Super Rugby Aotearoa: Round 1 - [13 - 14 June 2020]

[Umaga's Witness]

Both these teams were substantially better at the breakdown and in their defensive organisation compared to yesterday's teams. The hurricanes simply had no dynamism or creativity on attack. Good defence by the blues but the canes need to get better, they're missing Jordie badly, but they're also needing some of the forwards to step up their running game, and the interplay between forwards and backs need to improve significantly.

it will be interesting to see if the next game has a similar number of penalties

question, if there going to take a hard line with the not releasing penalties, do we think it might run smoother if it was just a free kick? some of the ones given last night we 100% on the money technically but in reality were fractions of a second.

Or,

Do we think we're just going to start seeing trying to place it as they go to ground to try and get some distance between the ball and the tackle?

I had started writing some things long those lines but it all got a bit confusing. Problem is the ipppsition are getting in there befor the player has placed the ball. I don't want to allow the tackled player to take forever to place the ball or to prevent the opposition going for it immediately, so maybe you just have two seconds from the moment you are tackled, during which time the opposition can go for it too but the attacking player doesn't get penalised. ??

 

[Kiwiwomble]

Both these teams were substantially better at the breakdown and in their defensive organisation compared to yesterday's teams. The hurricanes simply had no dynamism or creativity on attack. Good defence by the blues but the canes need to get better, they're missing Jordie badly, but they're also needing some of the forwards to step up their running game, and the interplay between forwards and backs need to improve significantly.

I had started writing some things long those lines but it all got a bit confusing. Problem is the ipppsition are getting in there befor the player has placed the ball. I don't want to allow the tackled player to take forever to place the ball or to prevent the opposition going for it immediately, so maybe you just have two seconds from the moment you are tackled, during which time the opposition can go for it too but the attacking player doesn't get penalised. ??

i dont think you can have a time thing as then you have to define the second you're tackled, knee hits the groud? elbow? i like the current definition, a clear lift of the ball by a legal defender

There was a good example in the blues game, cant remember who did it but as soon as they knew they were being tackled they slammed it on the ground and let himself be tackled a good meter away from the ball, halfback was right there and the ball fired off

i didn;t actually mind the whistle blows as it still seemed to flow pretty quickly, i dont have a problem with pens if they dont slow the game too much

 

[Umaga's Witness]

i dont think you can have a time thing as then you have to define the second you're tackled, knee hits the groud? elbow? i like the current definition, a clear lift of the ball by a legal defender

There was a good example in the blues game, cant remember who did it but as soon as they knew they were being tackled they slammed it on the ground and let himself be tackled a good meter away from the ball, halfback was right there and the ball fired off

i didn;t actually mind the whistle blows as it still seemed to flow pretty quickly, i dont have a problem with pens if they dont slow the game too much

Yeah it's tough and you'd have to define the tackle like you say. I think in the first half of the blues hurricanes games the players were quite exceptional compared to those in the previous game, showing there is promise the laws can work. I think the refs have to continue being vigilant, I just think there is some more thought required on how to ensure the game doesn't stop too often when the opposition goes for a turnover. I don't think giving free kicks will make it better, as that just means less incentive for the tackled player to release the ball. And yeah, I remember seeing that instant you were talking about. Does show promise. It's probably worth waiting and seeing how the next few weeks progress.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

Yeah it's tough and you'd have to define the tackle like you say. I think in the first half of the blues hurricanes games the players were quite exceptional compared to those in the previous game, showing there is promise the laws can work. I think the refs have to continue being vigilant, I just think there is some more thought required on how to ensure the game doesn't stop too often when the opposition goes for a turnover. I don't think giving free kicks will make it better, as that just means less incentive for the tackled player to release the ball. And yeah, I remember seeing that instant you were talking about. Does show promise. It's probably worth waiting and seeing how the next few weeks progress.

Loosing the ball isn't incentive?

I think just righting the wrong (in this Hm case giving them the ball they were denied) rather than a punishment might be an attitude that could help some if the rules in rugby

 

[Umaga's Witness]

Loosing the ball isn't incentive?

I think just righting the wrong (in this Hm case giving them the ball they were denied) rather than a punishment might be an attitude that could help some if the rules in rugby

If you go back to before they started being vigilant against the tacklers releasing the tackled player, that's where you see the best analogy to what they are trying to do here. Back then, there were a lot of penalties against players holding on, think the day of the fetcher. Back then, a penalty wasn't sufficient disincentive. Then and more recently, the tackled player, and the coaches telling them what they should do, have much preferred to give away a penalty. How often do you see players "win a penalty" vs get a clean turnover? Winning penalties is far more prevalent.

I think if they blatantly don't release that's just as penalisable as any other offence, if not more. It's those more subjective ones, or when the opposition gets a turnover but it takes them a while, that might warrant something other than a penalty.

Maybe they could do something similar to league with their extra set of 6. Instead of a penalty, give them two consecutive possessions, in that they get the ball back via a free kick when they turn it over.

don't know. I just know that the current incentives look like they might work at least a lot of the time so I'm happy to wait and see.

 

[unrated]

I liked last night's match so much that I just watched it for a second time on ESPN+. And it was still exciting even though I knew what the outcome would be.

