Ma'a Nonu's season over

[Kapa O Pango]

http://tvnz.co.nz/rugby-news/ma-nonu-s-season-over-6080076

Looks like Nonu going to miss the entire season for the rest of the year after suffering broken forearm in last night's victory over South Africa.

 

[nzlizard]

Oh well, SBW be here for the end of year tour and Crotty or Fekitoa can stand in until then.

Bo great loss.

 

[smartcooky]

Before he went to hospital, Nonu arranged for someone to go into the Springbok dressing room while the game was still on, and hang his All Black 12 jersey on Jean de Villiers' clothes hook as a gesture for his 100th match

A true act of sportsmanship!

 

[William18]

I'm glad the AB's showed a lot of respect to JdV - a true legend. As has been said I don't think we lose that much without Nonu. He may not go to the RWC next year if he can't up his form. Leaving him out would be a big call but there is lots of competition for centre spots.

 

[Icemn]

i'd prefer malakai, because SBW only comes back world cup times, we can rather invest in malakai, i wouldn't mind tamati Ellison but he is out of contention

nonu is a big loss but it might be a blessing in disguise... As nonu form has not been great but he is preferred for his experience, so this is valuable time that malakai needs... I hope he gets a run over and above ryan crotty...

 

[nickdnz]

At this stage I'd be happy for Fekitoa to play the game against Argentina, but I'd much prefer Crotty against the Boks. Fekitoa still hasn't shown he has any game sense. It's great that he backs himself, but he puts the team under pressure by not knowing when to pass. I've never thought Crotty to be a spectacular player, but he's making the right decisions at the right times and doesn't have any obvious flaws, which is pretty much all you can ask of him. At this stage I'd quite happily have Crotty over Ma'a Nonu in any given team.

 

[Darwin]

At this stage I'd be happy for Fekitoa to play the game against Argentina, but I'd much prefer Crotty against the Boks. Fekitoa still hasn't shown he has any game sense. It's great that he backs himself, but he puts the team under pressure by not knowing when to pass. I've never thought Crotty to be a spectacular player, but he's making the right decisions at the right times and doesn't have any obvious flaws, which is pretty much all you can ask of him. At this stage I'd quite happily have Crotty over Ma'a Nonu in any given team.

I remember telling you a few years ago that Crotty was a pretty handy player

I've never been convinced Crotty was a long term option for the AB's, but the way Crotty has been playing this season I'm starting to think he could get quite a few tests for the AB's. Like Conrad Smith he always seems to do the right thing at the right time, is an excellent communicator (both on attack and defense), has excellent leadership skills, and his running game has really developed in recent seasons. He seems to have been around for ever, but he is only turning 26 in a few weeks time - about the same age as Conrad Smith was when he started to become a fixture in the AB's side. I'm certainly not suggesting that Crotty is in Smith's class yet (or even will get to that level), but I do think Crotty's style of play could be very effective at test level.

At this stage Crotty is still rated behind Nonu (and SBW) for the AB's 12 jersey, but I'm in some ways glad he should get a few more starts to show he wares, as he has been in much better form than Nonu this season. I also see Crotty as the best option to cover 13 should Conrad Smith get injured. I do love Fekitoa's potential, but Crotty is far more ready for test rugby at the moment, and a Nonu/Crotty midfield is far better balanced than a Nonu/Fekitoa midfield. Crotty will probably be lucky to make the RWC squad with SBW returning (and possibly Kahui?), but he is the sort of player I wouldn't mind seeing out on the field in a tight World Cup playoff match....

 

[nickdnz]

I remember telling you a few years ago that Crotty was a pretty handy player

I've never been convinced Crotty was a long term option for the AB's, but the way Crotty has been playing this season I'm starting to think he could get quite a few tests for the AB's. Like Conrad Smith he always seems to do the right thing at the right time, is an excellent communicator (both on attack and defense), has excellent leadership skills, and his running game has really developed in recent seasons. He seems to have been around for ever, but he is only turning 26 in a few weeks time - about the same age as Conrad Smith was when he started to become a fixture in the AB's side. I'm certainly not suggesting that Crotty is in Smith's class yet (or even will get to that level), but I do think Crotty's style of play could be very effective at test level.

At this stage Crotty is still rated behind Nonu (and SBW) for the AB's 12 jersey, but I'm in some ways glad he should get a few more starts to show he wares, as he has been in much better form than Nonu this season. I also see Crotty as the best option to cover 13 should Conrad Smith get injured. I do love Fekitoa's potential, but Crotty is far more ready for test rugby at the moment, and a Nonu/Crotty midfield is far better balanced than a Nonu/Fekitoa midfield. Crotty will probably be lucky to make the RWC squad with SBW returning (and possibly Kahui?), but he is the sort of player I wouldn't mind seeing out on the field in a tight World Cup playoff match....

