New Zealand Player Drain

[mdaclarke]

After watching the Chiefs this morning I was wondering if the player drain from New Zealand to Europe was starting to have an impact. I've always thought that New Zealand is ultimately more vulnerable to this than South Africa and maybe it is starting to show.

This is only a portent to come of what will happen in the South Africans go North and take their TV money with them.

 

[snoopy snoopy dog dog]

This is kind of related to the point about the player drain and need for more funds on Australia and New Zealand. What are ticket prices like in New Zealand?

I saw a post elsewhere saying that he bought a ticket to Melbourne Rebels for just A$19 (around NZ$20, £10 or €12). As a comparison, my ticket to a Leinster game last night cost twice that for a similar view. The average wage in Melbourne and Dublin is roughly similar.

Are ticket prices being undervalued in Australasia? That's one way to increase revenue and pay players enough to make them want to stay.

 

[unrated]

I think because the Australian games are so uneratended it wont be a good public signal if they hike the prices.

On another note i tried looking up Australian Super rugby attendaces vs Irish ones in the pro 14 and was suprised to learn that Super rugby is the best attended club/franchise rugby competition in the world.

Super rugby averages 19,163 people per game
The top 14 is next up with 14,341 average
3rd is the premiership in England with 14,165
Then its the Currie cup with 11,125
and lastly its the Pro 14 with 8,561

But i dont think Australia contributes much to these numbers so i would still say dont raise the gate fees otherwise more people might go to aussie rules

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

Personally I think Chiefs is down to coaching more than anything.

 

[SomeOke]

Player drain is certainly a problem for super rugby in particular, that said it's been three weeks, Chiefs are rebuilding basically an entire team. Let's not panic just yet.

 

[Leinster Fan]

I think because the Australian games are so uneratended it wont be a good public signal if they hike the prices.

On another note i tried looking up Australian Super rugby attendaces vs Irish ones in the pro 14 and was suprised to learn that Super rugby is the best attended club/franchise rugby competition in the world.

Super rugby averages 19,163 people per game
The top 14 is next up with 14,341 average
3rd is the premiership in England with 14,165
Then its the Currie cup with 11,125
and lastly its the Pro 14 with 8,561

But i dont think Australia contributes much to these numbers so i would still say dont raise the gate fees otherwise more people might go to aussie rules

In fairness Leinster, Munster and Ulster have far higher attendances than the rest of the Pro14 (Glasgow are stuck in a stadium that's far too small for them as well). Welsh regional rugby in particular has massive problems regarding public interest. I think the average attendance in the Heineken Cup (probably the best comparison with Super Rugby) is around 15,000 mark so SH attendance is definitely higher. There a lot more games and teams in the NH though and that definitely more than offsets the gap.

 

[Gena_ZA]

Is the southern hemisphere stadiums not bigger on average as well?
Football is also less of a competition down south for attendance in a struggling world economy (my direct circle view)

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

This should help.

All Blacks: Mega money deal with US firm Silver Lake approved

New Zealand Rugby’s $NZ200 million deal with US private equity firm Silver Lake has been approved following a vote by rugby delegates on Thursday.

www.planetrugby.com

What are the presumed downsides of private equity? Pressure to play more friendlies in lucrative markets?

 

[mdaclarke]

This should help.

All Blacks: Mega money deal with US firm Silver Lake approved

New Zealand Rugby’s $NZ200 million deal with US private equity firm Silver Lake has been approved following a vote by rugby delegates on Thursday.

www.planetrugby.com

What are the presumed downsides of private equity? Pressure to play more friendlies in lucrative markets?

I would guess it is the pressure to agree to a Global Calendar and Nations League.

In terms of lucrative markets I can only think of USA and Japan as places that they can go.

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

I mean is the player drain that bad anymore?

 

[Bruce_ma gooshvili]

I mean is the player drain that bad anymore?

They've been doing well keeping most of their internationals, probably due to all the exhibition games the various AB sides play (see old codgers ABs infront of 40k Spaniards a couple of weeks ago).

But...

McKenzie among 100 Kiwis set for Japan Rugby League One - NZ Sports Wire

All Blacks fullback Damian McKenzie will make his first appearance in Japan rugby this weekend as the new-look competition also debuts.

www.nzsportswire.com

 

[Umaga's Witness]

I mean is the player drain that bad anymore?

What makes you consider it might be less now than what it was?

 

[LeinsterMan (NotTigsMan)]

What makes you consider it might be less now than what it was?

Because unlike in 2019 the sabbatical in Japan seems to be pretty common now.
Certainly the amount of NZ in europe has seemed to drop imo.

 

[Umaga's Witness]

Because unlike in 2019 the sabbatical in Japan seems to be pretty common now.
Certainly the amount of NZ in europe has seemed to drop imo.

Hmmm. I think you are right that sabbaticals in Japan help to keep some players, but we are still losing players, including to Japan. I think the Japan sides don't want to give sabbatical contracts except to the very top level players.

In terms of capped all blacks in their prime we have recently lost laumape, hemopo, Karl, for example, and we do seem to lose quite a few starting or close to starting super rugby players. Hard to tell if this is more or less than previous. I think the COVID situation helped reduce player drain so it will be interesting to see what happens in the next few years.

Moana pacifika could help strengthen the super rugby sides too because the limits on non-NZ eligible players in super rugby mean as soon as PI New Zealanders decide to play for their country of heritage, they would previously have limited their ability to continue to play super rugby.

But not playing South African teams is a bigger hindrance than player drain

 

[Dan54]

After watching the Chiefs this morning I was wondering if the player drain from New Zealand to Europe was starting to have an impact. I've always thought that New Zealand is ultimately more vulnerable to this than South Africa and maybe it is starting to show.

This is only a portent to come of what will happen in the South Africans go North and take their TV money with them.

In answer to question, yes the player drain to europe is having an impact and has for a few years.
There is now something like 660 professional rugby players from NZ playing the game outside of NZ, while many are in lower grades etc, there are enugh to impact the depth here.