Ben Franks out - Tialata in

[Larksea]

Looks like old ben popped his back pushing too much tin in the gym - I've no idea what the actual story is but that's my guess. Guys who spend a lot of time in the gym, if they get a back injury it's usally because hey have overdone it.

With Franks being able to play both sides that doesn't leave a lot of options for replacements.

IMO Most of the props around NZ that are better than Tialata are looseheads

Tialata is pretty much the only one, Can't say I'm a huge fan of Tialata, at times for the AB's he's been a passenger between scrums, hasn't carried the ball much and doesn't get too many rucks or make many tackles out of the tight unlike the franks brothers or Afoa.

But I think he has been a bit better for wellingtion. Big chance for him, though Ben out may just mean Afoa gets more game time.

One thing I dont like about Tialata is that he's a bit of a liability with his weight & fitness. When he gets an injury or ****le his fitness drops away fast - seems to take a long time to recover. Very good player at his best but his form is very fragile.

Do we have any other options?

 

[Darwin]

Looks like old ben popped his back pushing too much tin in the gym - I've no idea what the actual story is but that's my guess. Guys who spend a lot of time in the gym, if they get a back injury it's usally because hey have overdone it.

With Franks being able to play both sides that doesn't leave a lot of options for replacements.

IMO Most of the props around NZ that are better than Tialata are looseheads

Tialata is pretty much the only one, Can't say I'm a huge fan of Tialata, at times for the AB's he's been a passenger between scrums, hasn't carried the ball much and doesn't get too many rucks or make many tackles out of the tight unlike the franks brothers or Afoa.

But I think he has been a bit better for wellingtion. Big chance for him, though Ben out may just mean Afoa gets more game time.

One thing I dont like about Tialata is that he's a bit of a liability with his weight & fitness. When he gets an injury or ****le his fitness drops away fast - seems to take a long time to recover. Very good player at his best but his form is very fragile.

Do we have any other options?

Personally I'd have loved to have seen them take Toby Smith over - he's been in great form, and is also capable of playing on both sides. Unfortunately, It's probably a year too early for Smith though - he may be a serious contender after next years super 15 though. Another who is capable of playing both sides and has been in good form is Charlie Faumaina, but like Smith he probably needs to have another Super rugby season behind him before he will be considered for the AB's. My conclusion - we didn't really have any other options apart from Tialata in this case, but in a years time we will (hopefully) have a couple more genuine options.

 

[Shaggy]

Just wondering, but has de Melmanche given up playing Prop as well as Hooker, and did he play both sides of the scrum?

I still think he would be a good option for the All Black bench if he can get his lineout throwing out, and it looked like he was throwing wasn't bad in the ITM cup final in difficult conditions.

 

[Nate Dizzle]

Apparently Franks did his back in a stretching session. Props and yoga just don't mix.

 

[Black Heart]

Looks like old ben popped his back pushing too much tin in the gym - I've no idea what the actual story is but that's my guess. Guys who spend a lot of time in the gym, if they get a back injury it's usally because hey have overdone it.

With Franks being able to play both sides that doesn't leave a lot of options for replacements.

IMO Most of the props around NZ that are better than Tialata are looseheads

Tialata is pretty much the only one, Can't say I'm a huge fan of Tialata, at times for the AB's he's been a passenger between scrums, hasn't carried the ball much and doesn't get too many rucks or make many tackles out of the tight unlike the franks brothers or Afoa.

But I think he has been a bit better for wellingtion. Big chance for him, though Ben out may just mean Afoa gets more game time.

One thing I dont like about Tialata is that he's a bit of a liability with his weight & fitness. When he gets an injury or ****le his fitness drops away fast - seems to take a long time to recover. Very good player at his best but his form is very fragile.

Do we have any other options?

I pretty much agree with all of that. Tialata produces very little on the field, especially at test rugby. He's also prone to making silly mistakes like dropping in the ball and having it turned over in the tackle. For his size he should be an excellent front rower but unfortunatly that's not the case. It's a pity Ben Franks never got a run but I suspect Tialata is there solely as cover and so he will get much of the same treatment unless either Owen Franks, Woodcock or Afoa are injured. It would be a waste of time even thinking about giving him a run simply for the novelty of it given that he was never in the framework to begin with (and rightfully so)

 

[Black Heart]

Just wondering, but has de Melmanche given up playing Prop as well as Hooker, and did he play both sides of the scrum?

I still think he would be a good option for the All Black bench if he can get his lineout throwing out, and it looked like he was throwing wasn't bad in the ITM cup final in difficult conditions.

As far as the All Blacks were concerned he was only ever in there as replacement hooker.

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

As far as the All Blacks were concerned he was only ever in there as replacement hooker.

What I've never understood, is that he's a beast around the park, he's a fantastic scrimmager, he played prop for years, so why isn't he being used as prop who can at a stretch play hooker? I'm sure he's a better lineout thrower than Afoa, so it's all a bit odd and annoying.