Haha, well credit where credit is due. That said I think he has improved quite a massive amount this season. I remember at the end of last season he was punching holes in a few backlines (particularly the Canes..), but he looks to be better at running hard at gaps and as you mention, making good decisions. It's funny but he's one of those players that on athleticism and potential I admit I didn't think much of, but when you see every other 12 mess up continuously with either kicking away ball despite not being able to kick, or not knowing what a pass is till it's already 50/50, unexciting but intelligent looks pretty good.

You're very happy with yourself lately Darwin. How did Johnny McNicholl do last season for Crusaders?

 

[Larksea]

Nonu is a class act, he's well and truly a NZ great.

but I also see this as a blessing in disguise.

we have got so used to nonu playing at 12 hes basically had a monopoly on the 12 jersey for years now. their have probably been less than 10 or so tests in the last 8 or so years where someone other than Nonu has worn the 12 jersey for the All Blacks and he has held that position even though for a long time now hes not been he best or form 12 the NZ game.

That one game Crotty started recently basically proved that we are not so reliant on Nonu and infact the guys who are showing better super form than Nonu may actually also be able to to a better job at test level as well.

And another thing that has been proven is that Conrad Smith doesn't need Nonu inside him to play well. Smith is simply a great player in his own right.

Fekitoa may not have the vision of distribution game of Nonu but I'd take him on defense any day. Nonu is generally a lazy defender, sure he make some important tackles but hes also generally been a weak link on defense and he's often lazy/slow to get back into the line after making a tackle. Where players like Crotty, SBW, kahui or Fekitoa make multiple tackles in a row because they get back in line with urgency sometimes when Nonu makes a tackle it literally takes him 3+ phases to get back in line and that's a pet hate of mine. Defense is a numbers game and I sometimes think Nonu has got away being lazy because he has three of the best defenders in history of the game working around him (Carter, McCaw and Conrad).

Crotty is coming into his prime. I've always believed that generally (not always) wingers peak early and midfielders peak late. Crotty i think is 25-26 now and coming into the prime of his career for what could be the next 6 years or so. He has a huge amount of experience for his age because he was young when he broke into top level rugby. Hes always been a good defender and under rated on attack, actually capable of great things on attack. But his decision making has got better and better, he's consistent and i think hes ready for regular test rugby.

 

[Darwin]

Haha, well credit where credit is due. That said I think he has improved quite a massive amount this season. I remember at the end of last season he was punching holes in a few backlines (particularly the Canes..), but he looks to be better at running hard at gaps and as you mention, making good decisions. It's funny but he's one of those players that on athleticism and potential I admit I didn't think much of, but when you see every other 12 mess up continuously with either kicking away ball despite not being able to kick, or not knowing what a pass is till it's already 50/50, unexciting but intelligent looks pretty good.

You're very happy with yourself lately Darwin. How did Johnny McNicholl do last season for Crusaders?

I suppose that proves I can't be right all of the time. Perhaps only 95% of the time I've officially terminated my love affair with Johnny McNicholl, and have learnt a valuable lesson. Never fall in love with a wing (I saying that I'm a massive fan of Visinia....). I have shifted my affections to young Canterbury loosie Tom Sanders, who has more than a touch of Kieran Read about him....

I do seem to be very happy with myself of late don't I. Why wouldn't I though? Life is good. The AB's haven't lost a game since 1932 (from memory?), the Highlanders made the playoffs this year, and Brisbane City are sitting 3rd overall in the National Rugby Championship. I think that is all the teams I support....... :unsure:

EDIT: It appears Fekitoa will be given the first crack in the 12 jersey, with Crotty only joining the AB's squad for the South African leg of the tour to give him more time to recover from his broken jaw (and perhaps get a game under his belt for Canterbury).

 

[nzlizard]

EDIT: It appears Fekitoa will be given the first crack in the 12 jersey, with Crotty only joining the AB's squad for the South African leg of the tour to give him more time to recover from his broken jaw (and perhaps get a game under his belt for Canterbury).

Pretty happy with Fekitoa getting more game time, if we wrap up the RC against Argentina I would love to see Fekitoa start there as well.

I am still a bit concerned about cover for Conrad and the outside backs come the world cup.

 

[Larksea]

I am still a bit concerned about cover for Conrad and the outside backs come the world cup.