Here's my prediction for the future of Super Rugby. I think the Jaguares will join SLAR (the new South American league) and the Western Force will do well in Super Rugby AU this summer and then sign on with Super Rugby full time after that. So we'll have the 4 teams in South Africa, 5 in New Zealand and 5 in Australia once again. As I look into my crystal ball I see this happening next year or in 2022 at the latest.

South Africa would never play in a competition where a country with a weaker rugby system gets more teams than us.

 

[TheOvalBall]

Blues vs Hurricanes was a real tough encounter. It was a really good match. Blues were deserved winners.

 

[The Seeker]

South Africa would never play in a competition where a country with a weaker rugby system gets more teams than us.

You can always add another team or entice one of the teams that joined Pro14 to come back. There doesn't seem to be much loyalty in profe$$ional sports anyway.

 

[The Seeker]

Blues vs Hurricanes was a real tough encounter. It was a really good match. Blues were deserved winners.

I picked the Hurricanes to win, but I'm glad the Blues won because of all the fans that showed up. I hope all 5 teams win their home opener (2 down, 3 to go) for the sake of their fans. New Zealand was very proactive when it came to Covid 19 (unlike Trumpanzeeville where I live) and they deserve some happiness. It doesn't mean I'll pick all home teams to win, but I hope they will.

Go Highlanders!

 

[TheOvalBall]

I read somewhere someone said by the end of week 10 players will be out of their feet. That can't be right, can it ? Every team will seem to have a bye every other weekend or so, and only 4 teams play each weekend.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

I read somewhere someone said by the end of week 10 players will be out of their feet. That can't be right, can it ? Every team will seem to have a bye every other weekend or so, and only 4 teams play each weekend.

I think the idea is these nz v nz games are considered to be tougher on the players so having them all in a 10 run will be gruelling

 

[The Seeker]

​

Saturday, 13 June 2020

Venue: Forsyth Barr Stadium
Time: 09:05 CAT (SA, GMT+2)
​

Sunday, 14 June 2020

Venue: Eden Park
Time: 05:05 CAT (SA, GMT+2)​

Can you please start the round 2 thread. I'm so hungry for more rugby that the anticipation is killing me. FEED ME!

 

[The Seeker]

I think the idea is these nz v nz games are considered to be tougher on the players so having them all in a 10 run will be gruelling

Super Rugby is my favorite of the pro leagues. But if it should ever fail I think the New Zealand teams could survive on their own in a 5 or 6 team league. There's so much great talent down there that they'd be fine.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

Super Rugby is my favorite of the pro leagues. But if it should ever fail I think the New Zealand teams could survive on their own in a 5 or 6 team league. There's so much great talent down there that they'd be fine.

personally i think id just get a bit bored, i think we'd just fall back to mitre 10 cup

 

[The Seeker]

personally i think id just get a bit bored, i think we'd just fall back to mitre 10 cup

I've only had access to Super Rugby for three years now, ever since they signed the streaming deal with ESPN+. Thanks for the history lesson, I appreciate it and enjoy learning more about international rugby.

 

[Kiwiwomble]

I've only had access to Super Rugby for three years now, ever since they signed the streaming deal with ESPN+. Thanks for the history lesson, I appreciate it and enjoy learning more about international rugby.

hey, not so much a history lesson, Mitre 10 cup is still going, thats our full domestic comp, you as a Highlanders fan would support either Otago, Southland or North Otago, they are the three regions "covered", informally now, by the Highanders

apologies if ive misunderstood and you already knew that

 

[The Seeker]

hey, not so much a history lesson, Mitre 10 cup is still going, thats our full domestic comp, you as a Highlanders fan would support either Otago, Southland or North Otago, they are the three regions "covered", informally now, by the Highanders

apologies if ive misunderstood and you already knew that

No apologies necessary. Prior to ESPN+ carrying Super Rugby, MLR and Pro14 for the past three years, the only rugby I had access to was the USA Eagles (once in awhile) and the college championships in Philadelphia, both on NBC. Which wasn't much at all. Things have picked up a lot in the past three years though. And World Rugby streams a lot of international play for free which is nice. https://www.world.rugby/?lang=en

BTW, I'd be an Otago fan since you have their logo showing.

 

[mania]

im really enjoying the rugby if not the results. its nice to have some high scoring high octane games. and its only 2 games a weekn i gotta watch.
took my kids to the game on sunday. was pretty chilled and great atmosphere, albeit not the sell out i expected.
whats up with daneColes and his lineout throws? he needs to get back in touch with mealamu and brush up on his throws

 

[Kiwiwomble]

im really enjoying the rugby if not the results. its nice to have some high scoring high octane games. and its only 2 games a weekn i gotta watch.
took my kids to the game on sunday. was pretty chilled and great atmosphere, albeit not the sell out i expected.
whats up with daneColes and his lineout throws? he needs to get back in touch with mealamu and brush up on his throws

exactly, thats why coltman has struggled to make the next step, hes great around the park, with ball in hand...but his lineouts can be rough...you just cant expect to keep getting picked if you're not doing one of your key roles