improve at the weekend. To do that more doctors are needed at those times. The current contract would make that unaffordable therefore the govt is trying to change it.
There are hard tradeoffs here. For instance, leave the contract unchanged and the extra money will mean fewer new cancer drugs adopted or longer waiting lists for hip replacements.
And this is not particularly party political - labour did not pledge any more money for the NHS than the conservatives. So given these constraints and the power what would you do?
There are hard tradeoffs here. For instance, leave the contract unchanged and the extra money will mean fewer new cancer drugs adopted or longer waiting lists for hip replacements.
And this is not particularly party political - labour did not pledge any more money for the NHS than the conservatives. So given these constraints and the power what would you do?
+1 for all the false anger from the likes of the BBC, this is about providing better cover at Weekends.
"+1 for all the false anger from the likes of the BBC, this is about providing better cover at Weekends. "
So sure are Whitehall of their case, they feel the need to doctor (pun intended) a letter expressing an opinion.
http://www.independent.co.uk/life-s...-medic-to-build-hard-edged-case-a6801501.html
Then we have the curious case of the CEOs denying they supported imposition. Several sources this time:
Like you, I'm unimpressed at the BBC's faux outrage. Unlike you, I don't conflate that with a simple dismissal of the views of those who, unlike you or me, actually work at the coal face in healthcare.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/half-nhs-bosses-jeremy-hunt-7355383
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2016/02/11/jeremy-hunts-junior-docto_n_9211662.html
https://www.reddit.com/r/ukpolitics/comments/45a4ha/9_and_counting_of_the_20_nhs_ceos_cited_by_sir/
http://nhap.org/jeremy-hunts-imposi...unior-contract-is-a-grave-error-of-judgement/
Of course, this can be written off as the ramblings of liberal media, at least if you have a fairly simple world view. It must be fun seeing the world in black and white. Hunt is an appalling man with an uncanny ability to **** off anyone he comes across. Yes, he's a regular saint, and with his private healthcare sewn up, he loses a lot of sleep about NHS patients.
So sure are Whitehall of their case, they feel the need to doctor (pun intended) a letter expressing an opinion.
http://www.independent.co.uk/life-s...-medic-to-build-hard-edged-case-a6801501.html
Then we have the curious case of the CEOs denying they supported imposition. Several sources this time:
Like you, I'm unimpressed at the BBC's faux outrage. Unlike you, I don't conflate that with a simple dismissal of the views of those who, unlike you or me, actually work at the coal face in healthcare.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/half-nhs-bosses-jeremy-hunt-7355383
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2016/02/11/jeremy-hunts-junior-docto_n_9211662.html
https://www.reddit.com/r/ukpolitics/comments/45a4ha/9_and_counting_of_the_20_nhs_ceos_cited_by_sir/
http://nhap.org/jeremy-hunts-imposi...unior-contract-is-a-grave-error-of-judgement/
Of course, this can be written off as the ramblings of liberal media, at least if you have a fairly simple world view. It must be fun seeing the world in black and white. Hunt is an appalling man with an uncanny ability to **** off anyone he comes across. Yes, he's a regular saint, and with his private healthcare sewn up, he loses a lot of sleep about NHS patients.
Crimean's want to go to Russia. They are being blocked.
Falklands wanted to stay with Britain, invaded by Argentina. Falklands were allowed their say, Crimea was not.
As usual, the fight with Russia and US lives on while the US wants to micro control Germany.
Boris into the out camp. Great Stuff.
?
Crimea is part of the Ukraine, Russia invade the Crimea, Crimea happy (apparently) to be Russian, no one could care less.
Falklands is British, Argentina invade, people in the Falklands dont want to be part of Argentina (who would), Britain retakes the Falklands.
If the population all cheered the Argentinan troops as they were landing and sent a message to the British cabinet that they wanted to be part of a banana republic you would have a point but that wasnt the case, so you dont.
Almost forgot! So its in or out of the EU time for us in the UK. Hows everyone going to vote? I am in the undecided camp on this one.
Thingimubob
First XV
100% behind the IN campaign! Admittedly I'm probably biased on the matter as I've seen and experienced the benefits of the EU first hand through my degree. Not saying the EU is perfect by any means (what political organisation is?!) but the benefits of staying in far far outweigh the perceived negatives in my mind.
Wales in particular would certainly be harmed by leaving the EU. I don't think people here quite understand exactly how much money we get from the EU when it comes to grants and funding for projects around the country. We have some of the poorest areas in Europe (something that is just mind boggling for a country in the UK in this day and age...) and the EU gives us a pretty hefty grant to go towards that. I'm not too convinced Westminster will be willing or even able to cough up that type of cash to us!
Same goes for the various improvement / building projects dotted around Wales, like the new Swansea University campus, or the proposed tidal energy project there too. Think I read somewhere that Wales gets around £500m in investment from various parties in the EU, which generates £4bn for our economy. That all will be severely at risk if we leave.
I know this is all centered on Wales, but I believe it's the same across the UK and it's something that's massively glossed over by the Eurosceptics as they go on fearmongering about terrorists and making us "Great Britain" again...
