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The "South African Quota" catch-all thread
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<blockquote data-quote="Bruce_ma gooshvili" data-source="post: 884295" data-attributes="member: 74121"><p>I couldn't find the article sorry (which is bizarre, because I definitely read it, I think in The Scotsman and I''m certain it was him and not the new South African winger Edinbrugh have (van der Merwe?)). From my recollection he wasn't direct enough to conclude what he was alluding to; just that he felt opportunities were limited back home. I didn't realise he'd been cut (I assumed a trip to the northern hemisphere would be a promotion in terms of salary). I see the Lions are reportedly having a big cut to their budget, which would then be the most likely explanation of why van der Walt felt his opportunities were limited. </p><p></p><p><a href="https://theoffsideline.com/edinburgh-linked-south-african-playmaker/" target="_blank">https://theoffsideline.com/edinburgh-linked-south-african-playmaker/</a></p><p></p><p>That completely changes things and I apologise if I've misinterpreted the lad and I'm glad he's landed a contract. He's a bit of a godsend for Edinburgh given their dearth at flyhalf and seems pretty decent.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>So is more polite to not to respond to a poster that kindly posted links to various articles? I can only given an honest appraisal of the information put before me. The legal intervention and the somewhat inflammatory language used by the previous sports minister are certainly good points, well made. I'm not surprised some people read that and think the government doesn't have the best interests of society or sport at heart – everyone has a different political take on things. I didn't mean to indicate the previous sports minister was a flash in the pan, only that policy can be changed or implemented differently depending on who is behind the wheel at any given time. I feel there have been indications that the current sports minister is perhaps a bit more consensual than the last guy.</p><p></p><p>As for the use of the word "sides", I'd hoped that was pretty clear (but obviously not). On the one hand a player that I felt was insinuating that opportunities are limited at home due to government policy and on the other a player that feels government policy is inadequate in identifying and harnessing talent in townships. Too much interventions vs too little. Of course my point is undermined by not being able to find the article on van der Walt but I held my hand up to that. And I say above, I stand corrected and it may be he was alluding to the financial cuts at the Lions (which I wasn't aware of).</p><p></p><p>As for my evidence that the South African economy has not grown since the global financial crisis. Is that really contentious too? We've had so called "austerity" (i.e. reductions to public spending) all over Europe for a decade, even though the EU GDP has still managed to grow during that period. Googling GDP for South Africa sadly doesn't paint the rosiest of pictures in recent years, certainly worse than the overall EU. If they are remotely accurate then I struggle to see how there can have been extra money going into the treasury to pay for the sort of programmes that advocates of transformation would want. I can't think of an example of a government that was able to roll out a raft of social programmes at a time when the economy and budget is contracting.</p><p></p><p>When I talk about "swapping 18 years of life" and life chances of my two imaginary people, I am drawing a comparison on the average wealth and opportunities of different ethnic groupings. Just because 90% of the country is black and there is large number of black middle class kids doesn't change the situation of the average situation (or mathematical "mean" if you prefer). I take on board the point that there will be many middle class black kids who don't need scholarships and bursaries and may even be wealthier than middle class white kids who get overlooked due to education policy on admissions. That would be an unfortunate circumstance if a privileged black kid was admitted at the expense of say a disadvantaged white kid. I'll confess I don't have enough knowledge of South African education admission policies to know if such a thing could be possible. </p><p></p><p>So to return to my point, and replicate the example to Scotland when a kid with a bursary / scholarship gets a spot in a fee paying school and a kid from a family that could have paid that fee is overlooked. I'd argue that you've still got more life chances if you are the overlooked kid with the parents who can pay many thousands of pounds a year on your education (than the kid with the scholarship / bursary). So I can make the same point as I intended using a completely non-racial example. I appreciate I could have been clearer on that point and spelled it out fully, but I was trying (and failing) to be concise! I will tread with more care in future.</p><p></p><p>I think the bit I was closest to talking BS about was about Dlulane, if there was any sort of policy back in 2003/04. There sure didn't look like it to a neutral.