 

[Black Heart]

What I've never understood, is that he's a beast around the park, he's a fantastic scrimmager, he played prop for years, so why isn't he being used as prop who can at a stretch play hooker? I'm sure he's a better lineout thrower than Afoa, so it's all a bit odd and annoying.

That's Greame Henry for you.

 

[Muzzy]

wow..i've always liked Tialata, he's been a bit unfit in recent games but over the past few years i've always thought he played well, so i'm glad he's back in the team

 

[Darwin]

Just wondering, but has de Melmanche given up playing Prop as well as Hooker, and did he play both sides of the scrum?

I still think he would be a good option for the All Black bench if he can get his lineout throwing out, and it looked like he was throwing wasn't bad in the ITM cup final in difficult conditions.

Yeah de Malmanche can (or at least could) play on both sides of the scrum. He seems to be have been used almost exclusively at hooker for two or so years now - I would quite like the Chiefs to give him some gametime at prop, so they can have both him and Elliot on the park together (though the Chiefs do have an abundance of props in their region...)

 

[Black Heart]

wow..i've always liked Tialata, he's been a bit unfit in recent games but over the past few years i've always thought he played well, so i'm glad he's back in the team

Wouldn't bet my money on him staying for very long though.

 

[nickdnz]

As far as I know Nathan White can't play both sides of the scrum, but it'd have been nice for him to get a test cap. He's certainly earned it. Don't know why Tialata has earned a recall. He's been unconvincing for Wellington in my opinion, with John Schwalger looking the better of the two props. As darwin said, Charlie Faumaina also has been on great form. I think he'd offer the AB's more in the long run, than Tialata.

 

[TRF_Olyy]

Don't rate Tialata at all,
Afoa did very well when coming on against England, so I'd expect (hope) that the ABs will have him involved in the "bigger" games, and use Tialata for the "smaller" games


Also, Tialata is f****ing annoying on twitter

 

[Charles]

Don't rate Tialata at all,
Afoa did very well when coming on against England, so I'd expect (hope) that the ABs will have him involved in the "bigger" games, and use Tialata for the "smaller" games


Also, Tialata is f****ing annoying on twitter

+1

Didn't want to rain on anyone's parade but he is kak. Which is why he was conveniently left out of the squad...

 

[nickdnz]

Yeah, Tialata has and always will be useless. He's a solid enough scrummager, but nothing spectacular. He hits the rucks like he's got a bad case of sun burn, and any time he gets the ball he'll either throw a bad pass or try and do a little side step, in which he obviously gets driven back. I'm a Canes supporter, and even I don't like Tialata. The final straw on be getting sick of the guy, is when he said he'd do a Twitter post, during an All Black game at half time. If that's not taking your position for granted, then what is?

Plenty of better props in New Zealand than Tialata.

 

[Larksea]

from the first game I saw Toby Smith play I've thought he looks like a future all black - I didn't know he could play both sides though, I've only seen him play loosehead. And after keeping ben may on the bench in ITM cup he may be ready sooner rather than later.

Good point about Faumauina (sp) he may have been a better choice for the future compared to Tialata. Better around the field for sure, but I really dont rate Tialata much around the field.

I think Aled is awesome, he is one bad arsed dude. but from what I've seen of his proping it's only just good enough for super14 at a pinch. Not test standard IMO

Nathan White is an unlikely choice, but I have to agree I'd rate him higher than Tialata...

 

[dan the man]

What I've never understood, is that he's a beast around the park, he's a fantastic scrimmager, he played prop for years, so why isn't he being used as prop who can at a stretch play hooker? I'm sure he's a better lineout thrower than Afoa, so it's all a bit odd and annoying.

Yeah!!! i'm a big fan of deMalmanche... and i wouldn't want to be propping up against him! He's a very versatile front rower and seemed to get dropped from the AB's for no good reason. I'd pick him well ahead of Elliot.
How about Jamie Mackintosh? can he play 1 and 3? if not he'll be an All Black after the 2011 World Cup and we lose half our top players

 

[Shaggy]

Yeah!!! i'm a big fan of deMalmanche... and i wouldn't want to be propping up against him! He's a very versatile front rower and seemed to get dropped from the AB's for no good reason. I'd pick him well ahead of Elliot.
How about Jamie Mackintosh? can he play 1 and 3? if not he'll be an All Black after the 2011 World Cup and we lose half our top players

I'm pretty sure MacIntosh is a specialist loosehead

 

[Larksea]

actually looking at what's left a loosehead maybe more important.

O-Franks = Tighthead
Woody = loosehead
Afoa = both sides mostly tighthead.

IMO ben franks was both sides but mostly in the squad as loosehead cover.

 

[TRF Mr Fish]

O Franks can play both sides.