Not sure if people realize the sheer amount of day to day complications that will arise from us leaving too. You can kiss goodbye to the idea of popping over to the continent on a last minute cheap holiday, as you'll likely be needing to apply for a Shengen visa to enter! Trying to cross from Dover to Calais or jump on the Eurostar to Paris will be hell too, with each and every person needing to go through passport and visa checks before having a chance to get going.
Of course I'm sure there's plenty of people who'd welcome that due to wanting to make it hard as possible for migrants to get in. However, ironically, it could potentially make things easier for migrants to illegally try and enter Britain! France essentially regulates our border for us on the French side of the channel by keeping the migrants there (hence the migrant camp at Calais), but if we leave, there's no guarantee France will continue to do that for us. This means we could see a lot more migrants rocking up on our shores than there are now.
I get pretty frustrated at anti-EU politicians going on about how "our current open border is dangerous", when the truth is, we do not even have an open border with the EU! Sure you can get into the UK freely if you're an EU citizen, but you still need to show your valid passport to the proper authority before being able to do that!
Add to that the complications such as what happens to all those Brits living in countries like Spain? They're gonna have to become Spanish, get proper visa's or face being kicked out of the country. I'm also pretty sure that the Good Friday Agreement will be affected in some way by Brexit, kicking that whole hornets nest once again...
I'm praying we do stay in the EU anyway, I'm a big fan of the benefits I get from being an EU citizen, and really don't fancy giving them up any time soon!
Wales in particular would certainly be harmed by leaving the EU. I don't think people here quite understand exactly how much money we get from the EU when it comes to grants and funding for projects around the country. We have some of the poorest areas in Europe (something that is just mind boggling for a country in the UK in this day and age...) and the EU gives us a pretty hefty grant to go towards that. I'm not too convinced Westminster will be willing or even able to cough up that type of cash to us!
Same goes for the various improvement / building projects dotted around Wales, like the new Swansea University campus, or the proposed tidal energy project there too. Think I read somewhere that Wales gets around £500m in investment from various parties in the EU, which generates £4bn for our economy. That all will be severely at risk if we leave.
I know this is all centered on Wales, but I believe it's the same across the UK and it's something that's massively glossed over by the Eurosceptics as they go on fearmongering about terrorists and making us "Great Britain" again...
Not sure if people realize the sheer amount of day to day complications that will arise from us leaving too. You can kiss goodbye to the idea of popping over to the continent on a last minute cheap holiday, as you'll likely be needing to apply for a Shengen visa to enter! Trying to cross from Dover to Calais or jump on the Eurostar to Paris will be hell too, with each and every person needing to go through passport and visa checks before having a chance to get going.
Of course I'm sure there's plenty of people who'd welcome that due to wanting to make it hard as possible for migrants to get in. However, ironically, it could potentially make things easier for migrants to illegally try and enter Britain! France essentially regulates our border for us on the French side of the channel by keeping the migrants there (hence the migrant camp at Calais), but if we leave, there's no guarantee France will continue to do that for us. This means we could see a lot more migrants rocking up on our shores than there are now.
I get pretty frustrated at anti-EU politicians going on about how "our current open border is dangerous", when the truth is, we do not even have an open border with the EU! Sure you can get into the UK freely if you're an EU citizen, but you still need to show your valid passport to the proper authority before being able to do that!
Add to that the complications such as what happens to all those Brits living in countries like Spain? They're gonna have to become Spanish, get proper visa's or face being kicked out of the country. I'm also pretty sure that the Good Friday Agreement will be affected in some way by Brexit, kicking that whole hornets nest once again...
I'm praying we do stay in the EU anyway, I'm a big fan of the benefits I get from being an EU citizen, and really don't fancy giving them up any time soon!
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The inherently capitalist nature of the EU worries me, but at least the consequences of staying in are predictable. The fallout of leaving could be absolutely dire economically and diplomatically for us. So I'll vote to stay in.
As an Englishman living in Wales, I would probably vote for Welsh independence in order to stay in the EU too.
As an Englishman living in Wales, I would probably vote for Welsh independence in order to stay in the EU too.
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"Not sure if people realize the sheer amount of day to day complications that will arise from us leaving too. You can kiss goodbye to the idea of popping over to the continent on a last minute cheap holiday, as you'll likely be needing to apply for a Shengen visa to enter! Trying to cross from Dover to Calais or jump on the Eurostar to Paris will be hell too, with each and every person needing to go through passport and visa checks before having a chance to get going"
Your very wrong on that score, before the EU got rid of Duty free booze and fags people were popping over the Calais on a daily basis getting cheap booze. I lived in Germany before before open boarders and travelled fine between the UK and Europe. You have to rememeber there was travel before the EU opened the borders.
Your very wrong on that score, before the EU got rid of Duty free booze and fags people were popping over the Calais on a daily basis getting cheap booze. I lived in Germany before before open boarders and travelled fine between the UK and Europe. You have to rememeber there was travel before the EU opened the borders.
Thingimubob
First XV
If we end up in a situation where the UK leaves, but the majority in Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland want to stay in, then it could be a catalyst for the Welsh independence argument to be thrust into the forefront. Scotland will almost certainly have another independence referendum in that situation, and I'd put money on them going too.
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