On Old people creeping in at night, leaving present for the little ones.

[Laetca]

Next week (thursday, December 6th to be exact) is Sinterklaas/Sint-Niklaas/Sint-Nicholas here. This is basically an old man, riding a horse, going from roof top to roof top, with his helper (Zwarte Piet), to give all the children that have been good all year a present (or nowadays, multiple presents). He comes from Spain, and leaves satsumas, marzipan, and speculoos (a sort of cookie, not sure about the name in English). Kids traditionally leave their shoe for him to fill, and put a few things ready to give in return, usually a carrot and a lump of sugar (for the horse), a pint (for the helper), and coffee for the Sint. (Sint meant Saint, but it's become a noun in this meaning, rather than an adjective). Kids who have behaved badly will supposedly go with Piet in his bag, and traditionally get a beating.

I know that the US and UK have Santaclause, who does basically the same, only that kids leave their sock up, they leave milk and cookies, he has a different way of transporting himself, and kids ocasionally see mommy kissing the old bloke. It's also a different date, December 25th.

In Spain I know they have Reyes, on January 6th, the three wise men coming from the east to give baby jesus gifts. I think it also involves shoes, since we once got a photograph from an aunt in Spain, showing her eldest trying to pry candy out of a shoe.

What I'm wondering now is, are these the only three forms of old people leaving gifts for children who have been good?
And also, where does this idea come from?
Saint Nicholas used to be a Bishop in Turkey many many centuries ago, he was declared holy after a miracle when he revived a few kids.
SantaClause, no idea, I only know that he got his outfit thanks to the Coca Cola Company.
Los Reyes (which mean the kings), no idea. I only know that each year they're persent in the parade.

Does anyone else have similar stories?
And did you get gifts when you were younger? Or for people with Children, are you joining in on it?

 

[St Helens RLFC]

All I know is that if I left my shoe to be filled, I wouln't get a single thing any year, ever! They are like nuclear reactors!

 

[Laetca]

XD

I'm guessing you're a wee bit old for it anyway. Abd I don't really remember ever putting my shoe, I just remember mom brewing a pot of cfee, and my brother and me putting other stuff ready, like the carrot and such xD

You're saying there's no such think in England, and you never got anything?

 

[St Helens RLFC]

No, you're quite right, we have Santa Claus who visits on December 25th. It's one of England's biggest days.

 

[Laetca]

To think that day was actually about the human form of a deity coming to save us all.

It's really gone a long way before ending up here I guess.

 

[St Helens RLFC]

It has become a commercial festival, not a religious one. I am religious enough, but I don't profess to be the most fanatical (thankfully) person you'll ever meet.

Personally I love this time of the year because:

A) I get to see all my family, together, on several occasions.
B) I receive an almost unlimited supply of chocolate. Only almost unlimited sadly.

 

[fcukernaut]

Growing up I never had any problem with the idea of Santa Claus, because the old ******* gave me presents. But now? I think I do. Who else finds it disturbing that a reclusive old man spends his time spying on little children? It's sounds to me like an episode Dateline NBC: to Catch a Predator or the old perve on family guy.

 

[shtove]

Santa Claus = San Nicklaus = Saint Nicholas.

This is really a German thing, with the toys and elves etc. Christmas trees were introduced to England through a German royal family, and Charles Dickens ramped up the sentiment with his story telling. When the Americans got involved, it turned in to a great marketing opportunity. To get past all the nonsense, you really need to celebrate with a Catholic family and attend midnight mass while sober. It also helps if you're a believer in Christ.

I'm looking forward to the endless radio repeats of Shane McGowan's Fairytale of New York - and all the women saying, "That Kirsty McColl, she's dead now - killed by a man. Merry Christmas!"

Funniest thing about the festivities is when people go bananas - little girls over their "barby what speaks" presents, and grandads raking in penny bets from the card games.

Oh yeah - turkey or goose? Turkey is a 'Jonny come lately' - we are gooooosers ... which causes loud farting and a succulent atmosphere.

 

[St Helens RLFC]

Never had goose. I was actually watching a programme about it the other day comparing the two meats.

 

[Laetca]

shtove, most of what you posted wizzed right by me, meaning I didn't get it

I decided to make turkey this christmas eve, never tried to prepare one before. It will also be the first time I'm responsible of amain course.
Does anyone have good tips on that?

A friend of mine believes that the origins of Christmas lies in Scandinavia, where the witch doctor would make housecalls in winter, but as the door of the tents was snowed shut, he had to go through the hole in the roof to get in. He would also leave little things, like medicinal herbs and such.

It's true that Germans go further in Christmas stuff, decorations and tradition and such.

 

[shtove]

shtove, most of what you posted wizzed right by me, meaning I didn't get it [/b]

Sorry Laetca!

Fairytale of New York:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltiY-BqvOIU

Written by the best song writer in English for ... ooh, ages. If you listen to UK radio, you will hear this at least FIVE TIMES A DAY in the run up to Christmas. And it still has an effect.

