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2024 Guinness Six Nations
Predicted 6N table 2020
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<blockquote data-quote="Ragey Erasmus" data-source="post: 984232" data-attributes="member: 56232"><p>I suggest you stop being so condescending, you are not some rugby guru and it's beginning to grate. Yes the source of points does matter, how the hell can you say it doesn't? You're trying to make out England were not even in the game yet the minor inconvenience to that argument is all of SA's early points were from penalties off scrums from unforced knock-ons. That is very different to the fact England's penalties all came from open play and ruck penalties (ie when we were threatening SA and they infringed to stop it). When a player drops the ball way behind the gainline without an opposition player nearby that is an unforced error and has nothing to do with being battered up front. It WAS different to the Ireland game because we scored multiple tries off moves we created, we did not score all our points off the Irish randomly spilling the ball. How on earth can you try to claim I'm the one being biased here? The 2 games were completely different. England were still in the SA game, Ireland were not in the England game at all.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Except it was. You said if England are being beaten up front they don't have the rugby IQ to still get a win. That applies to all teams.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>And we had also beaten Wales 4 times on the bounce, all tight games but you decide to pick the time we do lose (both away games too) as your evidence whilst ignoring all the rest? Every game we have played against Wales has been tight, bar an international in 2018 I think where we mashed them. You have ignored what 6 odd games in this world cup cycle and instead focused on the one we lost? Again, who is being biased here? We lost a tight game to Ireland but again have won tight games against Ireland, ignoring all those. We have had multiple games against Australia that have been very high intensity with English forwards losing on pretty much every stat yet we still won. We had games against France where our forwards were on the back foot and we still won. If we want to talk bullshit, the idea that England can't win tight games is the bullshit. The problem with England is completely switching off and making errors they do not make in other games. The Scotland game is a fine example, that was not even close to a tight game before the slide started.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes I know, but this is a prediction thread so it needs to be based on something. England have had the best recent form, have put in the most convincing wins in the last year, have the same coach and have the 2 big games at home.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>But saying England got dominated in the final and NZ didn't turn up is just fine? If you want to make that claim, you have no right to start throwing a hissy fit and saying double standard. You are free to make that claim if you want, or you are free to not and claim double standard but you are not free to do both without getting called out on it. I mean you are trying to claim England may not be that much better despite us beating Ireland in every area last year. That would be like us English saying Ireland weren't better last year, which at the time would have been clearly ridiculous. Is there a chance it could change this year? Certainly, but at the moment there is nothing to suggest that.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yeah they won no trophies in the last 2 years but they have won 2 trophies in the last 4, which is more than Wales or Ireland. Where you decide to draw the line can distort things however you want. Last 4 years England have had the 2nd highest number of wins in the world, last year we are 2nd in world cup, beaten New Zealand and set record scores. 2 years, those stats all drop. You have chosen 2 years as it conveniently includes England's lowest period and excludes their best period but also don't choose 1 as that would also be beneficial for England.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ragey Erasmus, post: 984232, member: 56232"] I suggest you stop being so condescending, you are not some rugby guru and it's beginning to grate. Yes the source of points does matter, how the hell can you say it doesn't? You're trying to make out England were not even in the game yet the minor inconvenience to that argument is all of SA's early points were from penalties off scrums from unforced knock-ons. That is very different to the fact England's penalties all came from open play and ruck penalties (ie when we were threatening SA and they infringed to stop it). When a player drops the ball way behind the gainline without an opposition player nearby that is an unforced error and has nothing to do with being battered up front. It WAS different to the Ireland game because we scored multiple tries off moves we created, we did not score all our points off the Irish randomly spilling the ball. How on earth can you try to claim I'm the one being biased here? The 2 games were completely different. England were still in the SA game, Ireland were not in the England game at all. Except it was. You said if England are being beaten up front they don't have the rugby IQ to still get a win. That applies to all teams. And we had also beaten Wales 4 times on the bounce, all tight games but you decide to pick the time we do lose (both away games too) as your evidence whilst ignoring all the rest? Every game we have played against Wales has been tight, bar an international in 2018 I think where we mashed them. You have ignored what 6 odd games in this world cup cycle and instead focused on the one we lost? Again, who is being biased here? We lost a tight game to Ireland but again have won tight games against Ireland, ignoring all those. We have had multiple games against Australia that have been very high intensity with English forwards losing on pretty much every stat yet we still won. We had games against France where our forwards were on the back foot and we still won. If we want to talk bullshit, the idea that England can't win tight games is the bullshit. The problem with England is completely switching off and making errors they do not make in other games. The Scotland game is a fine example, that was not even close to a tight game before the slide started. Yes I know, but this is a prediction thread so it needs to be based on something. England have had the best recent form, have put in the most convincing wins in the last year, have the same coach and have the 2 big games at home. But saying England got dominated in the final and NZ didn't turn up is just fine? If you want to make that claim, you have no right to start throwing a hissy fit and saying double standard. You are free to make that claim if you want, or you are free to not and claim double standard but you are not free to do both without getting called out on it. I mean you are trying to claim England may not be that much better despite us beating Ireland in every area last year. That would be like us English saying Ireland weren't better last year, which at the time would have been clearly ridiculous. Is there a chance it could change this year? Certainly, but at the moment there is nothing to suggest that. Yeah they won no trophies in the last 2 years but they have won 2 trophies in the last 4, which is more than Wales or Ireland. Where you decide to draw the line can distort things however you want. Last 4 years England have had the 2nd highest number of wins in the world, last year we are 2nd in world cup, beaten New Zealand and set record scores. 2 years, those stats all drop. You have chosen 2 years as it conveniently includes England's lowest period and excludes their best period but also don't choose 1 as that would also be beneficial for England. [/QUOTE]
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