</p><p></p><p>I've still not had time to look at the legal documents sadly. But 2018 is still young!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Bruce_ma gooshvili, post: 884295, member: 74121"] I couldn't find the article sorry (which is bizarre, because I definitely read it, I think in The Scotsman and I''m certain it was him and not the new South African winger Edinbrugh have (van der Merwe?)). From my recollection he wasn't direct enough to conclude what he was alluding to; just that he felt opportunities were limited back home. I didn’t realise he’d been cut (I assumed a trip to the northern hemisphere would be a promotion in terms of salary). I see the Lions are reportedly having a big cut to their budget, which would then be the most likely explanation of why van der Walt felt his opportunities were limited. [URL]https://theoffsideline.com/edinburgh-linked-south-african-playmaker/[/URL] That completely changes things and I apologise if I’ve misinterpreted the lad and I’m glad he’s landed a contract. He’s a bit of a godsend for Edinburgh given their dearth at flyhalf and seems pretty decent. So is more polite to not to respond to a poster that kindly posted links to various articles? I can only given an honest appraisal of the information put before me. The legal intervention and the somewhat inflammatory language used by the previous sports minister are certainly good points, well made. I’m not surprised some people read that and think the government doesn’t have the best interests of society or sport at heart – everyone has a different political take on things. I didn’t mean to indicate the previous sports minister was a flash in the pan, only that policy can be changed or implemented differently depending on who is behind the wheel at any given time. I feel there have been indications that the current sports minister is perhaps a bit more consensual than the last guy. As for the use of the word “sides”, I’d hoped that was pretty clear (but obviously not). On the one hand a player that I felt was insinuating that opportunities are limited at home due to government policy and on the other a player that feels government policy is inadequate in identifying and harnessing talent in townships. Too much interventions vs too little. Of course my point is undermined by not being able to find the article on van der Walt but I held my hand up to that. And I say above, I stand corrected and it may be he was alluding to the financial cuts at the Lions (which I wasn’t aware of). As for my evidence that the South African economy has not grown since the global financial crisis. Is that really contentious too? We’ve had so called “austerity” (i.e. reductions to public spending) all over Europe for a decade, even though the EU GDP has still managed to grow during that period. Googling GDP for South Africa sadly doesn’t paint the rosiest of pictures in recent years, certainly worse than the overall EU. If they are remotely accurate then I struggle to see how there can have been extra money going into the treasury to pay for the sort of programmes that advocates of transformation would want. I can’t think of an example of a government that was able to roll out a raft of social programmes at a time when the economy and budget is contracting. When I talk about “swapping 18 years of life” and life chances of my two imaginary people, I am drawing a comparison on the average wealth and opportunities of different ethnic groupings. Just because 90% of the country is black and there is large number of black middle class kids doesn’t change the situation of the average situation (or mathematical “mean” if you prefer). I take on board the point that there will be many middle class black kids who don’t need scholarships and bursaries and may even be wealthier than middle class white kids who get overlooked due to education policy on admissions. That would be an unfortunate circumstance if a privileged black kid was admitted at the expense of say a disadvantaged white kid. I’ll confess I don’t have enough knowledge of South African education admission policies to know if such a thing could be possible. So to return to my point, and replicate the example to Scotland when a kid with a bursary / scholarship gets a spot in a fee paying school and a kid from a family that could have paid that fee is overlooked. I’d argue that you’ve still got more life chances if you are the overlooked kid with the parents who can pay many thousands of pounds a year on your education (than the kid with the scholarship / bursary). So I can make the same point as I intended using a completely non-racial example. I appreciate I could have been clearer on that point and spelled it out fully, but I was trying (and failing) to be concise! I will tread with more care in future. I think the bit I was closest to talking BS about was about Dlulane, if there was any sort of policy back in 2003/04. There sure didn’t look like it to a neutral. I’ve still not had time to look at the legal documents sadly. But 2018 is still young! [/QUOTE]
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