Kirsty MacColl, who sings the duet with him, was killed by some playboy speed boater while on holiday in the Carribean - so people like to talk about the horrible unfairness of that incident when the song comes on:

http://www.kirstymaccoll.com/information/m...erald/index.htm

The secret to turkey is to keep it from drying out through over roasting. Put foil on top, and use plenty of bacon stuffing. Next year, you can have the mighty goose.

And the best entertainment at Christmas comes from low-stakes card games: it lets you spend hours in the company of relatives without coming to blows. Just make sure there's plenty of wine in the cellar.

 

[Laetca]

About 100 bottles, and hardly anyone here drinks wine here!
Had an exquisite FaustinoI from 1991 this evening though, it's a true pleasure for all my senses. Well, mostly smell and taste.

Thank you for explaining everything so extensively though, +rep!

 

[shtove]

About 100 bottles, and hardly anyone here drinks wine here!
Had an exquisite FaustinoI from 1991 this evening though, it's a true pleasure for all my senses. Well, mostly smell and taste.

Thank you for explaining everything so extensively though, +rep!
[/b]

Yeah, I like Faustino. Merry Christmas!

 

[redunderthebed]

"sneaking into little kids rooms he's a f**king pedophile" - I love kevin bloody wilson. :lol:

I'm an Atheist and dont really care about religious stuff......

Christmas is all about get ****** and eating lots. :cheers:

 

[St Helens RLFC]

"sneaking into little kids rooms he's a f**king pedophile" - I love kevin bloody wilson. :lol: [/b]

:lol:



Ho ho f**ing ho what a crock of ****, we all work for Santa Claus we've had enough we quit :lol: :lol:

 

[redunderthebed]

<div class='quotemain'> "sneaking into little kids rooms he's a f**king pedophile" - I love kevin bloody wilson. :lol: [/b]

:lol:



Ho ho f**ing ho what a crock of ****, we all work for Santa Claus we've had enough we quit :lol: :lol:

[/b][/quote]

Classic song and the best christmas song ever got it on CD.

He made a christmas album i MUST get it one day.

Kids who have behaved badly will supposedly go with Piet in his bag, and traditionally get a beating.
[/b]

So once a year corporal punishment is back and parents can beat the **** out of there kids. :lol:

Considering i was a little **** when i was younger that thought is scary.

 

[loratadine]

a pint (for the helper)[/b]

i think he helper is somewhat of a legend... and im guessing hes pretty drunk by the time hes finnished and in no fit state to help out anyone :/

 

[Laetca]

True There's been a lot of protest on the helper being a black man, since people consider this a racist, but in reality it's always a white guy who's been painted black, because he's just black from all the soot that gets stuck to him when climbing through chimneys and such.

I admit I'm a sucker for traditional Christmas stuff, including cookies, music, decorations, cards, food, ...
My exams are in January though, so I can't really enjoy it now, but as soon as I finished my studies, I'll be making a Gingerbread House for Christmas!

Loratadine, don't you think the old man himself is a legend?

I don't remember any kid ever getting a beating, it's just something that survives in songs and such.

 

[O'Rothlain]

Christmas is "Christ Mass." I don't believe you can fully take that away regardless of your religious views. If you enjoy Christmas you enjoy the principals of peace on earth, good will toward men, and the idea of giving. It's a season of love, of family and being better. Why? Because for the Christian this is how we are inspired by the arival of Diety in Human form. Coming to give us the ultimate gift. So, while it is secularized, and marketed, those principals vaguely lie in the background. Saint Nicholaus (Santa Claus, Father Christmas, Sinterclaus, ect...) embodies this idea again. He was indeed a bishop of Asia Minor (around the area of Turkey). He has come to embody gift giving and compassion towards children. His feast day is 06 December, which is what Laetca is refering to in her original post. So, in most of the Catholic World, his day is celebrated then. In the more British influenced sector of the world (England, the UK, Ireland, America) the two days (Christmas and St. Nicholaus Day) have been sort of combined.
Coca Cola did indeed give him his facelift that you know as the American version of Santa Claus. I, personally, prefer the Father Christmas figure...I like the throwback sort of thing (probably why I study history). It's all great fun, and motivates children to be on their best behavior. In my opinion it's all good as long as we don't lose the religious roots to the holiday (which actualy comes from the word 'Holy Day'). The Roman Empire (after the adoption of Christianity) and the Early Roman Catholic Church were very good at incorporating pagan rituals and giving them new christian meanings. Which meant you could have your cake and eat it too.

 

[Laetca]

But isn't that hypocrisy then? First adopting pagan rituals, like Yule, which is one of the eight major wiccan/pagan holidays, and then calling it christmas, taking over the yule log and everything?
I mean, honestly, the first person to be certain of the birth date of Jesus is yet to be born. Considering Christ was born six yeard Before Christ (or wsas it 6AD?).

Anyway, on the one hand, you're adopting pagan rituals, so people will find it easier to step over to your cult (christianity) and then a few centuries later, you're trying to kill all heathens? Even if this includes people who believe in the same god, but simply refusdet to accept the pope as his highest in command here on earth.