I'm not, not anymore that you would be for any of our top regulars, between Barrett, Crotty, Fekitoa and Ben Smith there is enough experienced cover.

 

[Icemn]

Pretty happy with Fekitoa getting more game time, if we wrap up the RC against Argentina I would love to see Fekitoa start there as well.

I am still a bit concerned about cover for Conrad and the outside backs come the world cup.

For centre we have Nonu, SBW, Malakai, Crotty, Ben Smith, Kahui, Piatua, Tamati Ellison ya he is coming back Luke McAllistair

U can have your pick, i'd rather play SBW on centre then on 2nd 5 but ya losing conrad will be a sad day as i feel he is the best centre in world rugby

 

[nzlizard]

I'm not, not anymore that you would be for any of our top regulars, between Barrett, Crotty, Fekitoa and Ben Smith there is enough experienced cover.

Ben Smith is a starter and Fekitoa is pretty green, Crotty is the only solid midfielder you mentioned.

For centre we have Nonu, SBW, Malakai, Crotty, Ben Smith, Kahui, Piatua, Tamati Ellison ya he is coming back Luke McAllistair

U can have your pick, i'd rather play SBW on centre then on 2nd 5 but ya losing conrad will be a sad day as i feel he is the best centre in world rugby

Don't really rate Nonu that much anymore, haven't for a couple of seasons now. as above Ben Smith is a starter, Fekitoa is still green, Kahui is not guaranteed to be here? Piatua doesn't seem to e playing much test rugby lately.


When I say concerned it comes from the fringe players getting exposure, we have heaps of people who can slot in, but surely I can't be only the only who thinks Barrett, Fekitoa, Piatua should be getting more game time than they are and starts as well.

 

[Icemn]

When I say concerned it comes from the fringe players getting exposure, we have heaps of people who can slot in, but surely I can't be only the only who thinks Barrett, Fekitoa, Piatua should be getting more game time than they are and starts as well.

Agree, those 3 might be the future midfield of the AB, barrett 1st-5, Fekitoa 2nd-5 and piatua centre

Man barrett has really stepped up :O i use to rate cruden as being 2nd after carter but Barrett has surely lapped cruden... Even barretts defense has improved, see the tackle he made on Serfontein of all people right on the try line :O surely barrett must start vs arg and SA

But im going off topic, malakai en piatua is not a bad mid at all, i think they need to get more gametime to get used to the structures of how the AB play... They are powerful runners and solid defenders

 

[nzlizard]

Man barrett has really stepped up :O i use to rate cruden as being 2nd after carter but Barrett has surely lapped cruden... Even barretts defense has improved, see the tackle he made on Serfontein of all people right on the try line :O surely barrett must start vs arg and SA

But im going off topic, malakai en piatua is not a bad mid at all, i think they need to get more gametime to get used to the structures of how the AB play... They are powerful runners and solid defenders

Yeah Cruden vs Barrett is always going to be interesting, there is certainly nothing wrong with Crudens defense, he is not the tackler that Barrett is but the commitment to not any less. I still think Cruden has a better game than Barrett but I imagine a lot of that has come form his 20 odd tests at top level, Barret would develop if he had that exposure as well.

I remember saying to a mate a few years ago that I saw Piatua as the next AB centre, however maybe the long term plan could be Fekitoa at centre and Piatua on the wing.

 

[Icemn]

I remember saying to a mate a few years ago that I saw Piatua as the next AB centre, however maybe the long term plan could be Fekitoa at centre and Piatua on the wing.

yes, i also really cant classify Malaika, whether he is a 2nd 5-8 or a centre (13)... maybe he is that good of a player that can slot in anymore... but for some reason i feel malakai is a better centre (13) than a 2nd 5-8...

on the subject of 2nd 5-8's... i've mention some years ago that i have a issue with nonu's form and i would like to see Tim Na-Nai Williams in there... this was before Piatua and malaika came onto the scene...

for some reason Tim (not bateman... the williams one) reminds me of Pita Alitini... maybe its the shocks on the ankles ... but there is something about Wiliams that reminds me of alitini. Tim Na-Nai might be a risk on defence, Alitini's defence was solid and he also had a monster in alama ieremia next to him. So Alitini's loss in weight was catered for in Alama...

if Tim Na-Nai Willaims is on 12 for NZ we need to turn Savea in a centre (13)

 

[Chikwa]

I'm glad the AB's showed a lot of respect to JdV - a true legend. As has been said I don't think we lose that much without Nonu. He may not go to the RWC next year if he can't up his form. Leaving him out would be a big call but there is lots of competition for centre spots.

I don't think Steve Hansen agrees with you at all.