Umaga to replace Kirwin?

[Larksea]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/...joining-blues-as-head-coach-on-threeyear-deal

this will finally be some good news and maybe finally the blues can start building for next year, recruitment has been a bit stunted compared to other teams and they have serious rebuilding to do.

I dont think Kirwin is as bad a coach as his 35% record but a few bad decisions have really haunted him.

I also think if he did get another season, if it went badly again he would never recover

 

[nickdnz]

Damn it.

I love Tana Umaga, a hero of mine if I'm honest. Which is why I really didn't want him to take this job. For the best coach in the world, it would be a struggle to turn the Blues around. But Umaga is another coach who hasn't yet earned a head coaching role of a Super Rugby franchise. He has done some great work with Counties, but he hasn't won anything and he seems to have faltered. He didn't win anything as coaching with Toulon and was replaced as head coach by PSA.

Clearly the NZRU thinks he has promise to include him in their U20s plan, but assistant coach of the U20s to head of a (struggling) Super Rugby team is a big jump.

Can't be much worse than Kirwan - but former players without a phenomenal track record of success should not be made head coach of a Super Rugby team. It's not a development role - it's for the five best coaches in New Zealand outside of the All Blacks.

Definitely don't want Umaga to fail, I'd be thrilled if I was wrong. But the Blues really needed to look for the most qualified option. Not just their mates. Why did we not look at seeing if we could get Rob Penney back? (although ideally he'll take over from Blackadder). Why did they not go for Keane before the Chiefs got him? Or give Colin Cooper another crack after his success with Taranaki?

 

[nickdnz]

And Kirwan has finally stepped down!

Some mentioned that Wayne Smith may have some role in the reorganization. Now HE I wouldn't mind seeing make head coach!

 

[jessta]

If anyone can get the best out of the blues young players its tana.

Yes he lacks experience but the rapport he would have from his players.

 

[iINDOMINUSxx]

Interesting choice.

 

[nickdnz]

If anyone can get the best out of the blues young players its tana.

Yes he lacks experience but the rapport he would have from his players.

Don't really buy the whole rapport angle. Obviously there will be a lot of guys who look up to him and would want to learn from him. But unless he's strategically very sound and telling them all the right things, it doesn't really matter. He's a charismatic figure - I rate him as an All Black captain above McCaw - but I don't think he's got enough experience in a coaching role.

Looking at the best coaches typically in New Zealand we see guys like Graham Henry, Dave Rennie, Wayne Smith, Joe Schmidt, Vern Cotter, Robbie Deans. What these guys have in common is decades of coaching experience and success between their playing careers and Super Rugby coaching careers (if they even had playing careers). Then you have guys with less time outside of their playing careers - and not a brilliant coaching record in-between. Mark Hammett, John Kirwan, Pat Lam, Jamie Joseph, Todd Blackadder. Typically, these coaches tend to struggle more in Super Rugby.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Hasn't Umaga been coaching for 7 years?
That's a reasonable amount of experience by now. Hopefully it's a success for him - with his levels of experience/playing talent he has the potential to be a top quality coach.

 

[nickdnz]

Well - he's been an on again/off again player/coach up until 2011.

Regardless, there are more experienced coaches who have achieved a lot more.

Had Counties Manakau won the ITM Cup then I wouldn't be complaining so much. But he hasn't excellent at every level before this - he's performed pretty adequately, getting some promising results early on with Manakau but hasn't really pushed further over the last two seasons.

The cynical part of me thinks his appointment is as much about PR as it is about finding success. Appointing a popular figure as coach may stop the Blues supporters baying for blood from the incompetent idiots (largely former players) running the franchise. John Kirwan was also a popular figure when he was appointed - and the use of 'his rapport' or 'mana' was bound to lead to success. Sadly it wasn't the case...is no one else noticing this pattern?

 

[Muzzy]

Didn't counties win the championship or something? He also did some good work with Georgia. Counties were bottom of the table before Tana came in so I'm looking forward to him being the coach. Can't be worse than Kirwan

 

[iINDOMINUSxx]

I also heard that he was a player/coach at Toulon when they were danger off relegation ?. Well i did get that from wikepedia so it could be false so could someone confirm that ?

 

[nickdnz]

Didn't counties win the championship or something? He also did some good work with Georgia. Counties were bottom of the table before Tana came in so I'm looking forward to him being the coach. Can't be worse than Kirwan

Yep. As did two other coaches since then. But Counties hasn't pushed at the Premiership, and it's not through a decent amount of resources.

Again, I wish him all the best. I think he could be a wonderful coach - he's a clever guy with great leadership. Just think this is the wrong move at the wrong time, and it would be a shame if it resulted in a lack of success which damaged his promise and reputation.

 

[gaston le gaff]

Damn it.

I love Tana Umaga, a hero of mine if I'm honest. Which is why I really didn't want him to take this job. For the best coach in the world, it would be a struggle to turn the Blues around. But Umaga is another coach who hasn't yet earned a head coaching role of a Super Rugby franchise. He has done some great work with Counties, but he hasn't won anything and he seems to have faltered. He didn't win anything as coaching with Toulon and was replaced as head coach by PSA.

Clearly the NZRU thinks he has promise to include him in their U20s plan, but assistant coach of the U20s to head of a (struggling) Super Rugby team is a big jump.

Can't be much worse than Kirwan - but former players without a phenomenal track record of success should not be made head coach of a Super Rugby team. It's not a development role - it's for the five best coaches in New Zealand outside of the All Blacks.

Definitely don't want Umaga to fail, I'd be thrilled if I was wrong. But the Blues really needed to look for the most qualified option. Not just their mates. Why did we not look at seeing if we could get Rob Penney back? (although ideally he'll take over from Blackadder). Why did they not go for Keane before the Chiefs got him? Or give Colin Cooper another crack after his success with Taranaki?

he was replaced by PSA but he won nothing either!!!!! could not even qualify for the Champions Cup one season it was not until Bernie Laporte took over that Toulon had excellent success and PSA had more or less the same amount of SH STARS, Gregan, Matfield, Jerry Collins (God rest his soul) + many others.

 

[Kiwi_]

It's really not that much of a surprise after what he did with Counties..

See how he goes. Blues need a big revamp and their fans need to show up to games even if they're losing. For a city of 1.5m and the biggest city of our country where Rugby is supposedly our religion and they can't even get a crowd of 3000+ is embarrassing. It's also a testament to what bandwagon fans Kiwis are (in all sports).

 

[austingtir]

And Kirwan has finally stepped down!

Some mentioned that Wayne Smith may have some role in the reorganization. Now HE I wouldn't mind seeing make head coach!

Yep deffo one of the best coaches in the country look at how the Chiefs have gone this year without him. And the fact that Hansen wanted him back involved this year for the WC says it all.